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  1. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcduman View Post
    i guess we are all curious to know more about archimago's magical "extremus filter", a squeezelite recipe that goes like "v::3.05:28:99.7:100:45". (http://archimago.blogspot.com/2018/1...3-b-touch.html)
    45 at the end here is the phase response, a manual setting between minimum and linear, which the c-3po plugin does not currently support.

    i tired these settings with squeezelite and did not really care for them. but i am a big believer in server side transcoding/resampling and would like to try the above recipe with c-3po. i am getting phenomenal results with the -h option, which in my experience, is the real secret sauce but i am looking forward to hearing marco's comments as to how to implement (or approximate) this brick wall filter using c-3po

    In sox you could use the -p option to use a 'custom' phase, so in C-3PO you could:

    a. disable resampling for the codec in use.

    b. add something like: "rate -v -p 45 -a -b 90.7 192000" to the Additional effects AFTER resampling slot.

    Please double check the resulting command.

    It works to me, sure is not as powerfull as a specific option in C-3PO GUI, but...

    I'll add the option in a future release, please open a request here: https://github.com/marcoc1712/C-3PO/issues, just to remind me I'll have to do it...
    __________________________________________________ ______________________
    Author of C-3PO plugin, Squeezelite-R2, Falcon Web interface - See www.marcoc1712.it

  2. #292
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcoc1712 View Post
    STDIN is mandatory for QOBUZ and other plugins, not for local files playback, but you need one of STDIN/SEARCH to be enabled.


    No, at moment you could not select a different output sample rate based on different codecs.


    It depends on the player. If Squeezelite compiled with DSD option DSDPlay shoul only pass thought, BUT via DOP (max DSD64). Some squeezelite versions (Squeezelite-R2 and even new versions form Ralphy) could play native DSD, but in order to take advantage of it you MUST disable DSDPlay.


    Hope is clear enough, please forgive my english, as usual.
    English is great. C-3PO is great. Thank you.

    I am still finding issues in my setup and I thought you would want to know.

    Seek vs stdlin
    Im not using streaming at all just playing files from disc. Checking only Enable Seek, no FLAC will play. I don't use cue sheets, does this mean I have to have cue sheets to play when this is set? is this the reason why nothing plays?
    The track shows in the player but playback stays on zero and never starts. The only way to play files off disc is to enable 'stdlin'. When this is set FLAC will play but all data rates regardless of them being based on 44.1 kHz or 48, they all play at the maximum sample rate and do not play at closest synchronous rate.

    It would be so good to not use stdlin (without cue sheets) but it seems as though I have to. Just checked this with DSD files as well, I have to have stdlin checked for all file types or they don't play.

    (And I don't need different output sample rates for different formats, just have PCM formats play at 705k if they are based on 44.1k, and 768k if they are based on 48khz.)

    Also are these settings mutually exclusive? that both don't work at once? Could radio buttons be used instead of checkboxes??

  3. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
    OK. Finally: Flexible phase adjustments are not supported (yet?).
    Thx for the feedback.

    I think it would be nice if C-3PO would offer a simple free configurable field
    to be able to tailor a complete sox "effect" string.
    (That would also make Marco's live easier on the long run. )

    It'd make the plugin much more flexible.
    mhhh...

    C-3PO does not have that specific option (yet), but you could use one of the Additional effects slot instead, as I reported in my previous comment, is that not you are looking for? Why?

    Please describe your mind in the github request, so I will find it easily when I'll found the time to work on it.


    Quote Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post

    comparison to squeezelite:

    C-3PO uses the sox binary and not libsoxr directly. That's limiting the plugin.
    squeezelite, using libsoxr, can offer a broader scope of resampling
    options as being offered by libsoxr.
    AFAIK, SOX isn't limited in respect to libsoxr, C-3PO is limited in the option it exposes, but you could easily override them, as explained.


    Quote Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post

    Beside that, using libsoxr directly would allow to run 64bit DSP.
    Are you sure of that? I was thinking SOX is running 64bit, actually.

    Quote Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
    Obviously DSD would be an issue. sox could still be used for special purposes.
    NOt only that, every and all the effects that are not in libsoxr.

    Quote Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
    Of course getting direct access to libsoxr would require to write a resampling application.
    That's not too difficult though. (Even I managed to write such an app ; ))
    Il looks strange, but SOX is not 'using' libsoxr by itself, they have two different code base and for many reason I found SOX a better choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post

    When it comes to the Archimago stuff.
    As much as I question most of his findings on numerous topics, he IMO got a point on the resampling part.
    I'm not saying that I consider his resampling config the best of all choices. He IMO is pointing into the right direction though.
    Don't forget resampling (or any other DSP) will always be a compromise.

    The main problem is, using squeezelite & resampling on a RPI is a NoGo.
    In my opiinion 'extreme' is too extreme. A filter starting at 99.7 and ending at 100% is too steep. Other than this, 3.05db are too little, I use 6db instead and -h option.

    I normally use Linear phase, but some recording sounds better with Intermediate or even Minimal, I agree, so 45% could make some difefrence.

    What I could really not understand in Archimago approach is that is looking at this littte things when denying the possibility of effects that produces much more difference in sound, just becouse he could not 'measure ' them, as the difference in doing conversion/resampling server side, for instance.
    __________________________________________________ ______________________
    Author of C-3PO plugin, Squeezelite-R2, Falcon Web interface - See www.marcoc1712.it

  4. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by HumanMedia View Post
    English is great. C-3PO is great. Thank you.

    I am still finding issues in my setup and I thought you would want to know.

    Seek vs stdlin
    Im not using streaming at all just playing files from disc. Checking only Enable Seek, no FLAC will play. I don't use cue sheets, does this mean I have to have cue sheets to play when this is set? is this the reason why nothing plays?
    The track shows in the player but playback stays on zero and never starts.
    Not at all! Cue are not needed. You should be able to play every flac file.
    Could you please share one of this files? (please send the link to to marcoc1712 at gmail dot com).


    Quote Originally Posted by HumanMedia View Post
    The only way to play files off disc is to enable 'stdlin'.
    When this is set FLAC will play but all data rates regardless of them being based on 44.1 kHz or 48, they all play at the maximum sample rate and do not play at closest synchronous rate.
    Yes, this is actually a limit of LMS.

    Quote Originally Posted by HumanMedia View Post
    It would be so good to not use stdlin (without cue sheets) but it seems as though I have to. Just checked this with DSD files as well, I have to have stdlin checked for all file types or they don't play.
    That's really strange, could you please enable debug logging for player source and plugin C-3PO and post the server log messages when this happen?

    Quote Originally Posted by HumanMedia View Post
    (And I don't need different output sample rates for different formats, just have PCM formats play at 705k if they are based on 44.1k, and 768k if they are based on 48khz.)
    This is already working like that, choosing Target sample rate is: "Closest synchronous supported" option BUT not when STDIN is enabled, see above.


    Quote Originally Posted by HumanMedia View Post
    Also are these settings mutually exclusive? that both don't work at once? Could radio buttons be used instead of checkboxes??
    No, thy are not exlusive, you could have both checked. GUI option in LMS are quite limited...

    EDIT: I was wrong, You could even select none of the two options, that way only single files will play. Sorry for that.
    Last edited by marcoc1712; 2019-02-11 at 06:11.
    __________________________________________________ ______________________
    Author of C-3PO plugin, Squeezelite-R2, Falcon Web interface - See www.marcoc1712.it

  5. #295
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    I saw that some of you guys seem to be using the sox multi-threaded switch.

    Let me contribute some benchmarking I did on my i5 NUC:

    w/o multithreading:

    Code:
    Performance counter stats for '/tmp/sox -t flac /tmp/test.flac -t wavpcm -b 24 /tmp/tmp.wav rate -v -b 90.4 -p 45 -a 352800':
    
              6.501,16 msec task-clock                #    1,000 CPUs utilized          
                    58      context-switches          #    8,922 M/sec                  
                     0      cpu-migrations            #    0,000 K/sec                  
                   710      page-faults               #  109,214 M/sec                  
        17.471.508.084      cycles                    # 2687510,857 GHz                 
        49.865.587.231      instructions              #    2,85  insn per cycle         
         3.663.382.219      branches                  # 563510570,528 M/sec             
            11.861.538      branch-misses             #    0,32% of all branches        
    
           6,502358582 seconds time elapsed
    
           6,098182000 seconds user
           0,402946000 seconds sys

    with multithreading:

    Code:
    Performance counter stats for '/tmp/sox --multi-threaded -t flac /tmp/test.flac -t wavpcm -b 24 /tmp/tmp.wav rate -v -b 90.4 -p 45 -a 352800':
    
             27.121,26 msec task-clock                #    3,955 CPUs utilized          
                   823      context-switches          #   30,345 M/sec                  
                    13      cpu-migrations            #    0,479 M/sec                  
                   764      page-faults               #   28,170 M/sec                  
        67.649.699.828      cycles                    # 2494365,983 GHz                 
        65.604.260.310      instructions              #    0,97  insn per cycle         
         8.144.344.634      branches                  # 300296620,110 M/sec             
            13.589.463      branch-misses             #    0,17% of all branches        
    
           6,857757586 seconds time elapsed
    
          26,580257000 seconds user
           0,542025000 seconds sys
    multithreading is not only a little - around 4% - slower (if we ignore the accumulated processing time >400% ). It uses 4 CPUs and ten thousands of extra cycles to achieve that.

    At least based on these results based on my real live resampling testcase I'd stay away from sox multithreading!

    Enjoy.

  6. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcoc1712 View Post

    In my opiinion 'extreme' is too extreme. A filter starting at 99.7 and ending at 100% is too steep. Other than this, 3.05db are too little, I use 6db instead and -h option.

    I normally use Linear phase, but some recording sounds better with Intermediate or even Minimal, I agree, so 45% could make some difefrence.

    What I could really not understand in Archimago approach is that is looking at this littte things when denying the possibility of effects that produces much more difference in sound, just becouse he could not 'measure ' them, as the difference in doing conversion/resampling server side, for instance.
    I'd like to chime in here - as I agree with Marco a lot. In particular that the Extremus filter is pushing it quite a lot. How about a compromise?

    Right now I'm using Squeezelite (libsox) with the following upsampling parameter string: (v::3.5:28:95:100:45)

    Cheers,
    Claus

  7. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcoc1712 View Post
    Not at all! Cue are not needed. You should be able to play every flac file.
    Could you please share one of this files? (please send the link to to marcoc1712 at gmail dot com).

    That's really strange, could you please enable debug logging for player source and plugin C-3PO and post the server log messages when this happen?
    I will get you a sample file in the next few days, however none of the FLAC, or DSD I tried would play from dozens of different albums, without stdlin enabled.

    I found what I think is the location of the server log as shown in Advanced Tab C-3PO Transcoding Helper page at the very bottom "Log File Position" but navigating to that folder there is no C-3PO.log, only perfmon.log, scanner.log and server.log. No C-3PO.log. Also how do enable player log? Does it have to be enabled for c-3PO log to appear?

    Something else I have noticed is that there is a library file for FAAD and FLAC, but for FFMPEG there is an error string "Not found. See Information, Helper Application Folder. " - could this be the problem?

  8. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by HumanMedia View Post
    I will get you a sample file in the next few days, however none of the FLAC, or DSD I tried would play from dozens of different albums, without stdlin enabled.

    I found what I think is the location of the server log as shown in Advanced Tab C-3PO Transcoding Helper page at the very bottom "Log File Position" but navigating to that folder there is no C-3PO.log, only perfmon.log, scanner.log and server.log. No C-3PO.log. Also how do enable player log? Does it have to be enabled for c-3PO log to appear?

    Something else I have noticed is that there is a library file for FAAD and FLAC, but for FFMPEG there is an error string "Not found. See Information, Helper Application Folder. " - could this be the problem?
    I'm looking for the server log, not C-3PO one (is created only under some specific circumstances).

    To enable player source log go to ADVANCED -> Logging -> (player.source) - Player Source Audio & Conversion Logging and set it to DEBUG.

    Please delete the server log file and restar LMS before doing that, so a frewh one will be created.

    FFMPEG is optional. If found in the system is used instead of FLAC to cut wav files, avoiding double conversion to and from flac, when using cue sheets, don't you care about that.

    Have you got some particular plugin installed?
    Could you please first post the C-3PO 'RESULTING COMMANDS" table?

    THX
    __________________________________________________ ______________________
    Author of C-3PO plugin, Squeezelite-R2, Falcon Web interface - See www.marcoc1712.it

  9. #299
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcoc1712 View Post
    I'm looking for the server log, not C-3PO one (is created only under some specific circumstances).

    To enable player source log go to ADVANCED -> Logging -> (player.source) - Player Source Audio & Conversion Logging and set it to DEBUG.

    Please delete the server log file and restar LMS before doing that, so a frewh one will be created.

    FFMPEG is optional. If found in the system is used instead of FLAC to cut wav files, avoiding double conversion to and from flac, when using cue sheets, don't you care about that.

    Have you got some particular plugin installed?
    Could you please first post the C-3PO 'RESULTING COMMANDS" table?

    THX
    Emailed log and resulting commands.

  10. #300
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    C-3PO on latest MacOS

    Any C-3PO users running on the latest macOS?

    I’m trying to track down my issue of seek setting not working for any file types. I’ve been sending logs to Marco to no avail and one variable that Marco cant reproduce, is running LMS/C-3POon the latest version of macOS as his machine is too old to run the latest.

    Note that there was increased security on plugins and extensions with the latest OS and many previously fine components now have to be manually given persmissions to run. MAYBE this is the cause, maybe not.

    In any case if anyone is running on the latest macOS and has seek working, as opposed to stdln (which works perfectly) please let us know! If it runs fine or needed some other settup or trick to get it working?

    Also if it is working, did you have it working first before upgrading to the macOS Mojave update, or did you install LMS/C-3PO on an already installed Mojave?

    Thanks for any help!
    Last edited by HumanMedia; Yesterday at 14:45.

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