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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by mherger View Post
    > I might have missed something: as far as I understand, in order to use
    > Deezer or Tidal with LMS, you need to rely on mysqueezebox.com, right?
    > I have skipped the mysqueezebox.com in my current LMS install/settings
    > as I prefer to be totally independent of mysqueezebox.com that might
    > shut down sooner or later.


    Isn't it ironic?...

    --

    Michael
    Well I would say it's sad/scary :-). With Ickstream gone, there is no more Tidal/Deezer integration when Msb.com will be shutting down.
    I understand the structure of Deezer/Tidal API is different than the one of Qobuz and needs the framework of a platform to integrated?
    Transporter + Cambridge Audio 651R + Q Acoustics Concept 40 --- Touch + Onkyo TX-SR309 + Morel Applause MKII --- SB2, SB3, Duet, 2 Boom, 7 Radios --- Ipeng --- LMS 7.9.2 - 1537430919 / Max2Play --- Qobuz

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by didjean View Post
    Well I would say it's sad/scary :-). With Ickstream gone, there is no more Tidal/Deezer integration when Msb.com will be shutting down.
    I understand the structure of Deezer/Tidal API is different than the one of Qobuz and needs the framework of a platform to integrated?
    The more people that use mysqueezebox.com means it is more likely to continue. If everyone disconnected from it then it would definitely shut down.

    Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

  3. #23
    Babelfish's Best Boy mherger's Avatar
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    ickStream Shutdown

    > Well I would say it's sad/scary :-). With Ickstream gone, there is no
    > more Tidal/Deezer integration when Msb.com will be shutting down.


    The irony I mentioned is that you're asking for an alternative for what
    is there, because that working thing might go away... and all of this in
    a thread which announced the shutdown of the alternative. Why don't you
    just use what is there as long as it lasts?

    > I understand the structure of Deezer/Tidal API is different than the one
    > of Qobuz and needs the framework of a platform to integrated?


    It's just that they're a bit less generous when it comes to handing out
    information and necessary access to their servers.

    --

    Michael

  4. #24
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    Ok you have a point and understand your point of view Michael: why not use what works.

    But since I felt in love with Squeezebox in 2005, I have always been reluctant to use msb.com (or SqueezeNetwork at the time) as radio streams were more stable using the server. Now that the server can easily be installed on a Raspberry Pi and can be left on 24/7 for minimal costs, I decided to totally drop msb as I don't have needs for it.

    Personally, I am a happy camper with the existing Qobuz plugin and your great updates :-). I am not looking at moving to Deezer nor Tidal. It's just that I am still recommending and helping installing Squeezebox solutions for friends. I just want to have a clear view on what is feasible or not.

    Can Tidal and Deezer via Msb stream in Lossless?

    Cheers!
    Transporter + Cambridge Audio 651R + Q Acoustics Concept 40 --- Touch + Onkyo TX-SR309 + Morel Applause MKII --- SB2, SB3, Duet, 2 Boom, 7 Radios --- Ipeng --- LMS 7.9.2 - 1537430919 / Max2Play --- Qobuz

  5. #25
    Babelfish's Best Boy mherger's Avatar
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    ickStream Shutdown

    > Can Tidal and Deezer via Msb stream in Lossless?

    Tidal: yes, Deezer: no.


    --

    Michael

  6. #26
    Senior Member pippin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by didjean View Post
    I understand the structure of Deezer/Tidal API is different than the one of Qobuz and needs the framework of a platform to integrated?
    The problem is that with an open source server, if they support an open plugin, the services essentially have to give away an API key to the public.
    What that means for them is, if somebody does something they deem critical with that key, the only option they have is to revoke the key and that means they shut down the service for all their users of the whole platform.
    Everybody then would have to update the server or plugin, a lot of people probably wouldn't even understand what's happening.

    With setups like MySB or ickStream, even if things go awry, they can easily change the key together with the operator because it's only being used in a single place, not on tens of thousands of machines.

    In addition to this, some services keep their API secret and require an NDA, in this case you can't distribute the code at all.
    ---
    learn more about iPeng, the iPhone and iPad remote for the Squeezebox and
    Logitech UE Smart Radio as well as iPeng Party, the free Party-App,
    at penguinlovesmusic.com
    New: iPeng 9, the Universal App for iPhone, iPad and Apple Watch

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by pippin View Post
    The problem is that with an open source server, if they support an open plugin, the services essentially have to give away an API key to the public.
    I disagree. Plenty of companies - from giants like Google to small outfits like Schedules Direct, fully publish APIs but rely on individual customers to pay for API keys or other authentication credentials.

    Quote Originally Posted by pippin View Post
    In addition to this, some services keep their API secret and require an NDA, in this case you can't distribute the code at all.
    Unfortunately true. I see a big split in business models. On the one side, outfits that guard APIs behind armies of sales teams vying for big dollar contacts; on the other, outfits like Amazon Web Services that will accept pretty much anybody with a credit card and are plenty willing to serve tiny customers like me who are billed only fractions of a dollar each month. I hope all will migrate to the latter model...
    owner of the stuff at https://tuxreborn.netlify.com/
    (which used to reside at www.tux.org/~peterw/)
    Note: The best way to reach me is email or PM, as I don't spend much time on the forums.
    Free plugins: AllQuiet Auto Dim/AutoDisplay BlankSaver ContextMenu DenonSerial
    FuzzyTime KidsPlay KitchenTimer PlayLog PowerCenter/BottleRocket SaverSwitcher
    SettingsManager SleepFade StatusFirst SyncOptions VolumeLock

  8. #28
    Senior Member pippin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peterw View Post
    I disagree. Plenty of companies - from giants like Google to small outfits like Schedules Direct, fully publish APIs but rely on individual customers to pay for API keys or other authentication credentials.
    All of these companies are masters of their own fate. Music streaming services usually aren't. They have agreements with rights owners about how they have to secure content and most of these tend to be on the more ridiculous side of things.
    When we started ickStream, I too though this would somehow be about technology....

    The issue is not so much the authentication credential - that's done through the user account.
    The problem is having an API key open to the public. I'm not aware of anyone allowing this if there is one.
    There are a lot of cases here where it's done, but most of them (like the YouTube plugin etc.) essentially violate some T&Cs.

    Of course, you COULD handle this but it requires user action. The user would have to get an API key/authenticate etc. and these APIs are meant for vendors, not users.

    Unfortunately true. I see a big split in business models. .... I hope all will migrate to the latter model...
    It's not a deliberate choice in this case. And migrating to something that makes sense is usually not an option.

    Spotify has had some success in designing something that is both kind of open and works for them and getting that pushed down the throat of rights owners but overall this process has taken them soooo many years.... And they already have the strongest market position of anyone in the business.
    Last edited by pippin; 2019-04-23 at 19:04.
    ---
    learn more about iPeng, the iPhone and iPad remote for the Squeezebox and
    Logitech UE Smart Radio as well as iPeng Party, the free Party-App,
    at penguinlovesmusic.com
    New: iPeng 9, the Universal App for iPhone, iPad and Apple Watch

  9. #29
    Thanks, pippin, as always, for sharing your insight, and supporting this community.
    owner of the stuff at https://tuxreborn.netlify.com/
    (which used to reside at www.tux.org/~peterw/)
    Note: The best way to reach me is email or PM, as I don't spend much time on the forums.
    Free plugins: AllQuiet Auto Dim/AutoDisplay BlankSaver ContextMenu DenonSerial
    FuzzyTime KidsPlay KitchenTimer PlayLog PowerCenter/BottleRocket SaverSwitcher
    SettingsManager SleepFade StatusFirst SyncOptions VolumeLock

  10. #30
    Senior Member erland's Avatar
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    Sweden
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    Just for information to anyone still using ickStream Music Platform.

    As we indicated two months ago we have now permanently shutdown the ickStream servers.

    At the moment there are no plans to start the ickStream service again but if your company still feels the need to use some of our technology or has the need for or interest in a continued service, please feel free to contact us, we are open for all kind of options including licensing, sale of our technology or the ickStream GmbH company.
    Last edited by erland; 2019-05-31 at 21:54.
    Erland Isaksson (My homepage)
    Lead platform developer of ickStream Music Platform - A world of music at your fingertips

    (Also developer of many plugins/applets)

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