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View Full Version : Touch Can't Connect to LMS on NAS - HELP Please!



Zonker92
2012-10-04, 15:38
I’m running the current DSM firmware and the current Logitech Media Server (LMS) on the DS212J NAS, and my Squeezebox Touch (also current firmware) is on my network. Sometimes the Touch works fine with the NAS LMS, but nowadays, most of the time the Touch can’t connect with the NAS; it says “Problem connecting. We couldn't connect to DiskStation”.

MY PC is connected to a wireless router (Netgear R6300) which is hardwired to a switch. I have LMS running on a Synology DS212J NAS wired directly to that same switch. I have a Squeezebox Touch that is also wired directly to that switch. I believe all the devices are set for DHCP, since I never assigned addresses to them. The DiskStation currently has 192.168.1.17 as its IP address. The Touch is 192.168.1.26. My router sees them both just fine, through the switch.

My PC connects to the NAS and the browser window / LMS control panel just fine (sometimes; see farther below). My Touch connects to the network, both by ethernet and wi-fi, just fine. The Touch plays music off the internet just fine. The NAS is able to perform updates over the network just fine. My PC is able to rip music through iTunes and store it on the NAS just fine. iTunes on my PC plays music off the NAS just fine. The DS Audio app streams music off the NAS to my iPhone over wi-fi just fine. The NAS firewall is set to allow all traffic through its ports. Everything talks to everything else, hardwired or over wi-fi, just fine …. EXCEPT most of the time the Touch has trouble connecting to the NAS (“Problem connecting. We couldn't connect to DiskStation”).

I have, as I said, updated everything. Everything seems to be networked just fine. I’ve uninstalled and reinstalled LMS, cleared and rescanned the music index and stopped and restarted the LMS service. I've bypassed the switch by connecting the Touch directly to the NAS with an Ethernet cable. I can see the Touch from the LMS control panel on my PC. I've pulled the Touch power cable and restarted it. I've shut off and restarted the NAS. Yet the Touch STILL can’t connect to the LMS most of the time. And it used to work pretty reliably, until a few weeks ago.

At this point I’m blaming the Diskstation. Every other aspect of the Touch is working great; but it’s just having a terrible time getting LMS on the Diskstation to respond.

The other (related?) issue is that the LMS browser window / control panel on my PC hangs and doesn’t open sometimes; other times it works just fine.

Would an upgraded NAS like the DS212 or 212+ be more stable? Any other ideas? Any way I can upgrade or try a different unit? This is driving me nuts, because the NAS and Touch are the heart of my treasured music system, and it’s basically crippled at this point.

Thanks so much.

poilus141
2012-10-06, 11:06
Hello,
I almost have the same configuration.
Netgear router, Server running on Synology streaming to 3 SB Radios and 1 SB Touch.

I have had issues in the past.
I solved by :
checking versions to be the same one on all devices
using ethernet cable instead of wifi
re-Launching the SB Server (or LMS) on the Synology thru the DSM if needed.
and and, not being using latest LMS version but the minus one.

Hope this helps.

Chris

JohnB
2012-10-06, 11:27
Yet the Touch STILL can’t connect to the LMS most of the time. And it used to work pretty reliably, until a few weeks ago.

Did you change anything a couple of weeks ago, e.g. changing the configuration, wiring, software?

You say that the Touch sometimes connects to LMS. Is the anything different when that happens?

Have you swapped the ethernet cable between the Touch and switch, to rule that out as the problem?

Mnyb
2012-10-06, 14:09
Any ip conflict ? Is there something that is not on the network when the Touch works ?

Zonker92
2012-10-06, 16:13
Thanks for the ideas. At this point, I'm thinking that the current version of LMS, on the NAS, was simply not working right with my Touch. I just uninstalled that version of LMS and installed the Beta version and rebooted the NAS, and so far it seems to be working. Once I'm done rescanning my music library I'll have a better idea whether this is the fix.

Thanks again; this has been a really annoying, time-consuming process. I hope this works.

By the way, I figured out where to download older versions of LMS (here: http://ukdl.synology.com/download/packages/) but I can't figure out how to point the Diskstation Manager at the file on my PC, even using the DSM Package Center > Settings > Package Sources window. Any suggestions? I might want to try other LMS versions if this doesn't work. Thanks!

Mnyb
2012-10-06, 20:04
Now I see your sig , ALAC files ? Do they transcode on the server ? Or not ? Can be version differences here and maybe something in the file types settings ?

I have no alac files not 100% on how they are handled in 7.8 byt Synology may have their own settings here to properly deal with this .

Zonker92
2012-10-06, 20:08
Thanks. My ALAC files normally play just fine. In fact, I'm listening to some right now. The problem is intermittent, where the Touch becomes unable to connect with the NAS, and right now it's OK, using today's Beta version of LMS.

When the disconnect happens, I am finding that it helps to reboot the NAS, although that doesn't always repair the connection. The NAS works fine in other respects; I can log into the Diskstation Manager from my PC and perform all manner of operations. The problem seems to lie in LMS and its connection to the Touch. For some reason, that connection is intermittent.

Mnyb
2012-10-06, 21:28
Thanks. My ALAC files normally play just fine. In fact, I'm listening to some right now. The problem is intermittent, where the Touch becomes unable to connect with the NAS, and right now it's OK, using today's Beta version of LMS.

When the disconnect happens, I am finding that it helps to reboot the NAS, although that doesn't always repair the connection. The NAS works fine in other respects; I can log into the Diskstation Manager from my PC and perform all manner of operations. The problem seems to lie in LMS and its connection to the Touch. For some reason, that connection is intermittent.

Can you figure the load on the NAS CPU + memory ,just an idea if the conection problems coincide with 100% load .
Also look at the normal situation for comparison .

Zonker92
2012-10-06, 22:20
Yes, that's easy to check: the Diskstation Manager app has a CPU memory graph. I believe it's been showing normal memory usage during the problem episodes, but I'll verify.

For now, I'm shutting off the NAS when I stop listening to music, and rebooting it next time I plan to play music. A bit annoying, but it seems to work fine on reboot and later the connection degrades. I appreciate all the advice!

Eric

banned for life
2012-10-08, 15:57
My NAS connections to LMS (VBox) are NFS rather than CIFS.

BFL

Zonker92
2012-10-08, 16:13
Thanks, Banned, but that's a bit over my head, even after Googling those terms. :(

I am finding that the DiskStation itself, and the Touch itself, work normally with respect to all other operations and interfaces. The problem seems to lie in the LMS on the DiskStation, and its connection to the Touch seems to degrade over time following each reboot of the DiskStation. Installing an LMS Beta version the other day seemed to help, but not solve the problem. The connection still degrades over time.

So I'm virtually convinced that the problem is with the version of LMS I'm running. Today I installed an older version, from last March, and I am curious to see if it solves the problem. I'm also waiting to hear back from Synology and Squeezebox support to see if they have any ideas; I sent logs to them.

Failing either solution, I may sell the Diskstation and buy a Vortexbox instead. It's silly to spend all my time trying to get this working correctly.

Mnyb
2012-10-08, 20:58
Do you use any third party plugins ?

One thing ,do you perform a " clear and rescan everything " now and then ?

The dB seems to detoriate over time when you do only " scan for new and changed "

Zonker92
2012-10-08, 21:35
No third party plug-ins, and with each different version I've tried, I've performed at least one complete rescan. :(

Thanks for the interest!

Zonker92
2012-10-08, 22:21
Oh, but I forgot to mention that I've been running the Enhanced Digital Output app. However, I've had it installed since Day One and this problem cropped up only months later.

How do I uninstall it, though, just to be sure?

toby10
2012-10-09, 03:05
Just do a Factory Reset on Touch, that should wipe out the software mods.

Zonker92
2012-10-09, 08:50
OK; thanks.

Now I'm running the latest Touch firmware (downloaded this morning), while on my NAS I'm running LMS version 7.7.1 - r33735 (11-28-11), with a full rescan and no third-party plugins. Still working fine, but the day is young. Fingers crossed and no high expectations ....

Mnyb
2012-10-09, 09:31
Is iy not that it is preferable to run 7.8 with EDO btw

Zonker92
2012-10-09, 09:33
Would you mind clarifying that statement? I don't understand. Thanks.

Mnyb
2012-10-09, 09:48
Would you mind clarifying that statement? I don't understand. Thanks.

I think Triode have modified LMS to and the 7.8 fw/LMS to accept 192kHz sample-rate in some improved way that takes care of people transcoding WAV files .
I don't run edo so i don't know .
And i genral matching player fw with server is preferable , not that there is any big differences between the latest 7.7.2 and 7.8 due to recent developments

Zonker92
2012-10-09, 10:30
OK; thanks.

At this point it's still working, for whatever reason, so I'm tiptoeing around it and trying not to look at it directly. :D

Zonker92
2012-10-10, 10:05
Hello,
I almost have the same configuration.
Netgear router, Server running on Synology streaming to 3 SB Radios and 1 SB Touch.

I have had issues in the past.
I solved by :
checking versions to be the same one on all devices
using ethernet cable instead of wifi
re-Launching the SB Server (or LMS) on the Synology thru the DSM if needed.
and and, not being using latest LMS version but the minus one.

Hope this helps.

Chris

Chris, I think your post, above, led me to the solution.

I was waiting a day to confirm, but I think I have the problem solved now (fingers crossed).

I believe it was the later version of LMS that was not working for me; the connection between LMS on the NAS, and both the Touch and my PC, would degrade over time until I could no longer access LMS from either device. Everything else on the NAS worked fine, and my connection to it was fine.

I had been running the current version of LMS, and having problems. I uninstalled it, rebooted, then installed the current Beta version (a few days back), and cleared and rescanned my music library, but the problem persisted. I downgraded to the previous release of LMS the same way, then the one before that, and the problem remained.

Then I did all that with version 7.1.1001 (7.7.1 - r33735) and, miracle of miracles, the problem seems to have vanished (knock on wood). It’s been two days now without the slightest connection problem, even running the Touch over wi-fi. (My Touch is now running 7.7.1-r9558 firmware.) At this point, I think I will not update LMS again; just leave it alone.

Thanks everyone, for your help! I'll update this thread if the problem reemerges.

Zonker92
2012-10-12, 16:50
Connection has now officially died again. I think I'm done with the Synology. I guess I'll try a Vortexbox. :(

saurus
2012-10-14, 07:47
I believe it was the later version of LMS that was not working for me; the connection between LMS on the NAS, and both the Touch and my PC, would degrade over time until I could no longer access LMS from either device.


Just make sure that your MTU settings for the network are not too different between all devices. I had this in a non LMS context with a ReadyNAS, where NAS was on 1500 and client on 1300, which lead to a dying network stack on the NAS after some time. Took me a day to find out. Might be also the problem in your environment.

Regards, Torsten

Zonker92
2012-10-14, 08:15
Thanks, but this problem was happening even with the Touch plugged directly into the NAS. Dunno.

Anyway, I started using LMS on my PC instead, and playing through the Touch it was a dream; so fast and perfect. Really amazing difference. This morning I bought a Vortexbox so I'll report later how that works. I have high hopes.

Thanks!

garym
2012-10-14, 09:03
Thanks, but this problem was happening even with the Touch plugged directly into the NAS. Dunno.

Thanks!

hmmm, how were you plugging directly into your NAS. I'm assuming your NAS is not setup to function as a router. The TOUCH and the NAS need to both be connected back to your router. Now this connection back to the router could be ethernet or wifi, but the connection of the two is to the router, NOT connecting the TOUCH directly to the NAS.

Same with VBA. Connect it back to your router via ethernet (or ethernet over powerline if you have no ethernet connection). Then connect your TOUCH to your router (via WIFI or ethernet).

Zonker92
2012-10-14, 09:17
Interesting, thanks. So you don't think I should connect my router to one of the VB ports and connect the Touch to another VB port? (I bet that would work, even if it's technically wrong.)

Pretty sure I tried every one of the following configurations without success:





Router > Ethernet cable > switch > Ethernet cable > Touch & NAS (each in a separate port on the switch)


Switch > Ethernet cable > Touch & NAS (each in a separate port on the switch)


Router > Ethernet cable > switch > Ethernet cable > NAS - PLUS - Router > wi-fi > Touch


Router > Ethernet cable > NAS - PLUS - Router > wi-fi > Touch


NAS > Ethernet cable > Touch


NAS > Ethernet cable > Touch - PLUS - Router > wi-fi > Touch
Plus probably more things I tried but have forgotten. I tried rebooting and reinstalling everything, different versions of everything, different wi-fi networksm different cables, you name it. And my router saw everything perfectly. I also checked the subnet masks, IP addresses, DHCP issues etc.

In other words, I've spent too much time on this issue, and even when the NAS was connected, it was slow to list and start playing music. :D

And again, the thing is, when the connection degraded between the NAS and the Touch, it also degraded between the NAS and the PC, and it was only with respect to LMS on the NAS; all the other functions of the NAS worked fine, from the PC control panel (Synology DSM). And the Touch was always able to run music off the Interwebz, like Pandora. It really made me see LMS as the culprit, like the NAS just wasn't capable of running it in a stable manner.

All moot now; the VBox should work fine, I'm really hoping.

garym
2012-10-14, 09:25
Interesting, thanks. So you don't think I should connect my router to one of the VB ports and connect the Touch to another VB port? (I bet that would work, even if it's technically wrong.)

I'd be shocked if this would work. Both the VBA and the TOUCH need to be connected to the ROUTER, not to each other.


Router > Ethernet cable > switch > Ethernet cable > Touch & NAS (each in a separate port on the switch)
THIS IS FINE

Router > Ethernet cable > switch > Ethernet cable > NAS - PLUS - Router > wi-fi > Touch
THIS COULD WORK BUT ONLY IF YOU TURNED OFF DHCP IN ONE OF THE ROUTERS. OTHERWISE YOU WERE POTENTIALLY HANDING OUT THE SAME IP ADDRESSES TO DIFFERENT THINGS ON YOUR NETWORK. THIS COULD CAUSE MAJOR MALFUNCTION! THAT IS, NOTHING WORKS.

Router > Ethernet cable > NAS - PLUS - Router > wi-fi > Touch
SAME AS ABOVE. TWO ROUTERS, WITH BOTH HANDING OUT DHCP ADDRESSES IS A NO-NO

NAS > Ethernet cable > Touch - PLUS - Router > wi-fi > Touch[/list]
I CAN'T IMAGINE HOW THIS WOULD WORK.


And again, the thing is, when the connection degraded between the NAS and the Touch, it also degraded between the NAS and the PC, and it was only with respect to LMS on the NAS; all the other functions of the NAS worked fine, from the PC control panel (Synology DSM). It really made me see LMS as the culprit, like the NAS just wasn't capable of running it in a stable manner.

NO OFFENSE, BUT BASED ON YOUR ATTEMPTED CONNECTIONS ABOVE, I'D SAY THERE ARE SOME NETWORKING BASICS THAT YOU ARE NOT UNDERSTANDING (I was there too in the past). But it is also true that some NAS units really struggle in running LMS.

Zonker92
2012-10-14, 09:29
No offense taken. Perhaps part of my motivation was the fact that the Sonos box I was using before could, I guess, double as a switch, so I could jack my router into it and then connect the NAS to it also, and it worked just ducky. So I thought that maybe since the Sonos could talk directly to the NAS, the Touch could, too. Interesting that it doesn't work that way. Why does the VB have multiple ethernet ports?

I should clarify that each of the scenarios listed, mentioning a router, above involved using a single router (and I have learned about turning off the DHCP function when using more than one router). And some of my scenarios were just done as stupid experiments, out of sheer frustration. :D

Mnyb
2012-10-14, 12:59
You can setup local networks without a router point to point with a twisted cable or with normal cables trough a switch .
Provided you setup everything static , but of course no Internet conection .

That's my network ,but with a router attached at one of the switches for Internet and wifi .

But in general if one fault traces use a known configuration that you understand .

Zonker92
2012-10-14, 13:37
Good point. I did about 90% of my testing with my router feeding a switch, and the Touch and NAS both plugged into the switch. I tried the other approaches as last resorts, just in case a different configuration might solve the problem.

garym
2012-10-14, 13:46
Good point. I did about 90% of my testing with my router feeding a switch, and the Touch and NAS both plugged into the switch.

thats perfectly ok.