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Thread: OraStream?

  1. #1
    Senior Member DanSmedra's Avatar
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    OraStream?

    "Today, people generally listen to music in MP3. For a decade, storage efficiency has been gained at the cost of nearly 90% of the original audio data on music CDs: all of which is lost through compression. This compression process is irreversible - once your music is compressed, it will never sound like the original. MP3 and variants like AAC and WMA are ôlossyö formats. By contrast, "lossless" formats like FLAC, Apple Lossless and AIFF retain a bit-identical 'zipped' version of the original music to ensure absolute music fidelity.

    "The state of the art streaming adopted by services like Spotify, Beats Music, Deezer and Qobuz (among many others) is up to 320kbps for lossy quality (MP3) and up to 1,411kbps for lossless CD quality (FLAC). The problem of delivering high quality music in a convenient way, requires a new solution: OraStream. Beyond MP3 and CD, OraStream was purposed and built from ground up to 'fluidify' the downloading and streaming of high-resolution music up to 9,216 kbps (or 192kHz/24-bit) over any data network.

    "OraStream uses a lossless compression algorithm. However, it has the unique advantage of transforming the compressed bitstream into fine-grained scalable layers while maintaining its 'losslessness'. We shave away data layers to fit the bitstream nicely through the available network bandwidth, without any expensive transcoding. This is the value of OraStream."


    Has anyone researched this yet?

    Will the Ultra Hi-Rez stream require use of the EDO plugin or not?

    Is anyone working on an OraStream plug-in for Squeezebox or IckStream?
    Source: TIDAL HiFi, Pandora One > MySqueezebox.com using iPeng 9.6 app on iPhone6s/iPad
    Great Room: SB Touch(1) > AudioQuest TOS > PS Audio DL3 DAC > Audio Envy 10' cables > 200w powered Martin Logan (ML) Purity speakers, SB Touch(2) >JVC 110w amp > ML Motion 4 & AudioEngine 5.
    Garage: SB Touch(3) > CullenCoax > Wyred mINT > Cullen Cables > ML Motion 12
    Carry Anywhere: TIDAL >iPhone 6s > Bose Mini BT speaker.
    Streaming Media: https://www.facebook.com/groups/535747176592597/

  2. #2
    Babelfish's Best Boy mherger's Avatar
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    OraStream?

    > "OraStream uses a lossless compression algorithm. However, it has the
    > unique advantage of transforming the compressed bitstream into
    > fine-grained scalable layers while maintaining its 'losslessness'. We


    From what I get that's the same 'losslessness' as the 128kbps MP3's
    claimed "CD quality". There's a reason why they put it in quotes: they
    shave off stuff they think you won't hear anyway. But it's a lossy
    process, not lossless. You could consider downsampling your hires file
    to CD quality "maintaining 'losslessness'" because you can't hear the
    difference anyway :-P.

    --

    Michael

  3. #3
    Senior Member Mnyb's Avatar
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    Piont seem to be to traffic shape when needed , you get the full Rez when your bandwith is up to it .

    But .

    Only a very limited amount of tracks at the moment .
    So it can't be a drop in replacement for any current streaming service due to the lack of program material .
    If there is nothing to listen to the quality does not matter .

    I can think of it as a complementary service to the ones I already have and to my own collection , but then the price must be lowered.

    There no piont going beyond > 16/44.1 for streaming . You can make extremely weak arguments for 24/96 as a consumer format for disc or download . 24/192 is just silly .

    And .

    There electronics track offerings are at 16/44.1 and the classical tracks are for the most 24/96 .

    Do you need EDO : probably not as most tracks are 24/96 or less even if an occasional 24/192 would show up LMS a would handle it trough downsampling ( yes I think direct mysqueezebox.com support is very unlikely ) .
    So basically the need of EDO a is determined by the need for USB audio and/or don't having a server capable of downsampling 192k or using DoP .
    And >96k demands external DAC as EDO won't make the squeezebox support 24/192 internally .

    But hey . They are also a store so if some of thier limited music offering suits you just buy the albums
    So my questions would be is there anyway to get to thier online store without forking out for a monthly subscription or is this subscription only .
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  4. #4
    Babelfish's Best Boy mherger's Avatar
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    OraStream?

    FWIW: they are using MPEG-4 SLS (aka. HD-AAC, see
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG-4_SLS for details). This codec
    delivers "best effort" quality, meaning that depending on the network
    connection you get lossless or some lossy quality. It's not lossless
    guaranteed.

    LMS comes with a sls utility which should transcode such streams to
    whatever you can play. Now somebody would need to come up with a plugin
    to give access to that service...

    --

    Michael

  5. #5
    Senior Member DanSmedra's Avatar
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    Thanks BBB/Mnyb

    Thanks BBB and Mnyb

    Is Meridian's MQA encapsulation process much the same approach?

    http://www.stereophile.com/content/i...-meridians-mqa
    Source: TIDAL HiFi, Pandora One > MySqueezebox.com using iPeng 9.6 app on iPhone6s/iPad
    Great Room: SB Touch(1) > AudioQuest TOS > PS Audio DL3 DAC > Audio Envy 10' cables > 200w powered Martin Logan (ML) Purity speakers, SB Touch(2) >JVC 110w amp > ML Motion 4 & AudioEngine 5.
    Garage: SB Touch(3) > CullenCoax > Wyred mINT > Cullen Cables > ML Motion 12
    Carry Anywhere: TIDAL >iPhone 6s > Bose Mini BT speaker.
    Streaming Media: https://www.facebook.com/groups/535747176592597/

  6. #6
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    MPEG4-SLS - scalable lossless audio encoding system

    For streaming, the OraStream (and ClassicsOnlineHD*LL" - a new CD- & HD-quality classical music service with more than 70,000 classical music albums, including 1,000 albums in 24-bit audio resolution) sites uses a MPEG Audio standard format known as MPEG-4 SLS. You would note that this codec is also called HD-AAC by its inventors. OraStream works with the Non-Core version (i.e. without the lossy-AAC core) of MPEG 4-SLS.

    The OraStream platform utilises the fine-grain, scalable audio layers of this lossless audio format to scale lossless and high-res audio streaming based on the quality of the user's network connection. When a user connects to our servers, the user's network connection is monitored continuously in real-time. When a user's connection is good, every layer of the bitstream is delivered for lossless audio playback. When the connection is poorer, the server removes some layers (via a bitstream truncation process that ensures optimal multi-channel distribution) to match the poorer connection.

    Network adaptive audio streaming is dynamic, in real-time and transparent to the user. Music streaming scales from 80 kbps to >5,500 kbps (compressed bitrate quality of 24/192 audio) so quality of service is assured in moderately congested 3G and public-WiFi network conditions. In super fast networks, quality of experience can be achieved with full lossless 24-bit audio streams.

    As MPEG-4 SLS applications include that of audio archival, the format handles PCM audio in resolutions up to 24bit depth/192kHz sampling frequency. Therefore, with a good connection, users can stream 16-bit, 44.1 kHz and any higher resolution up to 24-bit, 192 kHz audio quality on desktop PCs and mobile devices.

    Beside using different encoding methods, MQA encapsulation is carried out during encoding and MQA files are fixed bit-rate files. The smallest near CD- or CD-quality file (without MQA) requires about 1 Mbps connection to stream (with good QoS experience). The MQA files (of high-res audio recordings) are only about 50%-100% larger (for downloads). Notwithstanding, Meridian claims that MQA files are master-quality-authenticated (by artists, producers, sound engineers) to sound as the original studio recordings are intended or better.
    Last edited by orastream; 2015-01-31 at 22:48.

  7. #7
    Junior Member
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    The player is very buggy

    Quote Originally Posted by orastream View Post
    For streaming, the OraStream (and ClassicsOnlineHD*LL" - a new CD- & HD-quality classical music service with more than 70,000 classical music albums, including 1,000 albums in 24-bit audio resolution) sites uses a MPEG Audio standard format known as MPEG-4 SLS. You would note that this codec is also called HD-AAC by its inventors. OraStream works with the Non-Core version (i.e. without the lossy-AAC core) of MPEG 4-SLS.

    The OraStream platform utilises the fine-grain, scalable audio layers of this lossless audio format to scale lossless and high-res audio streaming based on the quality of the user's network connection. When a user connects to our servers, the user's network connection is monitored continuously in real-time. When a user's connection is good, every layer of the bitstream is delivered for lossless audio playback. When the connection is poorer, the server removes some layers (via a bitstream truncation process that ensures optimal multi-channel distribution) to match the poorer connection.

    Network adaptive audio streaming is dynamic, in real-time and transparent to the user. Music streaming scales from 80 kbps to >5,500 kbps (compressed bitrate quality of 24/192 audio) so quality of service is assured in moderately congested 3G and public-WiFi network conditions. In super fast networks, quality of experience can be achieved with full lossless 24-bit audio streams.

    As MPEG-4 SLS applications include that of audio archival, the format handles PCM audio in resolutions up to 24bit depth/192kHz sampling frequency. Therefore, with a good connection, users can stream 16-bit, 44.1 kHz and any higher resolution up to 24-bit, 192 kHz audio quality on desktop PCs and mobile devices.

    Beside using different encoding methods, MQA encapsulation is carried out during encoding and MQA files are fixed bit-rate files. The smallest near CD- or CD-quality file (without MQA) requires about 1 Mbps connection to stream (with good QoS experience). The MQA files (of high-res audio recordings) are only about 50%-100% larger (for downloads). Notwithstanding, Meridian claims that MQA files are master-quality-authenticated (by artists, producers, sound engineers) to sound as the original studio recordings are intended or better.
    I have had a lot of problems with the Orastream player. Despite having a greater than 55 MBPS connection, the player frequently downsamples to mp3 quality. It refers to this as cache play. However, it never adapts, as it seems to stay in mp3 quality forever once it gets there.

    The selection of music is good. However, the problems with the player make it unlikely I will continue with this service long term.

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