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  1. #1
    jvromans@squirrel.nl
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    Programmable remotes

    If you have several devices to control and get tired of trying to find the
    correct remote, a programmable general purpose remote may be a solution.

    Not surprisingly, Logitech seems to be a market leader in programmable
    remote controls. Personally I have worked with a 535 and a 650.

    However when it comes to more complex set-ups, the programming facilities
    of these remotes fall short. I'm quite confident that the device is
    powerful enough, but the Logitech tools are way too limited.

    So I have some questions.

    1. Are there better tools to program a Logitech remote?

    2. Are there accessible people that can tell me more than the super
    friendly yet limited knowledged customer service?

    3. Are there better remotes than the Logitech?

    4. Why can't we do this from an Android phone or so?

    -- Johan

  2. #2
    Babelfish's Best Boy mherger's Avatar
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    Programmable remotes

    > However when it comes to more complex set-ups, the programming facilities
    > of these remotes fall short. I'm quite confident that the device is
    > powerful enough, but the Logitech tools are way too limited.


    When it comes to "better tools", we'd need to know what you're looking
    for. Keep in mind that those remote controls are working over IR - which
    is one way only. They cannot receive information from the device, but
    only tell it what to do. If require more than one way, then any IR
    remote isn't the right thing.

    --

    Michael

  3. #3
    Senior Member SlimChances's Avatar
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    • Version: 7.9.2 - 1562753347 @ Wed Jul 10 12:46:39 CEST 2019
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    One SB Touch connected by Ethernet - Denon AVR -1912 Receiver, Paradigm 4.1 speakers
    SB Classic connected by Ethernet to FX Audio D802C amp and Sinclair bookshelf speakers
    Two SB Radios wireless

  4. #4
    jvromans@squirrel.nl
    Guest

    Programmable remotes

    On Wed, 5 Jun 2019 23:34:00 +0200, Michael Herger <slim (AT) herger (DOT) net> wrote:

    > When it comes to "better tools", we'd need to know what you're looking
    > for.


    Very simple: I want to be able to specify what is sent or not.

    For example my current problem, TV input (AV) selection. When the TV is
    powered on, it is not known what input is currently selected. Also, the TV
    only has commands to switch AV up and down.

    The STB is connected to TV input EXT-2. When the STB is powered on, it
    forces the TV to select EXT-2. This is quite common, and it is good, since
    we now know what AV the TV is on. When switching to another source, e.g. a
    media player on EXT-6, we can send the appropriate number of "switch AV up"
    or "switch AV down" commands to select the input for the media player.

    However, the current Logitech tools do not provide a means to program this.

    I can program that the STB needs EXT-2. Then the remote will send "switch AV
    up/down" commands to the TV to select EXT-2 based on whatever it thinks the
    current input is, thus actually moving away from EXT-2.

    If I program that the STB needs no AV selection, then it will still not
    know that the input is now EXT-2 and it will fail to select EXT-6 when I
    switch to the media player.

    You can say that the TV is stupid (that's right) and that the STB is
    stupid (also right), but the only thing I can do is use a 'smart' remote...

    -- Johan

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    104
    Seems that you don't use activitys
    Set up right every activity know all devices and all input/output settings needed for them to work

    Been using harmony remotes for almost 15 years and the latest is harmony hub + companion remote
    1 x Touch
    1 x Radio
    1 x Harman Kardon Citation One
    Logitech Media Server Version: 7.9.2 - 0020.1557815622 @ Tue May 14 08:51:56 CEST 2019
    Castbridge
    Squeeze Ctrl
    Squeeze Player
    Phone: Samsung Galaxy Note 8

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    119
    Quote Originally Posted by jvromans@squirrel.nl View Post
    I can program that the STB needs EXT-2. Then the remote will send "switch AV
    up/down" commands to the TV to select EXT-2 based on whatever it thinks the
    current input is, thus actually moving away from EXT-2.

    If I program that the STB needs no AV selection, then it will still not
    know that the input is now EXT-2 and it will fail to select EXT-6 when I
    switch to the media player.
    You could switch the TV off before switching it on again to have consistent state. Not very nice, but I doubt you'll find anything else that works in this scenario (besides a custom software solution).

  7. #7
    Babelfish's Best Boy mherger's Avatar
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    Programmable remotes

    >> When it comes to "better tools", we'd need to know what you're looking
    >> for.

    >
    > Very simple: I want to be able to specify what is sent or not.
    >
    > For example my current problem, TV input (AV) selection. When the TV is
    > powered on, it is not known what input is currently selected. Also, the TV
    > only has commands to switch AV up and down.


    There's no way to know this, is there? As I said those devices are all
    one way. How would _anything_ know what your TV is set to? In this model
    you have to stick with a system: use the Harmony (or whatever) and that
    device only. Only in this case you can guarantee that the controller is
    aware of what currently is selected.

    > The STB is connected to TV input EXT-2. When the STB is powered on, it
    > forces the TV to select EXT-2. This is quite common, and it is good, since
    > we now know what AV the TV is on. When switching to another source, e.g. a
    > media player on EXT-6, we can send the appropriate number of "switch AV up"
    > or "switch AV down" commands to select the input for the media player.
    >
    > However, the current Logitech tools do not provide a means to program this.


    But that's pretty much what Harmony is all about. I have various
    activities defined. And depending on what activity I choose Harmony
    would wake up my media center PC, connect to the AppleTV and select the
    correct input on the TV etc.

    > I can program that the STB needs EXT-2. Then the remote will send "switch AV
    > up/down" commands to the TV to select EXT-2 based on whatever it thinks the
    > current input is, thus actually moving away from EXT-2.


    This is only true for devices which don't have distinct IR codes for the
    various inputs etc. This is NOT a Harmony limitation. In my case (a
    Samsung TV) I can tell the remote what exact input to activate. In an
    older TV set I had the same limitation as you describe: it could only
    flip through the inputs in a relative way (next, next; back).

    --

    Michael

  8. #8
    jvromans@squirrel.nl
    Guest

    Programmable remotes

    On Thu, 6 Jun 2019 08:48:44 +0000, T-bird
    <T-bird.917o9b (AT) no-mx (DOT) forums.slimdevices.com> wrote:

    > Seems that you don't use activitys


    Oh yes, I do.

    > Set up right every activity know all devices and all input/output
    > settings needed for them to work


    Sure, but only as long as there is nothing that disrupts the settings.

  9. #9
    jvromans@squirrel.nl
    Guest

    Programmable remotes

    On Thu, 6 Jun 2019 08:52:26 +0000, pputzer
    <pputzer.917ofz (AT) no-mx (DOT) forums.slimdevices.com> wrote:

    > You could switch the TV off before switching it on again to have
    > consistent state.


    Even then there will be no consistent state.

    The only way I have been able (so far) to get a consistent state is by
    physically powering on (not standby resume!) the STB. This will force the TV
    to select EXT-2. But I cannot tell the remote that the input is now EXT-2.

  10. #10
    jvromans@squirrel.nl
    Guest

    Programmable remotes

    On Thu, 6 Jun 2019 10:53:21 +0200, Michael Herger <slim (AT) herger (DOT) net> wrote:

    > How would _anything_ know what your TV is set to?


    Exactly. But as I wrote in another message, it *is* possible to get a
    consistent and defined state: by powering off/on the STB. And since we
    start by physically powering on all devices the state is consistent.

    > In this model you have to stick with a system: use the Harmony (or
    > whatever) and that device only. Only in this case you can guarantee that
    > the controller is aware of what currently is selected.


    Exactly.

    > This is only true for devices which don't have distinct IR codes for the
    > various inputs etc.


    Exactly. When I need to buy a new TV I will definitely pay attention to
    this.

    > This is NOT a Harmony limitation.


    Don't get me wrong, I love the Harmonies. I have several of them.

    It is just this frustration that I cannot get my fingers inside the Harmony
    code .

    > In my case (a Samsung TV) I can tell the remote what exact input to
    > activate. In an older TV set I had the same limitation as you describe:
    > it could only flip through the inputs in a relative way (next, next;
    > back).


    Yes. Many devices have this limitation, and also a power toggle instead
    of distinct power up / power down codes.

    It would be nice if it were possible to query the Harmony database of
    devices to find out what a new-to-buy tv supports.

    -- Johan

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