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magiccarpetride
2010-10-18, 09:29
My Touch finally arrived last Friday! Immediately, I've noticed an incredible improvement in the sound quality over my Squeezebox Duet. I am driving both Duet and Touch into my Beresford Caiman DAC, and the digital source coming out of Touch is so superior to the signal out of Duet, it's simply unbelievable. I can't fathom that the difference in the digital transport alone can be that significant.

One issue: on the Duet, I have disabled the digital volume control. Both on the remote, and on the localhost:9000 (the server), I went in and disabled the volume control. I found that by doing that, the sound gets much clearer and firmer.

Now switching to Touch, I did the same, but Touch seems to be ignoring that setting. I can still reduce the volume on Touch, even though I've specified that it should not be possible to do so.

I'm now worried that something could be messed up. Why would Touch ignore the settings?

Phil Leigh
2010-10-18, 09:50
My Touch finally arrived last Friday! Immediately, I've noticed an incredible improvement in the sound quality over my Squeezebox Duet. I am driving both Duet and Touch into my Beresford Caiman DAC, and the digital source coming out of Touch is so superior to the signal out of Duet, it's simply unbelievable. I can't fathom that the difference in the digital transport alone can be that significant.

One issue: on the Duet, I have disabled the digital volume control. Both on the remote, and on the localhost:9000 (the server), I went in and disabled the volume control. I found that by doing that, the sound gets much clearer and firmer.

Now switching to Touch, I did the same, but Touch seems to be ignoring that setting. I can still reduce the volume on Touch, even though I've specified that it should not be possible to do so.

I'm now worried that something could be messed up. Why would Touch ignore the settings?

That setting is not available on the Touch. Just set volume to max. There is NO difference between max and disabled, sound wise.

aubuti
2010-10-18, 09:52
This thread may be helpful for you: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=77837

andynormancx
2010-10-18, 09:54
That setting is not available on the Touch. Just set volume to max. There is NO difference between max and disabled, sound wise.

Shame, because apparently the same setting on the Duet makes the sound "much clearer and firmer". Those ones and zeros must be better formed then the player knows it can never be turned down from 100% volume.

Mnyb
2010-10-18, 10:06
Shame, because apparently the same setting on the Duet makes the sound "much clearer and firmer". Those ones and zeros must be better formed then the player knows it can never be turned down from 100% volume.

It's a bug it's fixed in 7.6 comming soon .

fyi in the duet or all other squeezebox players 100% volume and fixed is the exact same thing have always been.

Try a DTS encoded track if one bit is wrong it breaks.

Btw do you have replay gain tags in your flac or mp3 files ?
This can make a substancial difference if gain adjustment is on in your squeezebox. Setting it to "fixed" in this case can make a big difference as some files get louder for example up to 10dB if it is a modern very compressed recording.
Go into settings and controll what you have se t regarding smart gain and similar (player settings).
Replay gain tags and squeezebox smart gain actually use the volume controll to level out the volume differences turn it off if you want the same bits out as you got in.

All fixed volume do is setting the volume to 100% and never let you touch it it's still there afaik.

People with the right tools can prove that it is bitperfect .

I can not hear any difference at all, nor should I

andynormancx
2010-10-18, 10:40
In case it wasn't obvious, I was being sarcastic ;)

magiccarpetride
2010-10-18, 11:05
Shame, because apparently the same setting on the Duet makes the sound "much clearer and firmer". Those ones and zeros must be better formed then the player knows it can never be turned down from 100% volume.

I know that there are absolutely no differences between setting the volume to the max and disabling the volume adjustment. Still, there is a difference between having your player just output the stream of bits vs having the player be constantly on the call and worrying about adjusting the gain etc.

The less your player is capable of doing, the clearer will the signal be, and the lower the noise floor will be. I'm using Touch as a digital transport only, so I'd like it to focus on that task alone. I don't want him to be Jack of all trades and master of none.

For example, one of the tweaks you can do is reconfigure mysqueezebox server (http://localhost:9000) to convert FLAC to PCM using the computer CPU. That way, Touch is relived from that duty, which results in much better sound.

Also, another tweak is to commit to one output only (be it analog or digital), and to disable the other one. Also results in much better sound, because Touch has less things on the menu to worry about.

Some people can't hear the difference in the sound quality when presented with such tweaks. But then again, these are the people who cannot hear the difference between the sound coming out of a TV and the sound coming out of Touch etc.

Phil Leigh
2010-10-18, 11:17
I know that there are absolutely no differences between setting the volume to the max and disabling the volume adjustment. Still, there is a difference between having your player just output the stream of bits vs having the player be constantly on the call and worrying about adjusting the gain etc.

The less your player is capable of doing, the clearer will the signal be, and the lower the noise floor will be. I'm using Touch as a digital transport only, so I'd like it to focus on that task alone. I don't want him to be Jack of all trades and master of none.

For example, one of the tweaks you can do is reconfigure mysqueezebox server (http://localhost:9000) to convert FLAC to PCM using the computer CPU. That way, Touch is relived from that duty, which results in much better sound.

Also, another tweak is to commit to one output only (be it analog or digital), and to disable the other one. Also results in much better sound, because Touch has less things on the menu to worry about.

Some people can't hear the difference in the sound quality when presented with such tweaks. But then again, these are the people who cannot hear the difference between the sound coming out of a TV and the sound coming out of Touch etc.

Have you actually audiodiffed these tweaks? ... I have.

magiccarpetride
2010-10-18, 11:42
Have you actually audiodiffed these tweaks? ... I have.

Certainly. The Beatles 24-bit FLACs sound amazingly better if you disable FLAC on mysqueezebox server (http://localhost:9000) and force the server itself to do the conversion to PCM using the computer's CPU. The tradeoff is higher bandwidth requirement (the resulting files are much larger than FLAC), but I haven't noticed any adverse effects in my configuration.

But freeing up the Touch from the chores of doing any extra heavy lifting is definitely of a huge benefit to the resulting sound quality. I was now able to hear previously hidden nuances on songs such as "Glass Onion" etc. Flip back to forcing the Touch to deal with the FLAC natively, and all those nuances get masked by the noise introduced by the transport who's now forced to be messing with the FLAC.

Phil Leigh
2010-10-18, 12:01
Certainly. The Beatles 24-bit FLACs sound amazingly better if you disable FLAC on mysqueezebox server (http://localhost:9000) and force the server itself to do the conversion to PCM using the computer's CPU. The tradeoff is higher bandwidth requirement (the resulting files are much larger than FLAC), but I haven't noticed any adverse effects in my configuration.

But freeing up the Touch from the chores of doing any extra heavy lifting is definitely of a huge benefit to the resulting sound quality. I was now able to hear previously hidden nuances on songs such as "Glass Onion" etc. Flip back to forcing the Touch to deal with the FLAC natively, and all those nuances get masked by the noise introduced by the transport who's now forced to be messing with the FLAC.

Possibly if you are using the analogue outputs of the Touch - but the digital output is not changed by these tweaks.