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Bert57
2013-04-19, 11:52
During tagging I misspelled Acoustic as Accoustic while tagging an album (CSNY, Demos). I have since corrected the mistake using mp3tag but when I go to genre in LMS the "accoustic" tag is still there with the album. Even though I have corrected the tag for the album to be Acoustic the album only shows only under the genre Accoustic.

There are a couple of other misspelled genre tags that I would like to delete along with accoustic but I have been unable to find a way to delete these genre tags.

Have cleared and rescanned 3 times thinking the scan might just have missed the change but no luck. Checked the tags with mp3tag extended tags and it looks right. Also checked with foobar 2000 and again seemed ok.

Any suggestions of what to try?

Thanks
Steve

garym
2013-04-19, 12:07
During tagging I misspelled Acoustic as Accoustic while tagging an album (CSNY, Demos). I have since corrected the mistake using mp3tag but when I go to genre in LMS the "accoustic" tag is still there with the album. Even though I have corrected the tag for the album to be Acoustic the album only shows only under the genre Accoustic.

There are a couple of other misspelled genre tags that I would like to delete along with accoustic but I have been unable to find a way to delete these genre tags.

Have cleared and rescanned 3 times thinking the scan might just have missed the change but no luck. Checked the tags with mp3tag extended tags and it looks right. Also checked with foobar 2000 and again seemed ok.

Any suggestions of what to try?

Thanks
Steve

Have you done a "clear and rescan"? Doing a "new and changed" won't pick up the tag change you've made.

Bert57
2013-04-20, 07:04
"clear and rescan"
Have done 4 complete.
Have looked for tag "accoustic" with mp3tag and foobar. It doesn't show anywhere. Seems to be just in LMS. Surely there is a way to get rid of it. Where, within LMS would it be stored?
Thanks
Steve

garym
2013-04-20, 07:07
"clear and rescan"
Have done 4 complete.
Have looked for tag "accoustic" with mp3tag and foobar. It doesn't show anywhere. Seems to be just in LMS. Surely there is a way to get rid of it. Where, within LMS would it be stored?
Thanks
Steve

hmmm, LMS just reads the tags from the files. It then creates a database with this info, but a clear and rescan should rebuild the database. Are you saying that a particular track/album had acoustic before then you changed that genre tag, did a rescan, and the tracks still show as the old "acoustic" genre when you look at it in LMS?

and are you sure you don't have two genre tags in the same file (I do this on purpose in some FLAC files). They don't both show up in mp3tag unless you setup your column field name properly. But you can right click the file(s) and select extended tags to see whether there are more than one genre fields in the file.

p.s. right click on column headings in mp3tag. choose customize, then in the genre heading, use this as value:
$meta(genre)
also use this as value for ARTIST
$meta(artist)

this way, if there are multiple values for artist or genre, they will both show up in the mp3tag listing (with a comma in between)

Mnyb
2013-04-20, 07:18
If a file has several tag formats it could have different content in the different tags .

In mp3tag if a file has flac and id3v1 for example .

But this should also show in the extended tag menu .

If you want to nuke the dB completely you could clear LMS cache folder, then the all dB files disappears completely and are not only emptied and rewritten .

garym
2013-04-20, 07:23
If a file has several tag formats it could have different content in the different tags .

In mp3tag if a file has flac and id3v1 for example .

But this should also show in the extended tag menu .

If you want to nuke the dB completely you could clear LMS cache folder, then the all dB files disappears completely and are not only emptied and rewritten .

ahh, good point. I wasn't thinking about multiple tag types on same file. with mp3, could have APE, id3v2 and id3v1 all in one file. And foobar2000 would not read them all for example. Not sure, but seems that mp3tag can't see the id3 tag within a FLAC file, but must be other programs that can.....

DJanGo
2013-04-20, 08:04
Not sure, but seems that mp3tag can't see the id3 tag within a FLAC file, but must be other programs that can.....

Hi,

nonsense....

mp3tag can v1 and v2 and ape also.

Use Options in Mp3tag to tell it - you only want only v2 or whatever.
i will bet my monkey that the mispelled Tag is in APE and you just dont look at ape.

btw: Mp3tag is German Engineering and would have a nice rtfm file:///%programfiles%/Mp3tag/help/options_id3.html

garym
2013-04-20, 08:15
Hi,

nonsense....

mp3tag can v1 and v2 and ape also.

Use Options in Mp3tag to tell it - you only want only v2 or whatever.
i will bet my monkey that the mispelled Tag is in APE and you just dont look at ape.

btw: Mp3tag is German Engineering and would have a nice rtfm file:///%programfiles%/Mp3tag/help/options_id3.html

not sure this is nonsense. Yes, mp3tag can read v1 and v2 and ape just fine *in mp3 files*. But I recall (but haven't tested) that it couldn't tell whether an ID3 tag was included in a FLAC file in addition to normal FLAC tag (orbis comment).

edit: unless it has changed very recently, mp3tag can't detect an ID3 tag within a FLAC file. Several threads about this at the mp3tag forums. One example:
http://forums.mp3tag.de/index.php?s=&showtopic=10636&view=findpost&p=42302

Bert57
2013-04-20, 08:16
Thanks for the help.

Garym
Yes, I have retagged the offending album Genre from Accoustic(Spelling) to Acoustic(corrected). There are two genres for this album. Accoustic\\Live is the way it is shown. Changed the genre heading as you advised and it does show the two genre fields in mp3tag.

Did a clear and rescan and when I open genres I see Accoustic with albums that have been tagged Genre>Acoustic\\Live and there is a genre Acoustic (corrected spelling and where the tagged album should show) that is empty.

Mnyb

Went to mp3tag and selected tools >options > tagging and unchecked all that were checked under read and write. Put a check in clear for id3v1, id3v2, and ape. Full Clear and Rescan.

Accoustic (mispelled) still shows with the albums tagged genre) Acoustic and Acoustic still remains empty. Frustrating.

Thanks again for the help.

garym
2013-04-20, 08:29
Thanks for the help.

Garym
Yes, I have retagged the offending album Genre from Accoustic(Spelling) to Acoustic(corrected). There are two genres for this album. Accoustic\\Live is the way it is shown. Changed the genre heading as you advised and it does show the two genre fields in mp3tag.

Did a clear and rescan and when I open genres I see Accoustic with albums that have been tagged Genre>Acoustic\\Live and there is a genre Acoustic (corrected spelling and where the tagged album should show) that is empty.

Mnyb

Went to mp3tag and selected tools >options > tagging and unchecked all that were checked under read and write. Put a check in clear for id3v1, id3v2, and ape. Full Clear and Rescan.

Accoustic (mispelled) still shows with the albums tagged genre) Acoustic and Acoustic still remains empty. Frustrating.

Thanks again for the help.

in mp3tag, under mp3tag tools>options>tagging/mp3, set:
1. READ, tick, id3v1, id3v2, APE
2. WRITE: id3v2.3 only. I use UTF16 here.
3. Then tick REMOVE id3v1 and APE.

The select OK to save it all. But here's the confusing part. Now you need to load up the files in mp3tag, select the files, then click the big red X (second icon at top, to the right of the SAVE (disc) icon. This will then perform all those tag actions (read all tags, write only id3v2.3, and importantly remove other tags). It seems odd as if you are deleting tags, etc. But you're not. Try it with a file or two just confirm for yourself that it works. And use a custom column heading for "Tag Type" with the following as the "value" to show the tags within an mp3tag:

%_tag_read%[ (%_tag%)]

p.s. So are you saying that your files are mp3 files and not FLAC files. None of the info in this response will help with FLAC files, as the above relates to mp3 files.

kidstypike
2013-04-20, 08:34
Thanks for the help.

Garym
Yes, I have retagged the offending album Genre from Accoustic(Spelling) to Acoustic(corrected). There are two genres for this album. Accoustic\\Live is the way it is shown. Changed the genre heading as you advised and it does show the two genre fields in mp3tag.

Did a clear and rescan and when I open genres I see Accoustic with albums that have been tagged Genre>Acoustic\\Live and there is a genre Acoustic (corrected spelling and where the tagged album should show) that is empty.

Mnyb

Went to mp3tag and selected tools >options > tagging and unchecked all that were checked under read and write. Put a check in clear for id3v1, id3v2, and ape. Full Clear and Rescan.

Accoustic (mispelled) still shows with the albums tagged genre) Acoustic and Acoustic still remains empty. Frustrating.

Thanks again for the help.


What does LMS show when you drill down to "View tags" ?

Mnyb
2013-04-20, 08:55
..and if you already have Id3v ( actually an mp3 tag format ) in you flac files you should also perform the action to remove mp3 tags ? Or similar , I'm afraid I'm not out to what's the latest in mp3tag .

So that you end up with flac files with only flac tags , that's simpler .

On Linux you can use puddletag it's IMO actually even better than mp3 tag .

Actually I have some old stuff with both flac and id3v it works fine ,for now it was done when I knew less .
I expect this to give me trouble later , but I most have something to do when get old ( older ) .

Bert57
2013-04-20, 08:58
Garym

Set mp3tag as you suggested and saved. All of my files are FLAC so as you expected none of this made a difference.

When I go to "View Tags" in LMS on a song that has been retagged Live\\Acoustic with mp3tag the genre shows Live\\Accoustic(misspelled).

Bert57
2013-04-20, 09:06
Just checked another album that has been retagged as Live;Rock;Acoustic. When I go view tags on a song this shows Live;Rock;Acoustic as genre but the album still shows under Genre)Accoustic. Genre)Acoustic is still empty.

garym
2013-04-20, 09:06
Garym

Set mp3tag as you suggested and saved. All of my files are FLAC so as you expected none of this made a difference.

When I go to "View Tags" in LMS on a song that has been retagged Live\\Acoustic with mp3tag the genre shows Live\\Accoustic(misspelled).

something odd going on then. can you try to simply convert this album FLAC > FLAC, and see if that does anything. Just grasping for something here....

garym
2013-04-20, 09:08
since these are under "live" can I assume that they were not rips from CDs but maybe torrented files or from live music archive, etc. (thus the increased probability of a stray/odd tag). I might even convert to WAV, which should lose the tags, then convert from WAV to FLAC and redo the tags. Something stray is staying with those tags!

Bert57
2013-04-20, 09:17
These are Live or concert cd' s.

Am converting one of them to WAVE and back to flac and will retag.

We'll see

garym
2013-04-20, 09:22
These are Live or concert cd' s.

Am converting one of them to WAVE and back to flac and will retag.

We'll see

what program do you initially rip and tag with? EAC or dbpoweramp? I don't think dbpa will allow one to add id3 tags to a FLAC, but I recall that EAC can be forced to do so....not sure on that.

Bert57
2013-04-20, 09:30
Converted to wave then back to flac. Was surprised that all tags were still there. Genre tag was Live\\Accoustic again. Mp3tag again to genre)Live\\Acoustic. Now the album shows up under genre Accoustic and genre acoustic.

Some headway.

I am working on this problem at work computer but time has come to head home. Will check back later but could be a while.

Thanks again for the help and guidance. Feel sure we will work this out.
Steve

DJanGo
2013-04-21, 00:48
These are Live or concert cd' s.
/snip
\snap
Converted to wave then back to flac. Was surprised that all tags were still there.

Why?
If you say -the source is cd then re-ripp and tag them. Converting from to and backwards again wouldnt make better sounds, may better tags - so reripp them from the sources.

Julf
2013-04-21, 02:14
Why?
If you say -the source is cd then re-ripp and tag them. Converting from to and backwards again wouldnt make better sounds, may better tags - so reripp them from the sources.

Converting flac-wav-flac won't make the sound better, but it won't make it worse either. Re-ripping can make it worse, if you don't use a ripper that ensures the rip is bit-perfect (and as CD's get older, they get harder to read).

garym
2013-04-21, 05:49
Converting flac-wav-flac won't make the sound better, but it won't make it worse either. Re-ripping can make it worse, if you don't use a ripper that ensures the rip is bit-perfect (and as CD's get older, they get harder to read).

yep, and the OP is not trying to make the sound better. He's got some sort of odd 'tag' issue, that so far has not been easily solved, although I'm sure it will be eventually.

Julf
2013-04-21, 06:01
yep, and the OP is not trying to make the sound better. He's got some sort of odd 'tag' issue, that so far has not been easily solved, although I'm sure it will be eventually.

Sure. Just wanted to make sure that some audiophool wouldn't read the posing from DJanGo as implying the flac-wav-flac conversion would somehow affect the sound quality.

garym
2013-04-21, 06:10
Sure. Just wanted to make sure that some audiophool wouldn't read the posing from DJanGo as implying the flac-wav-flac conversion would somehow affect the sound quality.

Sorry, I should have responded to DJanGo's post instead as I was actually responding to his post, by agreeing with you (that lossless conversion is lossless) and emphasizing that it was a tag issue not sound quality. And I agree that we have to be diligent in providing clarification when posts can be interpreted wrongly by any lurking audiophools. ;-)

Bert57
2013-04-22, 07:31
First I want to thank garym and others for their time and assistance with my problem. Without this forum and people like garym (many others) who share their time and knowledge I would be one of those who never got to really experience what the squeezebox offered.

Spent several hours this weekend trying to fix this problem at home without success. Got to the office and started again. I have finally found a method that seems to work.

1. Select genre that needs to be removed and go to each album that is in that genre.
2. Delete each album from musicip mixer.
3. Go to the album/song level in my music and select all songs
4. Edit id tags to the genre or genres you want
5. Back to musicip mixer and add the albums back to your library.
6. http://localhost:10002/server and refresh songs.
7. Complete clear rescan

This has corrected all but one album that I am still having problems with. It is "Doors Absolutely Live" and was originally tagged "Live;Rock And Roll". It needs to be "Live;Rock and Roll" to show with the other R&R albums. It was changed at the album/song level and shows the correct genre at that level, mp3tag, and in musicip. After refreshing songs at localhost and rescanning with LMS the album still shows under the wrong genre. Will continue.

garym
2013-04-22, 07:34
First I want to thank garym and others for their time and assistance with my problem. Without this forum and people like garym (many others) who share their time and knowledge I would be one of those who never got to really experience what the squeezebox offered.

Spent several hours this weekend trying to fix this problem at home without success. Got to the office and started again. I have finally found a method that seems to work.

1. Select genre that needs to be removed and go to each album that is in that genre.
2. Delete each album from musicip mixer.
3. Go to the album/song level in my music and select all songs
4. Edit id tags to the genre or genres you want
5. Back to musicip mixer and add the albums back to your library.
6. http://localhost:10002/server and refresh songs.
7. Complete clear rescan

This has corrected all but one album that I am still having problems with. It is "Doors Absolutely Live" and was originally tagged "Live;Rock And Roll". It needs to be "Live;Rock and Roll" to show with the other R&R albums. It was changed at the album/song level and shows the correct genre at that level, mp3tag, and in musicip. After refreshing songs at localhost and rescanning with LMS the album still shows under the wrong genre. Will continue.

Good progress. And I missed the fact that musicip mixer was involved, so I suspect that is part of the challenge/issue (not that I would have had any suggestions on that, as I'm not a musicIP user). thanks for your kind words. this is a very helpful forum....I've learned a lot here.

Bert57
2013-04-22, 07:43
garym
I should have mentioned musicip to begin with. Probably would have saved you time and trouble. Being a complete novice with things computer related I didn't even think about it. Sorry!

Corrected the last problem. Doors Absolutely live.

Removed the album from "my music" folder and did a complete rescan. This got rid of "Rock And Roll" genre. Put Doors album back in my music folder, added it to musicip, Refreshed at localhost, and another complete scan.

Problem Solved. The doors album now shows under Rock and Roll and there is no Rock And Roll genre.

Thanks again for the help.

Hope my experience will contribute to helping anyone else that might be having a similar problem. Still don't understand why it took so much to correct what seemed a simple thing. My solution is not elegant or simple but it did the job.

Steve

garym
2013-04-22, 07:47
garym
I should have mentioned musicip to begin with. Probably would have saved you time and trouble. Being a complete novice with things computer related I didn't even think about it. Sorry!

Corrected the last problem. Doors Absolutely live.

Removed the album from "my music" folder and did a complete rescan. This got rid of "Rock And Roll" genre. Put Doors album back in my music folder, added it to musicip, Refreshed at localhost, and another complete scan.

Problem Solved. The doors album now shows under Rock and Roll and there is no Rock And Roll genre.

Thanks again for the help.

Hope my experience will contribute to helping anyone else that might be having a similar problem. Still don't understand why it took so much to correct what seemed a simple thing. My solution is not elegant or simple but it did the job.

Steve

No problem. Sometimes we don't realize a variable is important until we realize it is! And this thread will prove useful to others that might run into the same issue. It is odd that it seems musicIP makes changing genre so difficult, but must be some interaction there that does this. But at least you've fixed this minor but irritating problem of genres!

Bert57
2013-04-22, 08:42
First I want to thank garym and others for their time and assistance with my problem. Without this forum and people like garym (many others) who share their time and knowledge I would be one of those who never got to really experience what the squeezebox offered.

Spent several hours this weekend trying to fix this problem at home without success. Got to the office and started again. I have finally found a method that seems to work.

1. Select genre that needs to be removed and go to each album that is in that genre.
2. Delete each album from musicip mixer.
3. Go to the album/song level in my music and select all songs
4. Edit id tags to the genre or genres you want
5. Back to musicip mixer and add the albums back to your library.
6. http://localhost:10002/server and refresh songs.
7. Complete clear rescan

This has corrected all but one album that I am still having problems with. It is "Doors Absolutely Live" and was originally tagged "Live;Rock And Roll". It needs to be "Live;Rock and Roll" to show with the other R&R albums. It was changed at the album/song level and shows the correct genre at that level, mp3tag, and in musicip. After refreshing songs at localhost and rescanning with LMS the album still shows under the wrong genre. Will continue.

Bert57
2013-04-22, 09:29
First I want to thank garym and others for their time and assistance with my problem. Without this forum and people like garym (many others) who share their time and knowledge I would be one of those who never got to really experience what the squeezebox offered.

Spent several hours this weekend trying to fix this problem at home without success. Got to the office and started again. I have finally found a method that seems to work.

1. Select genre that needs to be removed and go to each album that is in that genre.
2. Delete each album from musicip mixer.
3. Go to the album/song level in my music and select all songs
4. Edit id tags to the genre or genres you want
5. Back to musicip mixer and add the albums back to your library.
6. http://localhost:10002/server and refresh songs.
7. Complete clear rescan

This has corrected all but one album that I am still having problems with. It is "Doors Absolutely Live" and was originally tagged "Live;Rock And Roll". It needs to be "Live;Rock and Roll" to show with the other R&R albums. It was changed at the album/song level and shows the correct genre at that level, mp3tag, and in musicip. After refreshing songs at localhost and rescanning with LMS the album still shows under the wrong genre. Will continue.

Mnyb
2013-04-22, 22:33
If you use the mip integration , is not LMS simply importing the mip dB.

a way may be to imply delete the whole mip dB file and let mip do a fresh scan ?

Is not mip's tag support a bit limited compared to LMS ?
But hen again if you want to use it you have to make the best of it.

Bert57
2013-04-23, 07:09
May set up a small folder of 3,4 albums to test if just a fresh scan will handle it. Don't see why not. Seems about what I did but mine was an album by album approach. Slow! I think it would still require localhost refresh but that takes little time.

If I understand what you suggest it would be:
Make changes in mp3tag
Delete db musicip
Add db to musicip
Localhost refresh
Rescan LMS

Tried it on my work computer (small db) and seemed to work perfect. On the home computer I will now be able to make any changes in mp3tag, delete library, reinstall, localhost refresh, and rescan. Much faster and will save me lots of time.

When I started using genre I really had no idea what I was doing and made so many mistakes. As I began to explore the possibilities of LMS and the numerous plugins I found that by using genres and Erland's SQL Playlist I could make playlist combining multiple genres of my choosing. This fit my wants to a T. Can now set a playlist that entertains me for hours. Just makes Squeezebox that much more functional for me.

Still can't believe the failure of Logitech to understand the potential of what they had.

Thanks again garym and Mnyb!
Steve

audiomuze
2013-10-13, 12:03
Has anyone filed a bug for LMS not deleting orphaned genres from the db? Running a scan looking for changed files picks up that there are changes to genre entries, however, orphaned genre entries are not deleted - they still appear in the genre listing albeit browsing an orphaned genre yields no results. Orphaned genres should be deleted from the genres table.

Mnyb
2013-10-13, 22:42
Has anyone filed a bug for LMS not deleting orphaned genres from the db? Running a scan looking for changed files picks up that there are changes to genre entries, however, orphaned genre entries are not deleted - they still appear in the genre listing albeit browsing an orphaned genre yields no results. Orphaned genres should be deleted from the genres table.

I'm not sure but I vote if you find one , btw I think it is orphaned anything not just genre , you can have other kinds of " ghost entries " too ?

mherger
2013-10-13, 22:54
> I'm not sure but I vote if you find one , btw I think it is orphaned
> anything not just genre , you can have other kinds of " ghost entries "
> too ?

AFAICT yes: just had a "gost artist" last week, after fixing an artist
name.

--

Michael

bakker_be
2013-10-22, 03:25
While I don't doubt that ghost entries exist (haven't had one, but anything's possible), to me it doesn't seem that this was the case here. IMO it was just "incorrect" use of the MusicIP plugin, as in:

Letting LMS get tag info from MusicIP, all you need is the "mixable" status, and if you use Spicefly Sugarcube you don't even need that
Not rescanning in MusicIP after changing tags, if for some reason you absolutely want to import tag info from MusicIP

This just resulted in the incorrect tag being imported over and over again from MusicIP.

JJZolx
2013-10-22, 21:01
Has anyone filed a bug for LMS not deleting orphaned genres from the db? Running a scan looking for changed files picks up that there are changes to genre entries, however, orphaned genre entries are not deleted - they still appear in the genre listing albeit browsing an orphaned genre yields no results. Orphaned genres should be deleted from the genres table.

http://bugs.slimdevices.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16060

I did, and it was fixed back in 7.6.1. I just ran a few tests with 7.8 and a new & changed scan successfully removed the orphaned genres. I have a feeling that if it doesn't work for you, you have something else going on in your library or with your plugins, as suggested in the post above.

michel
2014-12-21, 01:41
Had to dig out this old (orphaned?) thread.

I was consolidating inconsistent genre tags just to notice that some now empty genre entries are not removed even after deleting cache folder.

I am running last nightly of 7.9 on Win 7.

michel
2014-12-21, 03:39
Interestingly enough I just found out that iPeng does show the 'culprits', while in my browser the same genres are empty!

CharlieG
2014-12-21, 06:21
Interestingly enough I just found out that iPeng does show the 'culprits', while in my browser the same genres are empty!

Maybe its in the iPeng cache. Have you cleared the cache in iPeng?

michel
2014-12-22, 02:34
Cache was cleared.
The files iPeng found actually had the genre tag I was searching for. Now that I corrected these tags all is well.
I just can't figure out why LMS did not show these files.