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mark sayers
2004-10-11, 02:57
did anyone manage to get this to work?

Is there a compiled / complete version anywhere for download? My
knowledge of terminals and perl is less than zero....

Dave Scott
2004-10-15, 20:40
Jules

Ok - some progress

Revisited the whole install - corrected a couple of issues - downloaded
latest version of alien.

1. Now got streaming working at CLI level - audio etc sounds ok

(./alienstream
rtsp://rmlivev8.bbc.net.uk/farm/*/ev7/live24/radio1/live/r1_dsat_g2.ra)
(/sw/bin/lame -q 9 -cbr -b 320 --resample 44100 -S tmp.wav - |
/sw/bin/madplay - )

no more incrementing "tmp.wav" file ( did see a xine-output wave file -
but fixed to approx 7.6 megs -> not incrementing in size )

2. when I try & run ./transcoder_proxy.pl get following error message

Couldn't bind to port 5123 at ./transcoder_proxy.pl line 42.

At Softsqueeze level - all the menu's work etc BUT no audio

At the web page level everything works ok - ie see HitchHikers come up
- entry in playlist ok - BUT no audio

At CLI level audio was ok for about 5 minutes or so - but now running
into what sounds like skipping / washing machine wa wa effect ..

anyway its getting there

(transcoder_proxy.pl

use alienstream = 1 doesn't produce audio ..

if try "use aliensteam = 0 don't get any audio either )

cheers

Dave Scott



On 11 Oct 2004, at 17:57, mark sayers wrote:

> did anyone manage to get this to work?
>
> Is there a compiled / complete version anywhere for download? My
> knowledge of terminals and perl is less than zero....
>
>
>
>

Dave Scott
2004-10-15, 20:45
Ok

wa wa effect may have just been the music - sounds like I had "hit"
the rap / hip hop show :-)


On 16 Oct 2004, at 11:40, Dave Scott wrote:

> Jules
>
> Ok - some progress
>
> Revisited the whole install - corrected a couple of issues -
> downloaded latest version of alien.
>
> 1. Now got streaming working at CLI level - audio etc sounds ok
>
> (./alienstream
> rtsp://rmlivev8.bbc.net.uk/farm/*/ev7/live24/radio1/live/
> r1_dsat_g2.ra)
> (/sw/bin/lame -q 9 -cbr -b 320 --resample 44100 -S tmp.wav - |
> /sw/bin/madplay - )
>
> no more incrementing "tmp.wav" file ( did see a xine-output wave file
> - but fixed to approx 7.6 megs -> not incrementing in size )
>
> 2. when I try & run ./transcoder_proxy.pl get following error message
>
> Couldn't bind to port 5123 at ./transcoder_proxy.pl line 42.
>
> At Softsqueeze level - all the menu's work etc BUT no audio
>
> At the web page level everything works ok - ie see HitchHikers come up
> - entry in playlist ok - BUT no audio
>
> At CLI level audio was ok for about 5 minutes or so - but now running
> into what sounds like skipping / washing machine wa wa effect ..
>
> anyway its getting there
>
> (transcoder_proxy.pl
>
> use alienstream = 1 doesn't produce audio ..
>
> if try "use aliensteam = 0 don't get any audio either )
>
> cheers
>
> Dave Scott
>

Jules Taplin
2004-10-16, 02:43
Hi Dave.

The skipping effect isn't unheard of. I've heard it on occasion, but not
often, and very rarely (if at all) since I moved over to using mplayer
instead of alienstream (don't know if that's practical for MacOS/X users).

I've currently got it down to a problem in the codecs themselves, as I can't
imagine how it might go wrong more widely.



-- Jules


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Scott" <kiwidave (AT) starhub (DOT) net.sg>
To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 4:45 AM
Subject: [slim] Alien BBC on Mac OS X instructions(Longish)


> Ok
>
> wa wa effect may have just been the music - sounds like I had "hit" the
> rap / hip hop show :-)
>
>
> On 16 Oct 2004, at 11:40, Dave Scott wrote:
>
>> Jules
>>
>> Ok - some progress
>>
>> Revisited the whole install - corrected a couple of issues - downloaded
>> latest version of alien.
>>
>> 1. Now got streaming working at CLI level - audio etc sounds ok
>>
>> (./alienstream
>> rtsp://rmlivev8.bbc.net.uk/farm/*/ev7/live24/radio1/live/ r1_dsat_g2.ra)
>> (/sw/bin/lame -q 9 -cbr -b 320 --resample 44100 -S tmp.wav - |
>> /sw/bin/madplay - )
>>
>> no more incrementing "tmp.wav" file ( did see a xine-output wave file -
>> but fixed to approx 7.6 megs -> not incrementing in size )
>>
>> 2. when I try & run ./transcoder_proxy.pl get following error message
>>
>> Couldn't bind to port 5123 at ./transcoder_proxy.pl line 42.
>>
>> At Softsqueeze level - all the menu's work etc BUT no audio
>>
>> At the web page level everything works ok - ie see HitchHikers come up -
>> entry in playlist ok - BUT no audio
>>
>> At CLI level audio was ok for about 5 minutes or so - but now running
>> into what sounds like skipping / washing machine wa wa effect ..
>>
>> anyway its getting there
>>
>> (transcoder_proxy.pl
>>
>> use alienstream = 1 doesn't produce audio ..
>>
>> if try "use aliensteam = 0 don't get any audio either )
>>
>> cheers
>>
>> Dave Scott
>>
>
>

Daniel Cohen
2004-10-16, 05:47
On 16/10/04 at 10:43 am +0100, Jules Taplin wrote
>I moved over to using mplayer instead of alienstream (don't know if
>that's practical for MacOS/X users

mplayer certainly exists for OS X.
--
Daniel Cohen

Dave Scott
2004-10-16, 05:54
Jules

might be able to use mplayer - have a problem at the moment in that it
gets stuck at 19.83% of buffer full ..

more importantly need to sort this error message - believe this is why
no audio in softsqueeze.

error message is:

when I try & run ./transcoder_proxy.pl get following error message

Couldn't bind to port 5123 at ./transcoder_proxy.pl line 42.

any ideas - tried changing port to 900 didn't work either

cheers

dave

On 16 Oct 2004, at 17:43, Jules Taplin wrote:

> Hi Dave.
>
> The skipping effect isn't unheard of. I've heard it on occasion, but
> not often, and very rarely (if at all) since I moved over to using
> mplayer instead of alienstream (don't know if that's practical for
> MacOS/X users).
>
> I've currently got it down to a problem in the codecs themselves, as I
> can't imagine how it might go wrong more widely.
>
>
>
> -- Jules
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Scott"
> <kiwidave (AT) starhub (DOT) net.sg>
> To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 4:45 AM
> Subject: [slim] Alien BBC on Mac OS X instructions(Longish)
>

Jules Taplin
2004-10-16, 07:53
Excellent. It might be a winner, then.

Can MacOS/X mplayer play realplayer streams? It's trivial to check - just
issue an 'mplayer -playlist <address of a .ram file>', and see if noise
comes out.

If it can, then it's very likely that alienBBC could run in mplayer mode on
MacOS/X, too. That'd be dead cool, as it's _MUCH_ less bother than
alienstream.

-- Jules

----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniel Cohen" <danco (AT) f2s (DOT) com>
To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 1:47 PM
Subject: [slim] Alien BBC on Mac OS X instructions(Longish)


> On 16/10/04 at 10:43 am +0100, Jules Taplin wrote
>>I moved over to using mplayer instead of alienstream (don't know if that's
>>practical for MacOS/X users
>
> mplayer certainly exists for OS X.
> --
> Daniel Cohen
>

Jules Taplin
2004-10-16, 07:54
Hi Dave.

The 'can't bind to 5123' message is normally because there's already a
transcoder process running. You need to find them all ('ps' is probably your
friend, but I'm not a MacOS/X expert), and kill them all off. Then start one
that you can watch. That's normally quite revealing. The other major
question is normally 'can it find a copy of LAME'?


-- Jules

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Scott" <kiwidave (AT) starhub (DOT) net.sg>
To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 1:54 PM
Subject: [slim] Alien BBC on Mac OS X instructions(Longish)


> Jules
>
> might be able to use mplayer - have a problem at the moment in that it
> gets stuck at 19.83% of buffer full ..
>
> more importantly need to sort this error message - believe this is why no
> audio in softsqueeze.
>
> error message is:
>
> when I try & run ./transcoder_proxy.pl get following error message
>
> Couldn't bind to port 5123 at ./transcoder_proxy.pl line 42.
>
> any ideas - tried changing port to 900 didn't work either
>
> cheers
>
> dave
>
> On 16 Oct 2004, at 17:43, Jules Taplin wrote:
>
>> Hi Dave.
>>
>> The skipping effect isn't unheard of. I've heard it on occasion, but not
>> often, and very rarely (if at all) since I moved over to using mplayer
>> instead of alienstream (don't know if that's practical for MacOS/X
>> users).
>>
>> I've currently got it down to a problem in the codecs themselves, as I
>> can't imagine how it might go wrong more widely.
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Jules
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Scott" <kiwidave (AT) starhub (DOT) net.sg>
>> To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 4:45 AM
>> Subject: [slim] Alien BBC on Mac OS X instructions(Longish)
>>
>
>

Dave Scott
2004-10-16, 08:11
Jules

ps is correct - but when i use it there is no transcoder process
running - cannot start it :-)

Even checked using OSX activity viewer - all processes - no sign of any
transcoder process

will have a lok at the transcoder_proxy.pl file again but i believe its
not able to start

cheers

dave

On 16 Oct 2004, at 22:54, Jules Taplin wrote:

> Hi Dave.
>
> The 'can't bind to 5123' message is normally because there's already a
> transcoder process running. You need to find them all ('ps' is
> probably your friend, but I'm not a MacOS/X expert), and kill them all
> off. Then start one that you can watch. That's normally quite
> revealing. The other major question is normally 'can it find a copy of
> LAME'?
>
>
> -- Jules

Daniel Cohen
2004-10-16, 13:30
On 16/10/04 at 3:53 pm +0100, Jules Taplin wrote
>Excellent. It might be a winner, then.
>
>Can MacOS/X mplayer play realplayer streams? It's trivial to check -
>just issue an 'mplayer -playlist <address of a .ram file>', and see
>if noise comes out.

I couldn't quite work out what to do.

There's an mplayer for OS X with a GUI, which is easily downloadable.
But it wouldn't play a ram file.

There's an unstable version of mplayer in the fink packages. But that
refused to download using Fink Commander.


There's a version described as "new binaries with full RealCodec
support" but this was rather complicated, and I couldn't work out
what to download.
--
Daniel Cohen

Jules Taplin
2004-10-17, 03:31
Hi Daniel.

Don't worry then. I don't tend to do anything with the GUI version of
mplayer, so I couldn't tell you how to play streams with it.

I'm sure that somewhere out there is a GUI hating, hard-core UNIX hacker
who's into OS/X and desparately wants to make AlienBBC work perfectly for
his OS of choice. We just haven't found him yet, which is why we've got the
odd set of instructions, and not much more.

-- Jules

----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniel Cohen" <danco (AT) f2s (DOT) com>
To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 16, 2004 9:30 PM
Subject: [slim] Alien BBC on Mac OS X instructions(Longish)


> On 16/10/04 at 3:53 pm +0100, Jules Taplin wrote
>>Excellent. It might be a winner, then.
>>
>>Can MacOS/X mplayer play realplayer streams? It's trivial to check - just
>>issue an 'mplayer -playlist <address of a .ram file>', and see if noise
>>comes out.
>
> I couldn't quite work out what to do.
>
> There's an mplayer for OS X with a GUI, which is easily downloadable. But
> it wouldn't play a ram file.
>
> There's an unstable version of mplayer in the fink packages. But that
> refused to download using Fink Commander.
>
>
> There's a version described as "new binaries with full RealCodec support"
> but this was rather complicated, and I couldn't work out what to download.
> --
> Daniel Cohen
>

Daniel Cohen
2004-10-17, 07:23
On 17/10/04 at 11:31 am +0100, Jules Taplin wrote
>I don't tend to do anything with the GUI version of mplayer, so I
>couldn't tell you how to play streams with it.


I later found out in the instructions that some other files had to be
downloaded from elsewhere to make the GUI version (any version,
probably) play Real files. I did download them and put them in the
relevant folder, but still no luck. I will try again after a restart,
in case that's needed to get them recognised.

>
>I'm sure that somewhere out there is a GUI hating, hard-core UNIX
>hacker who's into OS/X and desparately wants to make AlienBBC work
>perfectly for his OS of choice. We just haven't found him yet, which
>is why we've got the odd set of instructions, and not much more.


It should be possible, I agree.

One point (for you, and maybe also for others). Fink now comes with
Fink Commander, a GUI program that makes installation much easier
(for many of us) than using the command line. The trouble for me was
that mplayer itself seems part of an unstable distribution, and
perhaps because of that every mirror I tried fell over at some point.



--
Daniel Cohen

Daniel Cohen
2004-11-04, 01:15
I am in process of digitising a whole bunch of old reel-to-reel
tapes. I'll be able to play things at last that I haven't heard for
many years. I'm slowly bringing them into my computer and saving as
FLACs, so that I can post-process them if needed.

I plan to convert to MP3 once I am satisfied about the basic quality,
and have a few questions.

What bitrate should I use for the MP3? The original recordings were
done at the very slow speed (foolish of me) of one and seven-eight
inches per second. Mostly folk, folk-rock, etc, no classical music,
some jazz, country, rock, etc. I realise I can just experiment but
wondered if people had views. I suspect 192 is quite high enough, but
I'm wondering if (given original quality) even 64 might be enough, or
128.

Can I change the bitrate for transcoding FLACs (only, leaving MP3 and
AIFF as no limit) for playing through the Squeezebox, and if so how.
That would let me experiment without having to save different
versions of the same music.

Is there a simple way of converting (a bunch of) FLACs to MP3, or
does one have to decode to AIFF/WAV first? I am using a Mac G4, but
have access to a slow PC (Thinkpad 240).

I'll have some more questions later, but these will do for now.
--
Daniel Cohen

seanadams
2004-11-04, 03:09
If you're investing the time to rip from reel-to-reel, then IMHO you
should not settle for less than 320K MP3, or FLAC. Disks are cheap!


On Nov 4, 2004, at 12:15 AM, Daniel Cohen wrote:

> I am in process of digitising a whole bunch of old reel-to-reel tapes.
> I'll be able to play things at last that I haven't heard for many
> years. I'm slowly bringing them into my computer and saving as FLACs,
> so that I can post-process them if needed.
>
> I plan to convert to MP3 once I am satisfied about the basic quality,
> and have a few questions.
>
> What bitrate should I use for the MP3? The original recordings were
> done at the very slow speed (foolish of me) of one and seven-eight
> inches per second. Mostly folk, folk-rock, etc, no classical music,
> some jazz, country, rock, etc. I realise I can just experiment but
> wondered if people had views. I suspect 192 is quite high enough, but
> I'm wondering if (given original quality) even 64 might be enough, or
> 128.
>
> Can I change the bitrate for transcoding FLACs (only, leaving MP3 and
> AIFF as no limit) for playing through the Squeezebox, and if so how.
> That would let me experiment without having to save different versions
> of the same music.
>
> Is there a simple way of converting (a bunch of) FLACs to MP3, or does
> one have to decode to AIFF/WAV first? I am using a Mac G4, but have
> access to a slow PC (Thinkpad 240).
>
> I'll have some more questions later, but these will do for now.
> --
> Daniel Cohen
>

Neil Davidson
2004-11-04, 05:05
I agree with Sean. If you are pitting so much time into recording from
tape i wouldn't settle for anything less than pure FLAC. I would also be
tempted to archive them away on a second hard drive or DVD-R and store
them in a cupboard just in case.

>
> If you're investing the time to rip from reel-to-reel, then IMHO you
> should not settle for less than 320K MP3, or FLAC. Disks are cheap!
>
>
> On Nov 4, 2004, at 12:15 AM, Daniel Cohen wrote:
>
>> I am in process of digitising a whole bunch of old reel-to-reel tapes.
>> I'll be able to play things at last that I haven't heard for many
>> years. I'm slowly bringing them into my computer and saving as FLACs,
>> so that I can post-process them if needed.
>>
>> I plan to convert to MP3 once I am satisfied about the basic quality,
>> and have a few questions.
>>
>> What bitrate should I use for the MP3? The original recordings were
>> done at the very slow speed (foolish of me) of one and seven-eight
>> inches per second. Mostly folk, folk-rock, etc, no classical music,
>> some jazz, country, rock, etc. I realise I can just experiment but
>> wondered if people had views. I suspect 192 is quite high enough, but
>> I'm wondering if (given original quality) even 64 might be enough, or
>> 128.
>>
>> Can I change the bitrate for transcoding FLACs (only, leaving MP3 and
>> AIFF as no limit) for playing through the Squeezebox, and if so how.
>> That would let me experiment without having to save different versions
>> of the same music.
>>
>> Is there a simple way of converting (a bunch of) FLACs to MP3, or does
>> one have to decode to AIFF/WAV first? I am using a Mac G4, but have
>> access to a slow PC (Thinkpad 240).
>>
>> I'll have some more questions later, but these will do for now.
>> --
>> Daniel Cohen
>>

Daniel Cohen
2004-11-04, 07:05
On 4/11/04 at 2:09 am -0800, Sean Adams wrote
>If you're investing the time to rip from reel-to-reel, then IMHO you
>should not settle for less than 320K MP3, or FLAC. Disks are cheap!

Yes, I'ld considered this, but as I mentioned the original quality
wasn't great - I used a slow speed on the tape deck - and I have a
huge number of items so disk isn't all that cheap.

Also, I'm aging and my auditory discrimination may be dropping.
Certainly on a very quick check I could tell the difference between a
64K and 192K bitrate of the same item, but only just.
--
Daniel Cohen

seanadams
2004-11-04, 11:07
On Nov 4, 2004, at 6:05 AM, Daniel Cohen wrote:

> On 4/11/04 at 2:09 am -0800, Sean Adams wrote
>> If you're investing the time to rip from reel-to-reel, then IMHO you
>> should not settle for less than 320K MP3, or FLAC. Disks are cheap!
>
> Yes, I'ld considered this, but as I mentioned the original quality
> wasn't great - I used a slow speed on the tape deck - and I have a
> huge number of items so disk isn't all that cheap.
>

The funny thing about MP3/AAC/Ogg is that the sounds it has the most
difficulty with are actually noisy/scratchy/transient sounds.
Ironically, if your source is not perfect, it's all the more reason to
go with a 192-320 bit rate. Otherwise, those sounds are going to get
butchered pretty bad.

With a clean studio recording I think 192 VBR sounds damn good, but I'd
always use 320 for live shows and dubs.

Jack Coates
2004-11-04, 13:44
>
> On Nov 4, 2004, at 6:05 AM, Daniel Cohen wrote:
>
>> On 4/11/04 at 2:09 am -0800, Sean Adams wrote
>>> If you're investing the time to rip from reel-to-reel, then IMHO you
>>> should not settle for less than 320K MP3, or FLAC. Disks are cheap!
>>
>> Yes, I'ld considered this, but as I mentioned the original quality
>> wasn't great - I used a slow speed on the tape deck - and I have a
>> huge number of items so disk isn't all that cheap.
>>
>
> The funny thing about MP3/AAC/Ogg is that the sounds it has the most
> difficulty with are actually noisy/scratchy/transient sounds.
> Ironically, if your source is not perfect, it's all the more reason to
> go with a 192-320 bit rate. Otherwise, those sounds are going to get
> butchered pretty bad.
>
> With a clean studio recording I think 192 VBR sounds damn good, but I'd
> always use 320 for live shows and dubs.
>

absolutely true -- I went nuts trying to figure out how to make my MP3s of
Elliott Smith albums sound as good as the CDs, and it wasn't until I went
at 320 kbps that I got decent quality.

--
Jack At Monkeynoodle.Org: It's A Scientific Venture...
"Believe what you're told; there'd be chaos if everyone thought for
themselves." -- Top Dog hotdog stand, Berkeley, CA

Daniel Cohen
2004-11-05, 11:00
I've just been to the "Best of Stuff" exhibition in London, a show
about gadgets, mostly music players, TVs, etc.

Squeezebox was listed as one of the ten best products of the year.
Unfortunately it was just in a glass case with the other winners.
Last year there were more options to buy things, and I saw the Slimp3
for the first time. Luckily, though I liked it, I didn't feel like
buying at that time, and it turned out that the Squeezebox was
available shortly after.

The London Mac Expo is on in a couple of weeks, and I see that Roku
is listed as one of the exhibitors.
--
Daniel Cohen