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robotron2
2011-01-24, 20:31
It would be great if I could stream audio from my iPod Touch or iPad to the Squeezebox Server via Airplay.

Is Apple making it possible for third parties to build Airplay reception into their devices?

Has anyone pondered this...it could make a very cool plugin.

andyg
2011-01-24, 20:44
No, Apple does not make it possible.

garym
2011-01-25, 04:31
It would be great if I could stream audio from my iPod Touch or iPad to the Squeezebox Server via Airplay.

Is Apple making it possible for third parties to build Airplay reception into their devices?

Has anyone pondered this...it could make a very cool plugin.

but aren't all the tracks that are synched to your ipod or ipad already on your local computer and thus part of your SB server setup already? And any internet radio/pandora etc. from the ipod/ipad is also likely available direct from SbS. I'm not sure what this would add????

erland
2011-01-25, 11:53
No, Apple does not make it possible.

Can you in that case explain how other companies can do speakers and similar devices that support AirPlay ?
Sounds very similar to a Squeezebox supporting Airplay to me but I'm probably missing something obvious.

I realize Logitech needs to get a license to use it, but that sounds more like it's Logitech that doesn't want to pay than Apple making it impossible.
I also realize supporting AirPlay is a decision by the business people rather than the Logitech developers available on these forums.

erland
2011-01-25, 11:57
but aren't all the tracks that are synched to your ipod or ipad already on your local computer and thus part of your SB server setup already? And any internet radio/pandora etc. from the ipod/ipad is also likely available direct from SbS. I'm not sure what this would add????

Friend visiting who want me to hear a song on his/her iPhone maybe ?

For my local music library, which is available in SBS in FLAC format instead of the AAC/MP3 format on the iPhone, I'll of course play it through iPeng, Squeezepad or one of the other iPhone/iPad apps instead.

pski
2011-01-25, 16:14
Friend visiting who want me to hear a song on his/her iPhone maybe ?

For my local music library, which is available in SBS in FLAC format instead of the AAC/MP3 format on the iPhone, I'll of course play it through iPeng, Squeezepad or one of the other iPhone/iPad apps instead.

Rather than an airplay hook, why not make a "guest folder" that behaves similar to the "music folder" except that browsing it does not automajically add the tracts to the SBS database? Isn't the iTunes music folder available to a PC via a USB cable?

P

erland
2011-01-25, 22:04
Rather than an airplay hook, why not make a "guest folder" that behaves similar to the "music folder" except that browsing it does not automajically add the tracts to the SBS database? Isn't the iTunes music folder available to a PC via a USB cable?

P
It's only the older iPod's that appear as a mounted disk when attached to a computer, so this would work for most other portable players but not for iPod Touch, iPhone and iPad. Still, I don't want to bring a computer into the picture because my SBS computer might be in the basement so it might not be that easy to access its USB port from the living room. I want a wireless solution without a need to connecting a cable between my friends iPhone and my SBS computer.

However, it should also be said that I don't really have this need very often, so for me personally there are more important things to add to the Squeezebox system than support for AirPlay.

barisacar
2011-01-26, 10:56
Rather than an airplay hook, why not make a "guest folder" that behaves similar to the "music folder" except that browsing it does not automajically add the tracts to the SBS database? Isn't the iTunes music folder available to a PC via a USB cable?


A USB cable? Are you kidding? Have you completely misunderstood the point of AirPlay?! ;-) By that argument, there is no need for AirPlay at all - just use a dock.

Note also that one can AirPlay things from my ipod other than just music synced from iTunes. Several apps support streaming sound over AirPlay (such as Spotify, TuneIn Radio, etc - at least, so I'm told. I don't have an AirPlay device so haven't actually tried this myself).

andynormancx
2011-01-26, 11:38
Andy has said in a previous thread that Apple won't licence AirPlay to them.

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=594400&postcount=47

I'm guessing Apple aren't keen for people to integrate AirPlay into what is a competing eco system to the iTunes world.

wsmknicks
2011-02-02, 13:28
Isn't Apple now currently licensing AirPlay to all kinds of hardware manufacturers? I know this is a change from a few years ago.

It would be great to have AirPlay on my SBB!!!

pski
2011-02-02, 16:16
A USB cable? Are you kidding? Have you completely misunderstood the point of AirPlay?! ;-) By that argument, there is no need for AirPlay at all - just use a dock.

Note also that one can AirPlay things from my ipod other than just music synced from iTunes. Several apps support streaming sound over AirPlay (such as Spotify, TuneIn Radio, etc - at least, so I'm told. I don't have an AirPlay device so haven't actually tried this myself).

Of course I understand the point of AirPlay: to keep Apple kiddies in their own little corner listening to inferior quality music they all unquestioning buy from Apple..

bernt
2011-02-03, 00:17
I would love to have AirPlay on SBS even if I hate iTunes.

It would be a perfect way for my wife and kids (and guests) to play their lossy crap files (music) on the SB.

Don't want them to mess with my "perfect" database and my "perfect" flac library. ;)

pippin
2011-02-03, 00:59
Isn't Apple now currently licensing AirPlay to all kinds of hardware manufacturers?

The do. The question is: under which Terms & Conditions....

bpa
2011-02-03, 01:34
It's about competition and control.

AFAIK Apple hasn't made an AirPlay player for a PC.

Airplay video has been hacked as the protocol is fairly open (so far) and some basic non Apple clients have been built for Linux and Windows. If competitive products to AppleTV start supporting Airplay perhaps things may change.

Airplay audio still uses the old AirTunes protocol aka RAOP. This used to be open and a few open source projects were started and then the protocol was encrypted and development stopped. Although recently new efforts are being made to break the encryption such as RAOP support has been added to MPD but this approach won't help SBS support by Logitech.

garym
2011-02-03, 05:52
I would love to have AirPlay on SBS even if I hate iTunes.

It would be a perfect way for my wife and kids (and guests) to play their lossy crap files (music) on the SB.

Don't want them to mess with my "perfect" database and my "perfect" flac library. ;)

multilibrary plugin!

mflint
2011-04-11, 07:17
Airplay audio still uses the old AirTunes protocol aka RAOP. This used to be open and a few open source projects were started and then the protocol was encrypted and development stopped. Although recently new efforts are being made to break the encryption such as RAOP support has been added to MPD but this approach won't help SBS support by Logitech.

Given that the private key has been discovered and that an open-source AirPlay replacement has been released, I guess (hope!) it won't be long before a 3rd-party SqueezeCenter plugin appears...

http://mafipulation.org/blagoblig/2011/04/08

jackaninny
2011-04-11, 16:43
It's about competition and control.

AFAIK Apple hasn't made an AirPlay player for a PC.

Airplay video has been hacked as the protocol is fairly open (so far) and some basic non Apple clients have been built for Linux and Windows. If competitive products to AppleTV start supporting Airplay perhaps things may change.

Airplay audio still uses the old AirTunes protocol aka RAOP. This used to be open and a few open source projects were started and then the protocol was encrypted and development stopped. Although recently new efforts are being made to break the encryption such as RAOP support has been added to MPD but this approach won't help SBS support by Logitech.

Apple didn't/hasn't released a version to stream TO a computer only FROM a computer to an iOS device. In order to go that direction your need AirPlayer or AirFrame (iOS to iOS). JBL is shipping their speaker/dock that is AirPlay enabled (http://www.onair.jbl.com/usa_onair.aspx) and Denon has a AV receiver. It's been confirmed that Apple does license AirPlay for audio (video is rumored to be coming soon) but it seems it's only for hardware at this point. Since Apple doesn't make their own speakers, televisions, AV equipment I doubt it's about competition - more likely just behind the curve on a broad rollout for the program itself.

jovapo
2011-04-19, 07:23
What about a solution like sonos is using? Is there any elegant way to do this using either a server box or sqeezebox?

http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/19/sonos-adds-airplay-support-as-android-controller-app-hits-the-ma/

The squeezebox radio has ethernet and line in.

andynormancx
2011-04-19, 09:01
The line in on the Radio is just connected to the amp, the Radio has no way of sampling the audio input to the line in jack.

erland
2011-04-19, 09:53
What about a solution like sonos is using? Is there any elegant way to do this using either a server box or sqeezebox?

http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/19/sonos-adds-airplay-support-as-android-controller-app-hits-the-ma/

The squeezebox radio has ethernet and line in.

Would people be willing to buy an Airport Express just to get AirPlay support through their Squeezebox ?

Feels like the solution discussed in the following thread sounds a lot better. It can of course only be provided by third parties as it probably balances on the border between legal/illegal which will make it impossible for Logitech to provide it, but still.
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=86972

If you have an AirPort Express, you can always connect its line out to the line in in the computer running SBS and use the Wave Input plugin. That probably works already today but it might be a bit too user unfriendly to setup so that probably makes it a less interesting path.

For me the only purpose of AirPlay support in Squeezebox is to:
1. To make it possible to stream audio from friends mobile phones
2. To make it possible to stream audio from third party iOS apps/services which isn't available on Squeezebox. As an example, YouTube might be of interest if AirPlay is able to stream only the audio from the iOS YouTube app, but I'm not completely sure this is possible, it probably require an AirPlay devices that also support video.

I don't have any need to stream locally stored music from my iOS devices as I already have that music in my SBS library.

jackaninny
2011-04-19, 10:14
Sonos just added Airplay support to their current line via an Airport Express setup.

Press Blurb:
http://zd.net/glJRJX

andynormancx
2011-04-19, 12:06
Sonos just added Airplay support to their current line via an Airport Express setup.
That at least answers the "will they licence AirPlay to competing music streaming hardware companies" question at least, assuming the report is accurate about what they are actually doing.

andynormancx
2011-04-19, 12:13
I was right to be somewhat suspicious of the announcement, it isn't quite what it appears. Sonos aren't really implementing AirPlay. They are just plugging an AirPort Express into the line in on one of their boxes.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/19/sonos-adds-airplay-support-as-android-controller-app-hits-the-ma/

So the question is still open ;)

andynormancx
2011-04-19, 12:16
It would be nice if Sonos' claims in they press release were correct:

"Different songs in different rooms, Sonos-style: Only on Sonos can you play different music from your iTunes® library in different rooms of the home. And it's been that way since 2005."

Unless I'm very much mistaken Squeezeboxes have also been able to do that for a long time.

jackaninny
2011-04-19, 12:19
I was right to be somewhat suspicious of the announcement, it isn't quite what it appears. Sonos aren't really implementing AirPlay. They are just plugging an AirPort Express into the line in on one of their boxes.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/19/sonos-adds-airplay-support-as-android-controller-app-hits-the-ma/

So the question is still open ;)

Apple has said they are licensing Airplay (both audio and video streams) but it's a hardware AND software combo system. Obviously Sonos can't change their hardware in the field so they are using the Airport Express to bootstrap the software upgrade they just sent out.

http://bit.ly/gornMF

mflint
2011-04-19, 12:55
It would be nice if Sonos' claims in they press release were correct:

"Different songs in different rooms, Sonos-style: Only on Sonos can you play different music from your iTunes® library in different rooms of the home. And it's been that way since 2005."

Unless I'm very much mistaken Squeezeboxes have also been able to do that for a long time.

That's very cheeky, and they must know it's lies...

antagron
2011-04-20, 06:03
I don't like Apple or iTunes or any of this. however, a number of new receivers from Onkyo, Denon, etc. are supporting AirPlay and it would be nice to use one of them as an addition to the Squeezebox network and let me put one of my SB units in another room. Thoughts?

amcluesent
2011-04-21, 09:31
>Thoughts<

AFAIK the AV Receivers you mention are supporting UPnP and Squeezebox Server 7.6 (now in beta) should provide a UPnP server facility.

srcshelton
2011-04-25, 08:55
Airplay works, and I'm listening to iTunes via my Squeezebox right now:

http://blog.stuart.shelton.me/archives/762

:D

mflint
2011-04-25, 09:34
Airplay works, and I'm listening to iTunes via my Squeezebox right now:

http://blog.stuart.shelton.me/archives/762

:D

Great write-up! I started putting together a plugin, so will incorporate your instructions into it :)

https://github.com/mflint/SquairPlay

Matthew

srcshelton
2011-04-25, 17:16
I was still defeated by this forum's "More replies below current depth..." threading model... man that's complicated. How does anyone ever find a reply?!


I've added a few comments to my article - I'm not sure your custom-convert.conf is right, but I think that's on your To-dos (there seems to be a typo on FLAC - you have a 44k sample-rate, rather than 44.1k?)

Plugin.pm is still referencing plugins/WaveInput/, by the way ;)

I've had no problems with fragility, quality, or skipping - just the very occasional pause. Is there an issue with hairtunes using different ports? I was under the impression that it was always UDP port 5000?

Great work, though!

mflint
2011-04-25, 23:10
Yes, I was aware there would be issues as it was a very quickly hacked-together proof of concept. Thanks for the feedback :-)

The hairtunes pipe support was added specifically for SBS integration...

srcshelton
2011-04-26, 03:08
The hairtunes pipe support was added specifically for SBS integration...

Excellent - I assumed it was for Macs...

Any thoughts on whether there's any sensible way to multiplex multiple clients? You wouldn't want more than one playing at once, but if one client is connected but idle then it would be handy if another could connect and play.

The current hack I'm considering is simply having a regular task which erases and recreates the named pipe if its mtime/ctime is older than a specified timeout... race-conditions abound, but hairtunes will re-open the pipe if it's disconnected when it next receives data.

ralphy
2011-04-30, 12:28
Airplay works, and I'm listening to iTunes via my Squeezebox right now:

http://blog.stuart.shelton.me/archives/762

:D

Your blog has been down with a database error for several days now.

I'd like to suggest a small change to custom-convert.conf so that the wave input plugin is still usable for other audio input devices.

Instead of hard coding the named pipe path in the config file change it to $FILE$ and then use the named pipe path in the airplay favourite in SBS. You need to remove the alsa, prefix and define it in as part of the favourite for other audio devices.

Here an example from my custom convert. Note it's for 7.3.4 as I no longer have the original file from your site.


#
# wavin
#
wavin wav * *
# R
[ecasound] -q -z:db -b:4096 -f:16,2,44100 -i $FILE$ -o stdout
wavin mp3 * *
# RB:{BITRATE=-B %B}
[ecasound] -q -z:db -b:4096 -f:16,2,44100 -i $FILE$ -o stdout | [lame] --silent -r -x -q $QUALITY$ -b $BITRATE$ - -
wavin flc * *
# R
[ecasound] -q -z:db -b:4096 -f:16,2,44100 -i $FILE$ -o stdout | [flac] -cs --totally-silent --endian=little --channels=2 --sign=signed --bps=16 --sample-rate=44100 --compression-level-0 -


To connect to airplay define the favourite like this, changing the named pipe full path to match your setup.


wavin:/var/lib/squeezecenter/airplay-fifo.raw

to use the wave input plugin with alsa devices use need to add the alsa, prefix before the device.


wavin:alsa,hw0,0

srcshelton
2011-05-01, 03:12
Yeah - I upgraded to the latest Wordpress release, and it killed my settings file :(

You make a good point, though. The reason that I didn't do this is twofold: The audio quality via AO on my system (lacking Digital Recording facilities and so affected by a great deal of noise from the floating microphone input) was so poor that I'd never use it, and because I didn't feel that this form of low-level OS configuration should be exposed to (and therefore breakable by!) the Squeezebox Server user.

Having said all of this, I have only one Squeezebox player - I can see how you may want each player reading from a different pipe in order to enable many connected iTunes/iOS clients to be playing different audio streams to many players, then you would need a change as you described.

Cheers,

Stuart

analographi
2011-06-13, 07:11
Just to clear everything up here.

1: ANY router can do Airplay between airplay capable devices (only airport express can be used as an airport-analog-output-endpoint)

2: If squeezebox wants to support airplay, it can. Apple allows it through a third party. Don't know how much it will cost logitech though. http://www.bridgeco.com/apple-airplay/

3: Squeezeserver actually doesn't need to have anyhting to do with airplay. Each squeezebox could be a standalone airplay device that shows up as speakers for any airplay source like iphone, ipad etc.

4: Itunes actually doesn't need to be any part in this either. For example: Wirless network with ANY router. iphone connected, squeezebox connected (no server, no pc, no mac) IF the squeezebox was a true airplay device the iphone could stream DIRECTLY to the squeezebox.


Bottom line: a firmware update could turn any squeezi into a true airplay endpoint to which we could stream from iphones, ipods, ipads or those who want itunes.

Personally I think if logitech doesn't do that they really risk something. They can make the squeezebox a valid accessory for apple devices and at the same time be what they are. For what is worth, I will not buy another squeezi if they aren't going airplay. I will just get an appletv and use it for audio only. I can put a death cheap appletv in any room in the house and stream from my iphone to it whenever and whereever I am. I'd love if the squeezi could do it, but if they dont, its my last one.

A company does always good if they keep it compatible with as many services as possible. Ignoring airplay would be a huge mistake.

analographi
2011-06-13, 07:12
No, Apple does not make it possible.

wrong.
YOU don't make it possible!

You don't even have to license with apple!

You can license with them:
http://www.bridgeco.com/apple-airplay/

Apple has partnered with them:
http://www.tuaw.com/2010/09/09/with-airplay-apple-opens-itunes-software-to-a-3rd-party/

toby10
2011-06-13, 07:29
.......
2: If squeezebox wants to support airplay, it can. Apple allows it. Don't know how much it will cost logitech though......

I don't know about Airplay, but SqueezeBox asked Apple for years to license iTunes DRM support for it's players. Apple's response was a definitive "no".

toby10
2011-06-13, 07:52
.....
A company does always good if they keep it compatible with as many services as possible. Ignoring airplay would be a huge mistake.

Yet Apple does not have native FLAC support.

Within reason I agree "more is better" which in turn means more options to the user and the market in general. But if licensing for every possible closed source system out there (Apple, Zune, etc..) means driving up the price of the players, then I say forget it.

It is rather comical, albeit sad also, the number of Apple and Zune users who come to these and other forums related to streaming music systems only to find out they are stuck with the hardware devices and limitations of the format they have bought into. Obviously they are seeking additional options, variety, features and choices to enjoy their music on other platforms, only to find out such platforms are not available too them based on restrictions set forth by their chosen platform source (i.e. Apple, Zune).

erland
2011-06-13, 11:00
Based on my experience, it's going to take time before we see anything official from Logitech regarding this, it always tends to get complicated as soon as business agreements are required.

While we wait, there is always the already working third party AirPlay solution for Squeezebox:
http://blog.stuart.shelton.me/archives/762

It's a bit technical at the moment, but I'm sure it will improve pretty fast as most other third party stuff tends to do around here.

pippin
2011-06-13, 11:16
I don't know about Airplay, but SqueezeBox asked Apple for years to license iTunes DRM support for it's players. Apple's response was a definitive "no".

How do you know that? There are other things to prohibit agreements than a definite "no".

toby10
2011-06-13, 12:09
How do you know that? There are other things to prohibit agreements than a definite "no".

It was mentioned in here by one of the developers years ago.
The general gist of the response was "we've tried a number of times to discuss licensing with Apple/iTunes and we will continue to ask, but they won't cooperate".

pippin
2011-06-13, 12:24
OK, on AirPlay Apple wants to cooperate and does so with a number of companies.
The biggest hurdle I can see for a company who wants to use this is that Apple doesn't require just a license or something but that you also have to buy the chipset from their supplier. That can be a bummer.

paulster
2011-06-13, 12:33
The biggest hurdle I can see for a company who wants to use this is that Apple doesn't require just a license or something but that you also have to buy the chipset from their supplier. That can be a bummer.
The gist I got from speaking indirectly to someone who's been doing some development work on a similar thing is that Apple won't give you the DRM keys if you license it - you have to take the chipset with it already programmed.

If that is still the case despite the key now having been cracked then it's going to make it a non-starter for any existing Squeezebox products, so it could only possibly be for new products anyway.

I think the plug-in solution is the neatest idea anyway as it opens it up to all of the product line.

astfre0
2011-06-17, 08:38
Get ShairPlay4w, configure and install it as service (at least true if you are running a Windows box as Squeeze server), do sound setup, then enable the WaveInput Plugin and create a favourite. Done!
Works like a charm. :-)

Oh... Make sure you have valid Sound I/O on the server first. I had to actually buy a soundcard to get it. Not that easy to set up virtual sound card drivers on Win2008R2..

RadBadMark
2011-06-17, 12:50
wrong.
You don't even have to license with apple!

You can license with them:
http://www.bridgeco.com/apple-airplay/

Apple has partnered with them:
http://www.tuaw.com/2010/09/09/with-airplay-apple-opens-itunes-software-to-a-3rd-party/

Of course you have to have a license with Apple! Bridgeco wouldn't be allowed to deal with you if you didn't, and anything that has Airplay in needs to be tested and certified by Apple themselves before it can be sold.

Bridgeco are in the business of selling silicon and provide the hardware platform that's capable of Airplay, they don't (and wouldn't be allowed to) provide the software stack that runs on it for integration into anybody elses platform.


Bottom line: a firmware update could turn any squeezi into a true airplay endpoint to which we could stream from iphones, ipods, ipads or those who want itunes.

This is very true from a technical point of view and would be fairly trivial to implement ..but as has been mentoned already - whether Logitech would want it, and whether Apple would licence it for integration into the squeezebox platform is another thing entirely :)

jovapo
2011-06-18, 08:58
Get ShairPlay4w, configure and install it as service (at least true if you are running a Windows box as Squeeze server), do sound setup, then enable the WaveInput Plugin and create a favourite. Done!
Works like a charm. :-)

Oh... Make sure you have valid Sound I/O on the server first. I had to actually buy a soundcard to get it. Not that easy to set up virtual sound card drivers on Win2008R2..

Where do you get shairplay for windows? All I can find is for linux. Do you have instructions for this step you can link to?

ralphy
2011-06-19, 04:22
Where do you get shairplay for windows? All I can find is for linux. Do you have instructions for this step you can link to?

http://sourceforge.net/projects/shairport4w/files/

analographi
2011-07-22, 14:49
Of course you have to have a license with Apple! Bridgeco wouldn't be allowed to deal with you if you didn't, and anything that has Airplay in needs to be tested and certified by Apple themselves before it can be sold.

Bridgeco are in the business of selling silicon and provide the hardware platform that's capable of Airplay, they don't (and wouldn't be allowed to) provide the software stack that runs on it for integration into anybody elses platform.



I don't think you are right about that. Could you please quote, support that statement with links?

pippin
2011-07-23, 01:04
The statement _IS_ correct and no, I can not provide links and maybe nobody can, so you have to believe it or not. Sometimes the Internet is simpky NOT the best source of information.

But please have a look for only a single AirPlay product that has a different chipset or uses an pre-existing WiFi design.

toby10
2011-07-23, 03:15
Apple is, as Apple does, as Apple limits. ;)

robotron2
2012-01-22, 15:23
I started this thread a year ago -- how great that so many smart people have made real progress on Airplay.

In the interest of full disclosure, the reason I was interested in it is because I've found my iPod touch is actually the best device I can find to manage all my podcasts through the Downcast app. For me, it's really about NON MUSIC audio. So, it's nice to be able to just continue to listen to a podcast that say I was already listening to in my car. And the multiroom feature of SB would be useful in this case, because I could have the podcast going everywhere in my house, making it easy to have something going in the background. Same is true of audiobooks etc...easier if you just use one device rather than having the same audio on both SB server as well as the device and trying to figure out where you left off.

But I also agree, I think it's cool if someone comes over with their iPhone or iPod and they could instantly be the whole home DJ through Airplay! Great idea.

pski
2012-01-22, 15:37
What would Airplay add?

paulster
2012-01-22, 15:42
What would Airplay add?

It would appear as a remote playback device to the iPod Touch, iPhone and iPad, so you'd be able to stream music, etc. to the Squeezebox system direct from the iDevice.

Great in the audiobooks example above or when friends come over with new music they want you to listen to.

DaveWr
2012-01-23, 07:46
The statement _IS_ correct and no, I can not provide links and maybe nobody can, so you have to believe it or not. Sometimes the Internet is simpky NOT the best source of information.

But please have a look for only a single AirPlay product that has a different chipset or uses an pre-existing WiFi design.

All Linn DS products now with Davaar firmware support Airplay. Absolutely no hardware changes at all.

bernt
2012-01-23, 07:53
Vortexbox player had AirPlay for a while. Software only.

XBMC has AirPlay support.

RadBadMark
2012-03-15, 09:23
All Linn DS products now with Davaar firmware support Airplay. Absolutely no hardware changes at all.


Vortexbox player had AirPlay for a while. Software only.

XBMC has AirPlay support.

As has already been said the software is trivial to do, that's not the issue, and providing unofficial software support based on reverse engineering is entirely different to having an officially sanctioned product. I can't imagine Linn are an Apple technology licensee so they have nothing to lose (except money if the lawyers are set on them!), but Logitech will be under signed agreements and no doubt have lots of current and future products in the market based on those licences.

Even now, a year on, as far as I'm aware airplay on consumer devices is still only available on a single hardware platform.

Mnyb
2012-03-15, 09:43
For example computer peripherals of all kind mice keyboards and webcams and other stuff.
Don't think they wan't to risk upsetting Apple .
And iPod docks to..

pippin
2012-03-15, 11:56
Vortexbox player had AirPlay for a while. Software only.

XBMC has AirPlay support.

But you are aware that strictly speaking in some countries that support violates a number of laws (including most of Europe and the US) because it uses cracked DRM passwords. The only reason you can still provide is that Apple generally doesn't care about these things as long as they don't hurt their sales directly

jdoering
2012-03-15, 23:57
But you are aware that strictly speaking in some countries that support violates a number of laws (including most of Europe and the US) because it uses cracked DRM passwords. The only reason you can still provide is that Apple generally doesn't care about these things as long as they don't hurt their sales directly

While it's clear why all of this is out-of-bounds for Logitech; I think that concluding that this support violates a number of laws (for US anyway) is overstepping given that Apple has not challenged it and laws regarding this stuff are very complicated (e.g. DCMA - note that iPhone jailbreaking was explicitly added as an exception. Different than this case, yes, but the point is that the whole legal area is far from clear).

Anyway, Logitech obviously licenses Apple stuff legitimately and wouldn't have interest in gray areas. But there's no reason to make legal assumptions on third-party choices that aren't being legally challenged (or to discourage such third-party development based on hypotheticals).

pippin
2012-03-16, 02:12
The code in AirPlay is there to provide copy protection so cracking it means you are removing DRM. I'm not a lawyer and can't really judge on DMCA but in Germany. That's clearly illegal, it's a common case for DVD ripping software which is very similar (uses a cracked one-time code to read the DVD).