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  1. #11
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    18350

    BTW, you could use these 18350 as well for a 2-cells configuration, they might fit exactly the PCB size and provide a bit more capacity than 16340
    LMS 7.7, 7.8 and 7.9 - 5xRadio, 3xBoom, 4xDuet, 1xTouch, 1 SB2. Sonos PLAY:3, PLAY:5, Marantz NR1603, JBL OnBeat, XBoxOne, XBMC, Foobar2000, ShairPortW, JRiver 21, 2xChromecast Audio, Chromecast v1 and v2, , Pi B3, B2, Pi B+, 2xPi A+, Odroid-C1, Odroid-C2, Cubie2, Yamaha WX-010, AppleTV 4, Airport Express, GGMM E5

  2. #12
    Senior Member chill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by philippe_44 View Post
    BTW, you could use these 18350 as well for a 2-cells configuration, they might fit exactly the PCB size and provide a bit more capacity than 16340
    Good tip, thank you. The 18mm diameter cells should fit rather well. And the 18350s seem to be around 1100mAh, so should last around 60% longer than the 700mAh 16340s (9x1100/700 = ~14hrs). I see there's also an 18490/18500 size, which I think should just squeeze into the base, and they seem to go up to 2000mAh, so might get around 24hrs. I'll have a go at making suitable inserts for the base later on.

    18350 on the left, 18500 on the right:

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by chill View Post
    Good tip, thank you. The 18mm diameter cells should fit rather well. And the 18350s seem to be around 1100mAh, so should last around 60% longer than the 700mAh 16340s (9x1100/700 = ~14hrs). I see there's also an 18490/18500 size, which I think should just squeeze into the base, and they seem to go up to 2000mAh, so might get around 24hrs. I'll have a go at making suitable inserts for the base later on.

    18350 on the left, 18500 on the right:
    You’re absolutely right, the 18500 is the best choice for 2 cells, I should have though about it already.

    So it seems that for 2 cells 2x18500 is optimal and for 3 cells 3x16340 is best, or can 3x18350 fit without increasing the case’s size?
    LMS 7.7, 7.8 and 7.9 - 5xRadio, 3xBoom, 4xDuet, 1xTouch, 1 SB2. Sonos PLAY:3, PLAY:5, Marantz NR1603, JBL OnBeat, XBoxOne, XBMC, Foobar2000, ShairPortW, JRiver 21, 2xChromecast Audio, Chromecast v1 and v2, , Pi B3, B2, Pi B+, 2xPi A+, Odroid-C1, Odroid-C2, Cubie2, Yamaha WX-010, AppleTV 4, Airport Express, GGMM E5

  4. #14
    Senior Member chill's Avatar
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    SqueezeAMP boxes

    Quote Originally Posted by philippe_44 View Post
    ...or can 3x18350 fit without increasing the case’s size?
    That might be possible, yes. It'll be a bit of a squeeze to fit the spring terminals in as well - the extra mm over the 16340s will take up all the spring travel - but soldering 3 flat-tops together would work. I was wrong about the 1100mAh capacity - if you use cells with built-in protection then some of the battery space is taken up with an internal PCB, so the capacity seems to be ~900mAh. Three of those will have about 30% extra capacity over the 3x16340s, so would be the best use of the space below the PCB footprint if 3 cells are needed. The 2x18500 option makes best use of the space though - roughly twice the energy storage of 3x16340, and ~50% more than 3x18350.
    Last edited by chill; 2019-10-06 at 11:11.

  5. #15
    Senior Member chill's Avatar
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    The 2x18500 version works well. The PCB footprint almost seems like it was designed with these in mind.



    I printed one out and installed some contacts. I have ordered a pair of the 18500 cells, and I don't want to post the STL file until I've checked that they fit.



    I'm not sure what to do about the 3x18350 option. I think it will be too much of a squeeze to use these sprung battery terminals, so I could simply shape the base to support three flat top cells, on the assumption that people will need to solder these together, but I haven't found any flat top 18350s with built in protection, so I don't know whether this is a good idea.

    The other option is to enlarge the base by a couple of mm, but then it loses the benefit of being the same size as the PCB footprint, and actually the bigger base for 3x18350 cells would end up with less capacity than the above 2x18500 configuration. It seems to me that if you want to use the most compact box, the 2x18500 option not only offers the best use of the space (mAh per box), but also has the benefit that it suits the 2-cell SqueezeAMP board, which allows a more common 12V supply and generates less heat. Philippe's advances with the 'boost version' may change this equation somewhat though.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by chill View Post
    The 2x18500 version works well. The PCB footprint almost seems like it was designed with these in mind.
    PCB size is just by luck, but this is really neat
    I'm not sure what to do about the 3x18350 option. I think it will be too much of a squeeze to use these sprung battery terminals, so I could simply shape the base to support three flat top cells, on the assumption that people will need to solder these together, but I haven't found any flat top 18350s with built in protection, so I don't know whether this is a good idea.

    The other option is to enlarge the base by a couple of mm, but then it loses the benefit of being the same size as the PCB footprint, and actually the bigger base for 3x18350 cells would end up with less capacity than the above 2x18500 configuration. It seems to me that if you want to use the most compact box, the 2x18500 option not only offers the best use of the space (mAh per box), but also has the benefit that it suits the 2-cell SqueezeAMP board, which allows a more common 12V supply and generates less heat. Philippe's advances with the 'boost version' may change this equation somewhat though.
    I'm using these 18350 https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1000...chweb201603_52 which I think have protection, although it's no obvious

    Having a 3x18350 in the other direction would be a really perfect option

    PS: I have a few 18500, if you can post the stl, I'll check how it fits
    LMS 7.7, 7.8 and 7.9 - 5xRadio, 3xBoom, 4xDuet, 1xTouch, 1 SB2. Sonos PLAY:3, PLAY:5, Marantz NR1603, JBL OnBeat, XBoxOne, XBMC, Foobar2000, ShairPortW, JRiver 21, 2xChromecast Audio, Chromecast v1 and v2, , Pi B3, B2, Pi B+, 2xPi A+, Odroid-C1, Odroid-C2, Cubie2, Yamaha WX-010, AppleTV 4, Airport Express, GGMM E5

  7. #17
    Senior Member chill's Avatar
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    The 2x18500 STL is attached below. Do you have some of those battery terminals? If not, then to check the fit I expect the cells should tuck underneath the supports by about 1mm at each end. If you do have some terminals, the sprung terminal (negative) should go in the end with the longer supports.

    I'll see if I can find some more compact battery terminals (folded spring steel perhaps instead of a coiled spring), to increase the space - 1mm would be enough to allow 3x18350 cells.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  8. #18
    Senior Member chill's Avatar
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    Oops - I posted a version with the side entry for the battery connections, which makes no sense for a box that holds batteries below.

    Here's one without the side entry.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  9. #19
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    18350

    It would be a very tight fit, but with these flat lead cells, it might work

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    LMS 7.7, 7.8 and 7.9 - 5xRadio, 3xBoom, 4xDuet, 1xTouch, 1 SB2. Sonos PLAY:3, PLAY:5, Marantz NR1603, JBL OnBeat, XBoxOne, XBMC, Foobar2000, ShairPortW, JRiver 21, 2xChromecast Audio, Chromecast v1 and v2, , Pi B3, B2, Pi B+, 2xPi A+, Odroid-C1, Odroid-C2, Cubie2, Yamaha WX-010, AppleTV 4, Airport Express, GGMM E5

  10. #20
    Senior Member chill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by philippe_44 View Post
    It would be a very tight fit, but with these flat lead cells, it might work

    Name:  IMG_5165.jpg
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    Without enlarging the case I think the only way those cells would work is if they are soldered together. The photo gives the impression that there's barely room for the wires! I've made a bare case, with contours to locate the cells, but it seems like integral terminals would make it too tight.



    In this version the cells are at 19mm centres, which is the maximum possible with this case size. This will allow for the cells being slightly bigger than the nominal dimensions. If soldering them together, the attached zip also contains an STL file for the bare contoured base (the orange part), so that the cells can be aligned at the right spacing while soldering.

    Philippe - I think you mentioned elsewhere that you have made your own cell packs by soldering. Can I ask how you do that? Are the flat tops tinned already, and is a soldering iron sufficient, or does the cell act as a heat sink to make it difficult to heat up? Is it dangerous to heat a lithium cell sufficiently to solder?

    EDIT: Attachment added.
    Attached Files Attached Files

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