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Thread: Bitrate limit

  1. #1
    Senior Member sle118's Avatar
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    Angry Bitrate limit

    Hello,

    In my network, I have multiple squeezebox receive, a duet remote and many slimp3 clients.

    I did setup bitrate limit of 128kbps for the slimp3 clients.
    when playing flac files, or high bandidth wma files, the slimp3 players are fine. When playing mp3, it seems that the rate limit is not applied because the player skips.

    anyone can help? what could be wrong?

    [edit]
    The problem that resampling was needed to get it down to 44100 on mp3 files extracted from DVD. Please see the posts below and help if you can.[/edit]
    Last edited by sle118; 2010-11-08 at 13:56. Reason: added update on problem

  2. #2
    Senior Member Soulkeeper's Avatar
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    Why do they skip; Is there something wrong with your network? Maybe the easiest/best approach would be to fix the bandwidth issues?

  3. #3
    Senior Member iPhone's Avatar
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    It would be a big help to tell us how and what your Network setup is all the way down to the Router model and brand. Tell us about the box you have SBS running on. Are you using an NAS or PC/Server? What OS?

    Specific is better then general.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member sle118's Avatar
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    Angry

    Quote Originally Posted by Soulkeeper View Post
    Why do they skip; Is there something wrong with your network? Maybe the easiest/best approach would be to fix the bandwidth issues?
    All the players are wired to a 100mbps switch, which is connected to the server's backbone (a gigabit switch). I tested a duet and it was in the green (100%) at up to 5000kbps. This is definitely not a network issue; all files are playing perfectly at high bit rates on duet receivers.

    In an attempt to understand the problem better, I looked at the transcoding commands from the log and found this

    mp3 transcoding to limit bitrate - skips every 5 seconds or so
    Code:
    Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::tokenizeConvertCommand2 (527) Using command for conversion: "C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\Bin\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread\lame.exe" --silent -q 4 -v -B 128 --mp3input "-" -
    flac transcoding - No Skipping
    Code:
    Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::tokenizeConvertCommand2 (527) Using command for conversion: "C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\Bin\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread\flac.exe" -dcs -- "C:\Users\Public\Music\FLAC\BLACKD~1\01-LOV~1.FLA" | "C:\PROGRA~2\SQUEEZ~1\server\Bin\MSWin32-x86-multi-thread\lame.exe" --silent -q 4 -v -B 128 - - |
    The computer is a running on an Intel i3 machine with Windows 7 64 bits. I launched lame on one of the mp3 files that skips and the 5 minutes song file got converted in 10 seconds. Next, I played the output file on the local machine and there it didn`t skip.

    The faulty players are older rio receivers retrofitted with slimrio (found here http://empeg.org.uk/slimrio/audio.html). It seems I have narrowed the problem down to the fact that madplay is unable to decode some files in realtime on that platform.

    Anyone has another suggestion to try troubleshooting this?

    Why would a FLAC transcode be easier to decode than a transcoded mp3 file?

    Are there switches in the lame command that I could force to make the file easier decode read at comparable bitrates?

    Any help would be very much appreciated...
    Last edited by sle118; 2010-11-08 at 07:33. Reason: added duet network test results

  5. #5
    Senior Member iPhone's Avatar
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    If all the players are wired, why are you bit limiting anything? Why are you converting anything?

    If its required by the SlimRIO, then there is your problem.

    Seems like a good reason to justify buying some Receivers or some new Touch Squeezeboxes. This makes it an all Squeezebox system.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member sle118's Avatar
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    Exclamation transcoding does not work?

    After further examination of the logs, I found the following error:

    Code:
    [10-11-08 13:10:20.6598] Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::enabledFormat (199) Checking to see if mp3-mp3-transcode-* is enabled
    [10-11-08 13:10:20.6599] Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::checkBin (240)    enabled
    [10-11-08 13:10:20.6601] Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::checkBin (242)   Found command: [lame] --silent -q $QUALITY$ -v $BITRATE$ $RESAMPLE$ --mp3input $FILE$ -
    [10-11-08 13:10:20.6603] Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::getConvertCommand2 (366) Rejecting [lame] --silent -q $QUALITY$ -v $BITRATE$ $RESAMPLE$ --mp3input $FILE$ - because required capability T not supported: 
    [10-11-08 13:10:20.6605] Slim::Player::TranscodingHelper::getConvertCommand2 (421) Error: Didn't find any command matches for type: mp3
    Does this indicate that mp3 files aren't actually transcoded and thus are sent at 320kbps to the poor player which chokes on them?

    Why is the T switch required?

  7. #7
    Senior Member sle118's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iPhone View Post
    If all the players are wired, why are you bit limiting anything? Why are you converting anything?

    If its required by the SlimRIO, then there is your problem.

    Seems like a good reason to justify buying some Receivers or some new Touch Squeezeboxes. This makes it an all Squeezebox system.
    I already have a few duets in the system and right now my budget is limited for buying 4 additional receivers (why would a single receiver still be so expensive?).

    The rio boxes I am using need bitrate limiting and it looks like this may be failing (see my other post).

    Anyone can provide technical assistance?

  8. #8
    Senior Member sle118's Avatar
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    Exclamation Resample needed

    After further testing, I found out that the slimrio system doesn't support well sampling frequencies above 44khz and that the faulty mp3's had a higher frequency because I extracted them from one of my DVD.

    I added the following line in custom-convert.conf
    Code:
    mp3 mp3 slimp3 *
    	# IFB:{BITRATE=%B}D:{RESAMPLE=--resample %D}
        [lame] --mp3input --resample 44100 --silent -q $QUALITY$ --abr $BITRATE$ $FILE$ -
    this basically forced the resample to 44khz. That almost worked. However, Squeezebox is complaining about the unsupported 'T' switch.

    So I faked the following "T" switch below
    Code:
    mp3 mp3 slimp3 *
    	# IFB:{BITRATE=%B}D:{RESAMPLE=--resample %D}T:{START=--quiet}
        [lame] --mp3input --resample 44100 --silent -q $QUALITY$ --abr $BITRATE$ $FILE$ -
    And it worked !

    No more skipping!

    the last questions are now:
    1- how would I get rid of the 'T' switch requirement for that custom mp3->mp3 transcode
    2- Is it possible to set the %D value (sample rate/sec) to 44100 for some players? It seems that this switch alone, which is present in the base transcode line could have prevented the problem in the first place...

    anyone can help me at this point?

  9. #9
    Senior Member Phil Leigh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sle118 View Post
    After further testing, I found out that the slimrio system doesn't support well sampling frequencies above 44khz and that the faulty mp3's had a higher frequency because I extracted them from one of my DVD.

    I added the following line in custom-convert.conf
    Code:
    mp3 mp3 slimp3 *
    	# IFB:{BITRATE=%B}D:{RESAMPLE=--resample %D}
        [lame] --mp3input --resample 44100 --silent -q $QUALITY$ --abr $BITRATE$ $FILE$ -
    this basically forced the resample to 44khz. That almost worked. However, Squeezebox is complaining about the unsupported 'T' switch.

    So I faked the following "T" switch below
    Code:
    mp3 mp3 slimp3 *
    	# IFB:{BITRATE=%B}D:{RESAMPLE=--resample %D}T:{START=--quiet}
        [lame] --mp3input --resample 44100 --silent -q $QUALITY$ --abr $BITRATE$ $FILE$ -
    And it worked !

    No more skipping!

    the last questions are now:
    1- how would I get rid of the 'T' switch requirement for that custom mp3->mp3 transcode
    2- Is it possible to set the %D value (sample rate/sec) to 44100 for some players? It seems that this switch alone, which is present in the base transcode line could have prevented the problem in the first place...

    anyone can help me at this point?
    If you study the bottom of convert.conf you will find an example where the MAC address of a specific player is used to override a default convert.conf entry for a specific player.

    Of course, you won't be able to sync players that need different bitrates, because there is only one stream used by all players that are synced...
    You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal...
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  10. #10
    Senior Member sle118's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Leigh View Post
    If you study the bottom of convert.conf you will find an example where the MAC address of a specific player is used to override a default convert.conf entry for a specific player.
    Making the change generic to slimp3 was my intent. This is because I have 4 of these devices on my network and no other slimp3 devices.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Leigh View Post
    Of course, you won't be able to sync players that need different bitrates, because there is only one stream used by all players that are synced...
    This is intersting to know...

    Now the real question is: why is the server forcing a conversion that have a 'T' (can seek to a start time offset) capability? I would rather not have that dirty fix in the conversion settings...

    thank you!
    Last edited by sle118; 2010-11-11 at 06:02.

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