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Aslak3
2010-05-08, 04:00
An obvious question maybe. :)

I personally would love to see a hybrid Boom/Touch, only with physical (and backlit) buttons like the Boom, with IR remote. Like the Radio but with awesome sound.

sleepysurf
2010-05-08, 05:41
I'd suggest the "Touch Plus" which would be a full (or half) rack width device with a WIDER (and more legible screen), high quality DAC, better analog output section, and both RCA and balanced outputs. Price it below the Transporter (say $600-700), and it will beat the pants off the Olive, Meridian/Sooloos, and other (forthcoming) streaming devices in that market segment.

sleepysurf
2010-05-08, 05:41
I'd suggest the "Touch Plus" which would be a full (or half) rack width
device with a WIDER (and more legible screen), high quality DAC, better
analog output section, and both RCA and balanced outputs. Price it
below the Transporter (say $600-700), and it will beat the pants off
the Olive, Meridian/Sooloos, and other (forthcoming) streaming devices
in that market segment.


--
sleepysurf

main system: touch > benchmark dac-1 > conrad-johnson ct-5 preamp and
premier 350 amp > ml summits. audience au24e and blue jeans cables.
secondary systems: sb3 in master br (russound r235ls amp driving
in-ceiling speaker) and game room (powered swan s200a speakers), with
boom in home office. member of 'the tampa bay listening society'
(http://www.thetbls.com/)
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Phil Leigh
2010-05-08, 06:00
sleepysurf;544605 Wrote:
> I'd suggest the "Touch Plus" which would be a full (or half) rack width
> device with a WIDER (and more legible screen), high quality DAC, better
> analog output section, and both RCA and balanced outputs. Price it
> below the Transporter (say $600-700), and it will beat the pants off
> the Olive, Meridian/Sooloos, and other (forthcoming) streaming devices
> in that market segment.

erm... the analogue output section of the Touch is already very
good...

I'd still like to see a 2-part Touch with detachable screen and wi-fi
(to use as a controller) - and larger screen of course... keep all of
the audio in the "docking/charging station" + twice as much CPU and RAM
as the current model


--
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Townsend Supertweeters, Blue
Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio
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Phil Leigh
2010-05-08, 06:00
I'd suggest the "Touch Plus" which would be a full (or half) rack width device with a WIDER (and more legible screen), high quality DAC, better analog output section, and both RCA and balanced outputs. Price it below the Transporter (say $600-700), and it will beat the pants off the Olive, Meridian/Sooloos, and other (forthcoming) streaming devices in that market segment.

erm... the analogue output section of the Touch is already very good...

I'd still like to see a 2-part Touch with detachable screen and wi-fi (to use as a controller) - and larger screen of course... keep all of the audio in the "docking/charging station" + twice as much CPU and RAM as the current model

bluegaspode
2010-05-08, 06:36
Controller MK2 (i.e. a Touch with batteries, a stand and just a Headphone Out)

bluegaspode
2010-05-08, 06:36
Controller MK2 (i.e. a Touch with batteries, a stand and just a
Headphone Out)


--
bluegaspode

1x SB-Controller+Receiver (Duet), 1xSB-Boom. 1xSB-Radio
Server (7.4.1) running on SheevaPlug (Ubuntu) with attached Western
Digital MyBook Essential.
Secondary 7.4 Server on Debianized Buffalo Linkstation LS-CHL.
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finnbrodersen
2010-05-08, 07:02
+1, controller version 2

on my wish list is

- battery life (at least 4h)

- display size and quality


One question to you guys, would you prefer the display to be landscape or portrait ?

finnbrodersen
2010-05-08, 07:02
+1, controller version 2

on my wish list is

- battery life (at least 4h)

- display size and quality


One question to you guys, would you prefer the display to be landscape
or portrait ?


--
finnbrodersen
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Phil Leigh
2010-05-08, 07:05
+1, controller version 2

on my wish list is

- battery life (at least 4h)

- display size and quality


One question to you guys, would you prefer the display to be landscape or portrait ?

Personally, landscape...

Phil Leigh
2010-05-08, 07:05
finnbrodersen;544632 Wrote:
> +1, controller version 2
>
> on my wish list is
>
> - battery life (at least 4h)
>
> - display size and quality
>
>
> One question to you guys, would you prefer the display to be landscape
> or portrait ?

Personally, landscape...


--
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Townsend Supertweeters, Blue
Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Skinny
2010-05-08, 07:28
+1, controller version 2
One question to you guys, would you prefer the display to be landscape or portrait ?

My initial reaction is that the Controller is much about dealing with long (tall) lists, therefore portrait. Of course, the Now playing screen would be more pleasant in landscape mode, but for actual usability I would choose portrait.

-Skinny

Skinny
2010-05-08, 07:28
finnbrodersen;544632 Wrote:
> +1, controller version 2
> One question to you guys, would you prefer the display to be landscape
> or portrait ?

My initial reaction is that the Controller is much about dealing with
long (tall) lists, therefore portrait. Of course, the Now playing
screen would be more pleasant in landscape mode, but for actual
usability I would choose portrait.

-Skinny


--
Skinny

This sentence says less than a list of audio equipment.
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Mnyb
2010-05-08, 08:14
id like to see a digital transport only product no dac's analog or headphone out, but 5.1 spdif or hdmi multi channel out. I want to play 5.1 24/96 Flac files .

Maybe only hdmi out, very few have processors with 3*spdif inputs for 5.1 ,but everybody and his brother is soon going to have hdmi wich has support for 8*24/192 pcm .

Or maybe a multichannel digital streamer / home theater preamp / processor.
with Ethernet input

Touch and transporter shows that slim/logitech has no respect for typical high end pricing and design ;) (well TP is a little high end pricy but not obscene and it has rack handles.. )

Time for a cute plasticy thing that wipes the floor with typical high end digital preamps and with open source software. Room acoustics compensation as an applet...

Mnyb
2010-05-08, 08:14
id like to see a digital transport only product no dac's analog or
headphone out, but 5.1 spdif or hdmi multi channel out. I want to play
5.1 24/96 Flac files .

Maybe only hdmi out, very few have processors with 3*spdif inputs for
5.1 ,but everybody and his brother is soon going to have hdmi wich has
support for 8*24/192 pcm .

Or maybe a multichannel digital streamer / home theater preamp /
processor.
with Ethernet input

Touch and transporter shows that slim/logitech has no respect for
typical high end pricing and design ;) (well TP is a little high end
pricy but not obscene and it has rack handles.. )

Time for a cute plasticy thing that wipes the floor with typical high
end digital preamps and with open source software. Room acoustics
compensation as an applet...


--
Mnyb

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J and assorted amps SiriuS,
Classe'Primare and Dynadio speakers (including a pair of Contour 4 )
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: SB3 + powered Fostex PM0.4
Miscellaneous use: Radio (with battery)
I use a Controller various ir-remotes and a Eee-PC with squeezeplay to
control this
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Phil Leigh
2010-05-08, 08:22
id like to see a digital transport only product no dac's analog or headphone out, but 5.1 spdif or hdmi multi channel out. I want to play 5.1 24/96 Flac files .

Maybe only hdmi out, very few have processors with 3*spdif inputs for 5.1 ,but everybody and his brother is soon going to have hdmi wich has support for 8*24/192 pcm .

Or maybe a multichannel digital streamer / home theater preamp / processor.
with Ethernet input

Touch and transporter shows that slim/logitech has no respect for typical high end pricing and design ;) (well TP is a little high end pricy but not obscene and it has rack handles.. )

Time for a cute plasticy thing that wipes the floor with typical high end digital preamps and with open source software. Room acoustics compensation as an applet...

Actually yes - having DRC capability on the audiophile product would be great!

Phil Leigh
2010-05-08, 08:22
Mnyb;544664 Wrote:
> id like to see a digital transport only product no dac's analog or
> headphone out, but 5.1 spdif or hdmi multi channel out. I want to play
> 5.1 24/96 Flac files .
>
> Maybe only hdmi out, very few have processors with 3*spdif inputs for
> 5.1 ,but everybody and his brother is soon going to have hdmi wich has
> support for 8*24/192 pcm .
>
> Or maybe a multichannel digital streamer / home theater preamp /
> processor.
> with Ethernet input
>
> Touch and transporter shows that slim/logitech has no respect for
> typical high end pricing and design ;) (well TP is a little high end
> pricy but not obscene and it has rack handles.. )
>
> Time for a cute plasticy thing that wipes the floor with typical high
> end digital preamps and with open source software. Room acoustics
> compensation as an applet...

Actually yes - having DRC capability on the audiophile product would be
great!


--
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Townsend Supertweeters, Blue
Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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pippin
2010-05-08, 08:51
A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

pippin
2010-05-08, 08:51
A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D


--
pippin

---
see iPeng, the Squeezebox iPhone remote, at penguinlovesmusic.com
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Mnyb
2010-05-08, 09:20
A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

If R2 is conceived an ethernet setup or usb or serial cable and a setup tool for the laptop would be nice.

what where they smoking ;) a device who's sole UI is a colored diode and one button.


Edit: Dude.. now it's purple ooh...

Mnyb
2010-05-08, 09:20
pippin;544676 Wrote:
> A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

If R2 is conceived an ethernet setup or usb or serial cable and a setup
tool for the laptop would be nice.

what where they smoking ;) a device who's sole UI is a colored diode
and one button.


Edit: Dude.. now it's purple ooh...


--
Mnyb

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J and assorted amps SiriuS,
Classe'Primare and Dynadio speakers (including a pair of Contour 4 )
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: SB3 + powered Fostex PM0.4
Miscellaneous use: Radio (with battery)
I use a Controller various ir-remotes and a Eee-PC with squeezeplay to
control this
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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sander
2010-05-08, 09:52
We were discussing in another thread that there probably won't be new devices for a while because most the of the developers are no longer at Logitech, but I'd really like to see the server stabilize and the Touch live up to its potential.

My biggest obstacle in recommending Squeezebox at this point is lack of stability and frequent changes in UI that have characterized the past couple of server releases.

That said if Logitech is no longer updating ip3k devices like the receiver and the boom, they really should refresh the controller, so it can be a better player.

sander
2010-05-08, 09:52
We were discussing in another thread that there probably won't be new
devices for a while because most the of the developers are no longer at
Logitech, but I'd really like to see the server stabilize and the Touch
live up to its potential.

My biggest obstacle in recommending Squeezebox at this point is lack of
stability and frequent changes in UI that have characterized the past
couple of server releases.

That said if Logitech is no longer updating ip3k devices like the
receiver and the boom, they really should refresh the controller, so it
can be a better player.


--
sander
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bhaagensen
2010-05-08, 12:38
Full/better support for WAN streaming, in particular to mobile devices. Seriously, this is going to make life so much easier for me and many others, and its getting more and more feasible for each passing day. Its doable now by various workarounds, hacks, and such. But imagine a fully Squeeze-integrated, plug'n play solution giving access to ones entire library on the go. :):)

Full support for WAN streaming to Squeeze*-devices is almost there, but a few improvements are needed security-wise. In particular encrypted authentication.

Mobile devices, which is really the main point, is more difficult. Firstly, what devices to support. One alternative is to make their own 3G enabled version of the Controller. This probably is too complicated, as it would likely require data-plans, and what not.

The second choice would be to develop clients for a few wisely chosen clients. Android and iPhone spring to mind :) Don't know whether its an option, but it would be cool if pippin and the other iPhone/Android-guys could be given resources to fully implement this.

I have a dream, and this is it :)

bhaagensen
2010-05-08, 12:38
Full/better support for WAN streaming, in particular to mobile devices.
Seriously, this is going to make life so much easier for me and many
others, and its getting more and more feasible for each passing day.
Its doable now by various workarounds, hacks, and such. But imagine a
fully Squeeze-integrated, plug'n play solution giving access to ones
entire library on the go. :):)

Full support for WAN streaming to Squeeze*-devices is almost there, but
a few improvements are needed security-wise. In particular encrypted
authentication.

Mobile devices, which is really the main point, is more difficult.
Firstly, what devices to support. One alternative is to make their own
3G enabled version of the Controller. This probably is too complicated,
as it would likely require data-plans, and what not.

The second choice would be to develop clients for a few wisely chosen
clients. Android and iPhone spring to mind :) Don't know whether its an
option, but it would be cool if pippin and the other iPhone/Android-guys
could be given resources to fully implement this.

I have a dream, and this is it :)


--
bhaagensen
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funkstar
2010-05-08, 14:18
We were discussing in another thread that there probably won't be new devices for a while because most the of the developers are no longer at Logitech, but I'd really like to see the server stabilize and the Touch live up to its potential.
I disagree. Now the Touch is out, I don't see why they couldn't rattle out a few variations based on the same internals. A larger screen version (7" like the O2 Joggler would be good), a Boom replacement (They already have the DSP and engineering done for the case, just haul out the SB3 based system and put a touch in there..... you get the idea. The majority of that is hardware development as the vast majory of the software is already in the Touch/Radio.

funkstar
2010-05-08, 14:18
sander;544694 Wrote:
> We were discussing in another thread that there probably won't be new
> devices for a while because most the of the developers are no longer at
> Logitech, but I'd really like to see the server stabilize and the Touch
> live up to its potential.
I disagree. Now the Touch is out, I don't see why they couldn't rattle
out a few variations based on the same internals. A larger screen
version (7" like the O2 Joggler would be good), a Boom replacement
(They already have the DSP and engineering done for the case, just haul
out the SB3 based system and put a touch in there..... you get the idea.
The majority of that is hardware development as the vast majory of the
software is already in the Touch/Radio.


--
funkstar

'[project log] funkstars digital lifestyle'
(http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-lifestyle/179882-project-log-funkstars-digital-lifestyle.html)
- 'hexus.community' (http://forums.hexus.net/)

*in use:* *1*x touch, *1*x boom, *2*x sb3, *1*x controller
*in a box:* *1*x radio, *1*x (beta) controller, *1*x receiver, *1*x sb2
wired (silver), *1*x sb (black), *1*x slimp3 (with rear shield)

if you have any others, let me know, i'm interested!!
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copperstate
2010-05-08, 14:52
A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

+1 for an easy standalone setup

A Radio where the alarm works flawlessly ... :D

copperstate
2010-05-08, 14:52
pippin;544676 Wrote:
> A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

A Radio where the alarm works flawlessly ... :D


--
copperstate
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maggior
2010-05-08, 17:46
My initial reaction is that the Controller is much about dealing with long (tall) lists, therefore portrait. Of course, the Now playing screen would be more pleasant in landscape mode, but for actual usability I would choose portrait.

-Skinny

How about something having both - if you rotate the controller that the display changes modes, from portrait to landscape and vice versa. My wife's iPod Nano behaves this way, which I thought was pretty cool.

maggior
2010-05-08, 17:46
Skinny;544643 Wrote:
> My initial reaction is that the Controller is much about dealing with
> long (tall) lists, therefore portrait. Of course, the Now playing
> screen would be more pleasant in landscape mode, but for actual
> usability I would choose portrait.
>
> -Skinny

How about something having both - if you rotate the controller that the
display changes modes, from portrait to landscape and vice versa. My
wife's iPod Nano behaves this way, which I thought was pretty cool.


--
maggior

Rich
---------
Setup: 2 SB3s, 4 Booms, 1 Duet, 1 Receiver, 1 Touch. SuSE 11.0 Server
running SqueezeBoxServer 7.5.0, MusicIP, and SqueezeSlave.
Current library stats: 33,060 songs, 2,656 albums, 484 artists.
http://www.last.fm/user/maggior
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iPhone
2010-05-08, 18:09
Since this is basically dreaming or wishing here goes:

1) Receiver II: based on a Touch without a display and no TinySC server/USB. Keep it upright so the WiFi antenna is vertical. Basically a Zone module that has 24/96 native output. Keep everything to a minimum to keep cost down as low as possible.

2) Boom II: A Boom with a Touch display.

3) Big Touch: A 7 inch touch tablet LCD with a 15 hour rechargeable battery. All NMP electronics in the base unit that is NOT a docking station. The base has Balanced Analog outs (plus RCAs and both Digital outs), built in powered USB Hub, two powerful CPUs one just for running a full built in server, 4GB of RAM, and an MSRP under $495. Sold as a single unit, no separates, no remotes, and the only accessory is a charging station because the base is not a docking station.

iPhone
2010-05-08, 18:09
Since this is basically dreaming or wishing here goes:

1) Receiver II: based on a Touch without a display and no TinySC
server/USB. Keep it upright so the WiFi antenna is vertical. Basically
a Zone module that has 24/96 native output. Keep everything to a
minimum to keep cost down as low as possible.

2) Boom II: A Boom with a Touch display.

3) Big Touch: A 7 inch touch tablet LCD with a 15 hour rechargeable
battery. All NMP electronics in the base unit that is NOT a docking
station. The base has Balanced Analog outs (plus RCAs and both Digital
outs), built in powered USB Hub, two powerful CPUs one just for running
a full built in server, 4GB of RAM, and an MSRP under $495. Sold as a
single unit, no separates, no remotes, and the only accessory is a
charging station because the base is not a docking station.


--
iPhone

*iPhone*
Media Room:
Transporter, VTL TL-6.5 Signature Pre-Amp, Ayre MX-R Mono's, VeraStarr
6.4SE 6-channel Amp, Vandersteen Speakers: Quatro Mains, VCC-5
Reference Center, four VSM-1 Signatures, Video: Runco RS 900 CineWide
AutoScope 2.35:1

Living Room:
Duet, ADCOM GTP-870HD, Cinepro 3K6SE III Gold, Vandersteen Model 3A
Signature, Two 2Wq subs, VCC-2, Two VSM-1

Kitchen: Squeezebox BOOM
Bedroom: Second Boom
Bathroom: Squeezebox Radio
Ford Thunderbird: Duet, Mac Mini
Ford Expedition: SB Touch, USB drive
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JJZolx
2010-05-08, 20:44
No more SqueezePlay based devices. What's the sense in bringing out another crippled device whose interface can't be customized in 1/2 the ways that a Squeezebox 1 could?

JJZolx
2010-05-08, 20:44
No more SqueezePlay based devices. What's the sense in bringing out
another crippled device whose interface can't be customized in 1/2 the
ways that a Squeezebox 1 could?


--
JJZolx

Jim
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maggior
2010-05-08, 21:10
JJZolx;544793 Wrote:
> No more SqueezePlay based devices. What's the sense in bringing out
> another crippled device whose interface can't be customized in 1/2 the
> ways that a Squeezebox 1 could?

I think the train had already left the station on that one...


--
maggior

Rich
---------
Setup: 2 SB3s, 4 Booms, 1 Duet, 1 Receiver, 1 Touch. SuSE 11.0 Server
running SqueezeBoxServer 7.5.0, MusicIP, and SqueezeSlave.
Current library stats: 33,060 songs, 2,656 albums, 484 artists.
http://www.last.fm/user/maggior
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maggior
2010-05-08, 21:10
No more SqueezePlay based devices. What's the sense in bringing out another crippled device whose interface can't be customized in 1/2 the ways that a Squeezebox 1 could?

I think the train had already left the station on that one...

JJZolx
2010-05-08, 21:21
I think the train had already left the station on that one...

Unfortunately. However Logitech may have done everyone a favor by someone realizing just how poor SqueezePlay is on every front and putting a final nail in its coffin.

When I saw the original complaints regarding the Controller it never dawned on me that the complete lack of options, and major deviations from the established SB interface and behavior would also plague the players that came afterward. And during the Touch beta I was always under that impression that the missing functionality might come later, after the initial release that took so long. Now I realize that it's not going to happen.

JJZolx
2010-05-08, 21:21
maggior;544794 Wrote:
> I think the train had already left the station on that one...

Unfortunately. However Logitech may have done everyone a favor by
someone realizing just how poor SqueezePlay is on every front and
putting a final nail in its coffin.

When I saw the original complaints regarding the Controller it never
dawned on me that the complete lack of options, and major deviations
from the established SB interface and behavior would also plague the
players that came afterward. And during the Touch beta I was always
under that impression that the missing functionality might come later,
after the initial release that took so long. Now I realize that it's
not going to happen.


--
JJZolx

Jim
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Mnyb
2010-05-08, 22:24
SqueezePlay has bigger problems than a rigid UI .

It may sound contra intuitive, but this "fat" players are slowing the whole system down for various reason , mainly that the players do to much "thinking" by them-self and the server sits there waiting.

And the use of a scripting language on a memory and cpu starved platform ?
Should it not at least be some kind of assembler code or compiled code ?

The slim devices has an edge when driven by a local server they are much more efficient.

Hopefully the customize squeezeplay UI bug is kept alive, there are some good ideas there.

I would like to turn of images for the playlist's on SqueePlay the NP screen can show it and album and artist views, but having to sit and wait for a controller to cache hundreds of tiny images for a playlist ?
it's enough with one on the NP screen.

So a wish for a more efficient and customizable squeeplay in the future.
It can be improved/changed, there is wast differences between SP as seen on the first controllers and what we have now regardless of which version you prefer it can be changed.

Mnyb
2010-05-08, 22:24
SqueezePlay has bigger problems than a rigid UI .

It may sound contra intuitive, but this "fat" players are slowing the
whole system down for various reason , mainly that the players do to
much "thinking" by them-self and the server sits there waiting.

And the use of a scripting language on a memory and cpu starved
platform ?
Should it not at least be some kind of assembler code or compiled code
?

The slim devices has an edge when driven by a local server they are
much more efficient.

Hopefully the customize squeezeplay UI bug is kept alive, there are
some good ideas there.

I would like to turn of images for the playlist's on SqueePlay the NP
screen can show it and album and artist views, but having to sit and
wait for a controller to cache hundreds of tiny images for a playlist
?
it's enough with one on the NP screen.

So a wish for a more efficient and customizable squeeplay in the
future.
It can be improved/changed, there is wast differences between SP as
seen on the first controllers and what we have now regardless of which
version you prefer it can be changed.


--
Mnyb

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J and assorted amps SiriuS,
Classe'Primare and Dynadio speakers (including a pair of Contour 4 )
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: SB3 + powered Fostex PM0.4
Miscellaneous use: Radio (with battery)
I use a Controller various ir-remotes and a Eee-PC with squeezeplay to
control this
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Aslak3
2010-05-09, 03:46
SqueezePlay has bigger problems than a rigid UI .

It may sound contra intuitive, but this "fat" players are slowing the whole system down for various reason , mainly that the players do to much "thinking" by them-self and the server sits there waiting.

And the use of a scripting language on a memory and cpu starved platform ?
Should it not at least be some kind of assembler code or compiled code ?

The slim devices has an edge when driven by a local server they are much more efficient.

Hopefully the customize squeezeplay UI bug is kept alive, there are some good ideas there.

I would like to turn of images for the playlist's on SqueePlay the NP screen can show it and album and artist views, but having to sit and wait for a controller to cache hundreds of tiny images for a playlist ?
it's enough with one on the NP screen.

So a wish for a more efficient and customizable squeeplay in the future.
It can be improved/changed, there is wast differences between SP as seen on the first controllers and what we have now regardless of which version you prefer it can be changed.

While I agree with some of your complaints, the use of a LUA in SqueezePlay is only as a "glue". 99% of the time a Radio/Touch whatever will be running compiled code - it will be playing music files, or it will be decoding jpgs, or it will be scaling them for display, or it will be displaying text. Unless I'm very much mistaken, these functions are all done in compiled C/C++. LUA is just a handy way of rapidly (from a dev point of view) linking all these low level parts to get it to do something useful. IMO this is is a sound method for bringing the product together.

My biggest complaint with SqueezePlay is the lack of customisation, and the fact that you can't configure as many things from SBS. At least on the Radio you can't change the size of the text, and this in particular is shameful.* But none of this, IMO, relates to the implementation. More likely, it's because Logitech don't think filling these holes will make them sell another unit.

* http://bugs.slimdevices.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15728

Aslak3
2010-05-09, 03:46
Mnyb;544802 Wrote:
> SqueezePlay has bigger problems than a rigid UI .
>
> It may sound contra intuitive, but this "fat" players are slowing the
> whole system down for various reason , mainly that the players do to
> much "thinking" by them-self and the server sits there waiting.
>
> And the use of a scripting language on a memory and cpu starved
> platform ?
> Should it not at least be some kind of assembler code or compiled code
> ?
>
> The slim devices has an edge when driven by a local server they are
> much more efficient.
>
> Hopefully the customize squeezeplay UI bug is kept alive, there are
> some good ideas there.
>
> I would like to turn of images for the playlist's on SqueePlay the NP
> screen can show it and album and artist views, but having to sit and
> wait for a controller to cache hundreds of tiny images for a playlist
> ?
> it's enough with one on the NP screen.
>
> So a wish for a more efficient and customizable squeeplay in the
> future.
> It can be improved/changed, there is wast differences between SP as
> seen on the first controllers and what we have now regardless of which
> version you prefer it can be changed.

While I agree with some of your complaints, the use of a LUA in
SqueezePlay is only as a "glue". 99% of the time a Radio/Touch whatever
will be running compiled code - it will be playing music files, or it
will be decoding jpgs, or it will be scaling them for display, or it
will be displaying text. Unless I'm very much mistaken, these
functions are all done in compiled C/C++. LUA is just a handy way of
rapidly (from a dev point of view) linking all these low level parts to
get it to do something useful. IMO this is is a sound method for
bringing the product together.

My biggest complaint with SqueezePlay is the lack of customisation, and
the fact that you can't configure as many things from SBS. At least on
the Radio you can't change the size of the text, and this in particular
is shameful.* But none of this, IMO, relates to the implementation.
More likely, it's because Logitech don't think filling these holes will
make them sell another unit.

* http://bugs.slimdevices.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15728


--
Aslak3

(SB 2, SB Boom, SB Radio)
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epoch1970
2010-05-09, 05:10
No more SqueezePlay based devices. What's the sense in bringing out another crippled device whose interface can't be customized in 1/2 the ways that a Squeezebox 1 could?

+1
- Fat players are subject to (un)planned obsolescence and do not serve the customer right.
- Trying to monkey the touch and feel of a smart phone is an error. Looks like phones are moving faster, they are "smarter" and cheaper. The competition for SP devices is an iTouch with a quality dock.
- Use of a non deterministic system on the player is an error. Put less experienced linux/web/... developers to the task and you just compound the issue.

(Add to that the impact of such changes to the current user and developer communities.)

What I want to see next:
- A slim device, with tremendous audio quality and ability to drive amp and devices. Services that make sense, like a high-res audio store, authorized covers and liner notes, print-on-demand album catalog, and exclusive access to higher quality radio streams. Color/touch screen is not mandatory. Deterministic behaviour, robustness, is.
- Serious effort put into the server, adding room correction, MusicIP-like capabilities, merging system actions and playlists, and last but not least power management. And why not roll an ISO/VM distro, and qualify a few brand computers?

I really don't know where the SB line is going, but I sure would like to know where the old team has gone.

epoch1970
2010-05-09, 05:10
--===============7374665678361227432==


JJZolx;544793 Wrote:
> No more SqueezePlay based devices. What's the sense in bringing out
> another crippled device whose interface can't be customized in 1/2 the
> ways that a Squeezebox 1 could?

+1
- Fat players are subject to (un)planned obsolescence and do not serve
the customer right.
- Trying to monkey the touch and feel of a smart phone is an error.
Looks like phones are moving faster, they are "smarter" and cheaper.
The competition for SP devices is an iTouch with a quality dock.
- Use of a non deterministic system on the player is an error. Put less
experienced linux/web/... developers to the task and you just compound
the issue.

(Add to that the impact of such changes to the current user and
developer community.)

What I want to see next:
- A slim device, with tremendous audio quality and ability to drive
amp and devices. Services that make sense, like a high-res audio store,
authorized covers and liner notes, print-on-demand album catalog, and
exclusive access to higher quality radio streams. Color/touch screen is
not mandatory.
- Serious effort put into the server, adding room correction,
MusicIP-like capabilities, merging system actions and playlists, and
last but not least power management. And why not roll an ISO/VM distro,
and qualify a few brand computers?

I really don't know where the SB line is going, but I sure would like
to know where the old team has gone.


--
epoch1970

Daily dose delivered by: 2 SB Classic (fw 130), 1 SB Boom (fw 50)
SqueezeCenter 7.3.4 (Debian 5.0) with plugins: ContextMenu,
SaverSwitcher by Peter Watkins Server Power Control by Gordon Harris
WeatherTime by Martin Rehfeld IRBlaster by Gwendesign (Felix)
FindArt, CDplayer by bpa BBC iPlayer, SwitchPlayer by Triode
PowerSave by Jason Holtzapple TrackStat by Erland Isaksson.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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--===============7374665678361227432==
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

peterw
2010-05-09, 07:20
While I agree with some of your complaints, the use of a LUA in SqueezePlay is only as a "glue". 99% of the time a Radio/Touch whatever will be running compiled code - it will be playing music files, or it will be decoding jpgs, or it will be scaling them for display, or it will be displaying text. Unless I'm very much mistaken, these functions are all done in compiled C/C++.

Where'd you get that idea? Aside from low-level audio processing (including DRM),
everything in the user interface and SBS/MySB control chains is Lua. Look at all the patches that have been release for Erland's Patch Installer applet -- those rely on the fact that the interesting stuff is done in Lua.

peterw
2010-05-09, 07:20
Aslak3;544853 Wrote:
> While I agree with some of your complaints, the use of a LUA in
> SqueezePlay is only as a "glue". 99% of the time a Radio/Touch whatever
> will be running compiled code - it will be playing music files, or it
> will be decoding jpgs, or it will be scaling them for display, or it
> will be displaying text. Unless I'm very much mistaken, these
> functions are all done in compiled C/C++.

Where'd you get that idea? Aside from low-level audio processing
(including DRM),
everything in the user interface and SBS/MySB control chains is Lua.
Look at all the patches that have been release for Erland's Patch
Installer applet -- those rely on the fact that the interesting stuff
is done in Lua.


--
peterw

http://www.tux.org/~peterw/
Free plugins: 'AllQuiet'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/AllQuiet.html) 'Auto Dim/AutoDisplay'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/AutoDisplay.html) 'BlankSaver'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/BlankSaver.html) 'ContextMenu'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/ContextMenu.html) 'DenonSerial'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/DenonSerial.html)
'FuzzyTime' (http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/FuzzyTime.html) 'KidsPlay'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/KidsPlay.html) 'KitchenTimer'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/KitchenTimer.html) 'PlayLog'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/PlayLog.html)
'PowerCenter/BottleRocket'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/PowerCenter.html) 'SaverSwitcher'
(http://www.tux.org/~peterw/slim/SaverSwitcher.html)
'SettingsManager'
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Aslak3
2010-05-09, 07:55
Where'd you get that idea? Aside from low-level audio processing (including DRM),
everything in the user interface and SBS/MySB control chains is Lua. Look at all the patches that have been release for Erland's Patch Installer applet -- those rely on the fact that the interesting stuff is done in Lua.

What I was meaning was that the "heavy lifting" is all done in C/C++ code.

To put it another way, if you rewrote all of the LUA code in C/C++ you would only save a small amount of CPU cycles because 99% of the time the CPU is running compiled code and NOT the UI or talking to SBS. The LUA code, is relatively speaking, light weight when compared to things like decoding JPGs or MP3. It might be critical, but it is "simple" for the CPU to do.

Look at the analog clock screensaver for a great example: the LUA script is tiny. All the clever stuff, such as rotating the images that represent the hands on the clock, is done in C via SDL. There is no sense in writing that glue code in anything other then a high level interpreted language like LUA, IMO.

I could well be wrong; I'm only vaguely familiar with SqueezePlay's guts, but that's how I see it.

Aslak3
2010-05-09, 07:55
peterw;544896 Wrote:
> Where'd you get that idea? Aside from low-level audio processing
> (including DRM),
> everything in the user interface and SBS/MySB control chains is Lua.
> Look at all the patches that have been release for Erland's Patch
> Installer applet -- those rely on the fact that the interesting stuff
> is done in Lua.

What I was meaning was that the "heavy lifting" is all done in C/C++
code.

To put it another way, if you rewrote all of the LUA code in C/C++ you
would only save a small amount of CPU cycles because 99% of the time
the CPU is running compiled code and NOT the UI or talking to SBS. The
LUA code, is relatively speaking, light weight when compared to things
like decoding JPGs or MP3. It might be critical, but it is "simple"
for the CPU to do.

Look at the analog clock screensaver for a great example: the LUA
script is tiny. All the clever stuff, such as rotating the images that
represent the hands on the clock, is done in C via SDL. There is no
sense in writing that glue code in anything other then a high level
interpreted language like LUA, IMO.

I could well be wrong; I'm only vaguely familiar with SqueezePlay's
guts, but that's how I see it.


--
Aslak3

(SB 2, SB Boom, SB Radio)
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upstatemike
2010-05-09, 09:42
+1

What I want to see next:
- A slim device, with tremendous audio quality and ability to drive amp and devices. Services that make sense, like a high-res audio store, authorized covers and liner notes, print-on-demand album catalog, and exclusive access to higher quality radio streams. Color/touch screen is not mandatory. Deterministic behaviour, robustness, is.
- Serious effort put into the server, adding room correction, MusicIP-like capabilities, merging system actions and playlists, and last but not least power management. And why not roll an ISO/VM distro, and qualify a few brand computers?


I agree... Maybe Logitech should take a year just to focus on fixing bugs and enhancing features in the current line before considering the release of any new products. As it stands now they seem happy to let even serious bugs sit unaddressed for years and then simply claim 'end-of-life" for the associated product.

upstatemike
2010-05-09, 09:42
epoch1970;544870 Wrote:
> +1
>
> What I want to see next:
> - A slim device, with tremendous audio quality and ability to drive
> amp and devices. Services that make sense, like a high-res audio store,
> authorized covers and liner notes, print-on-demand album catalog, and
> exclusive access to higher quality radio streams. Color/touch screen is
> not mandatory. Deterministic behaviour, robustness, is.
> - Serious effort put into the server, adding room correction,
> MusicIP-like capabilities, merging system actions and playlists, and
> last but not least power management. And why not roll an ISO/VM distro,
> and qualify a few brand computers?
>

I agree... Maybe Logitech should take a year just to focus on fixing
bugs and enhancing features in the current line before considering the
release of any new products. As it stands now they seem happy to let
even serious bugs sit unaddressed for years and then simply claim
'end-of-life" for the associated product.


--
upstatemike

6x SliMP3, 1x SB1, 2x SB2, 10x SB3, 2x SBR, 4x SBC, 1x Boom, 1x iPeng
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peterw
2010-05-09, 10:00
iPhone;544778 Wrote:
>
> 1) Receiver II: based on a Touch without a display and no TinySC
> server/USB.
> ...
>
> 3) Big Touch: A 7 inch touch tablet LCD with a 15 hour rechargeable
> battery. All NMP electronics in the base unit that is NOT a docking
> station.

1) Keep USB. Logitech admitted that omitting IR Blaster suuport in
Receiver v1 was a mistake. Adding USB would allow for both IR blasting
and control of RS232-equipped gear.
..
3) Sounds very good, but I'd also like a one-piece Squeezebox with no
battery. I've long wanted a nice-looking hackable digital picture
frame, and a 7" Squeezebox would be perfect.


--
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http://www.tux.org/~peterw/
Free plugins: 'AllQuiet'
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peterw
2010-05-09, 10:00
1) Receiver II: based on a Touch without a display and no TinySC server/USB.
...

3) Big Touch: A 7 inch touch tablet LCD with a 15 hour rechargeable battery. All NMP electronics in the base unit that is NOT a docking station.

1) Keep USB. Logitech admitted that omitting IR Blaster suuport in Receiver v1 was a mistake. Adding USB would allow for both IR blasting and control of RS232-equipped gear.
.
3) Sounds very good, but I'd also like a one-piece Squeezebox with no battery. I've long wanted a nice-looking hackable digital picture frame, and a 7" Squeezebox would be perfect.

Labarum
2010-05-09, 11:50
A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

Yes. Just a very basic box achieving the highest quality. Maybe a box without its own DAC, but that would not save much.

The Logitec "Airport Express" at about the same price.

Labarum
2010-05-09, 11:50
pippin;544676 Wrote:
> A receiver that can be set up without a Controller :D

Yes. Just a very basic box achieving the highest quality. Maybe a box
without its own DAC, but that would not save much.

The Logitec "Airport Express" at about the same price.


--
Labarum

Brian

In Southampton: my son's Marantz AV amp in Super Direct mode with B&W
684 (Not good!)
In Nicosia: Quad 405-2 refurbished by 405man - Quart 980s German Tower
Loudspeakers. Boom in conservatory.
http://www.hifi-wiki.de/index.php/MB_Quart_980_S
In both: Squeezebox Classic, Beresford Caiman DAC, Sony MDR-F1
Headphones
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erland
2010-05-09, 13:13
Things I don't want on the hardware side:
================================================== ==
- A server device is a dead end, it's better to rely on VortexBox appliance and similar devices for running TinySC. No reason for Logitech to focus on this area IMHO.
- A portable device is also a dead end, there is no way Logitech is going to be able to create better hardware than Apple iPod/iPad/iPhone and all the Android phones.
- A new controller with a touch screen might possibly be an option if it has the right price. Still, it will be very hard for Logitech to compete with iPad/iPod in this area.

Things that have some potential on the hardware side:
================================================== ==
+ A receiver device with playback support but no TinySC support might be interesting if it has the right price. If they try to make something that can run TinySC it's going to be too expensive. However, the problem with a headless device is the support headache of helping users who don't have a clue what the device is doing because there isn't a display. I suspect Logitech don't want to repeat the support situation they've had with the Duet.
+ A new 7-10" picture frame device without playback support to use as a large now playing screen. A touch screen will probably make it too expensive, just a Linux based open source picture frame with some hard button controls that will rule the world.

I'm not sure there is much besides the picture frame that I personally want on the hardware side. However, I suspect the picture frame position fairly soon is going to be filled by a iPad with iPeng, so Logitech better hurry if they like to fill this spot in my home.

Both the Radio and Touch are excellent devices which potential we haven't really seen yet.

However, to unleash that potential what we really need is some focus on the software and I want this focus to be directed at the music listening experience. Leave Facebook, twitter, image viewers and similar non music related stuff to third parties and focus on things like:
+ Better browse/search functionality
+ Better mixing functionality (replacement for MusicIP)
+ Better playlist management including support for smart playlists
+ Support for statistics such as ratings, play counts
+ Support for community based music browsing, find interesting music through your Squeezebox friends
+ Support for purchasing high quality music electronically (similar to iTunes Music Store)
+ Native Spotify support

I'd be happy to pay for some of these software features, I'd even be willing to pay a monthly subscription fee to Logitech for some of them.

No hardware is going to change the world with the current software status, it's the software that needs improvements to make the SqueezePlay based devices better.

Unfortunately, most of the software features listed above has been on many peoples wish lists several years now, so I don't really believe Logitech will start focusing on them now. Of course, I would be very happy if they proved me wrong regarding this and decided to put some focus on the music listening experience.

erland
2010-05-09, 13:13
Things I don't want on the hardware side:
================================================== ==
- A server device is a dead end, it's better to rely on VortexBox
appliance and similar devices for running TinySC. No reason for
Logitech to focus on this area IMHO.
- A portable device is also a dead end, there is no way Logitech is
going to be able to create better hardware than Apple iPod/iPad/iPhone
and all the Android phones.
- A new controller with a touch screen might possibly be an option if
it has the right price. Still, it will be very hard for Logitech to
compete with iPad/iPod in this area.

Things that have some potential on the hardware side:
================================================== ==
+ A receiver device with playback support but no TinySC support might
be interesting if it has the right price. If they try to make something
that can run TinySC it's going to be too expensive. However, the problem
with a headless device is the support headache of helping users who
don't have a clue what the device is doing because there isn't a
display. I suspect Logitech don't want to repeat the support situation
they've had with the Duet.
+ A new 7-10" picture frame device without playback support to use as a
large now playing screen. A touch screen will probably make it too
expensive, just a Linux based open source picture frame with some hard
button controls that will rule the world.

I'm not sure there is much besides the picture frame that I personally
want on the hardware side. However, I suspect the picture frame
position fairly soon is going to be filled by a iPad with iPeng, so
Logitech better hurry if they like to fill this spot in my home.

Both the Radio and Touch are excellent devices which potential we
haven't really seen yet.

However, to unleash that potential what we really need is some focus on
the software and I want this focus to be directed at the music listening
experience. Leave Facebook, twitter, image viewers and similar non music
related stuff to third parties and focus on things like:
+ Better browse/search functionality
+ Better mixing functionality (replacement for MusicIP)
+ Better playlist management including support for smart playlists
+ Support for statistics such as ratings, play counts
+ Support for community based music browsing, find interesting music
through your Squeezebox friends
+ Support for purchasing high quality music electronically (similar to
iTunes Music Store)
+ Native Spotify support

I'd be happy to pay for some of these software features, I'd even be
willing to pay a monthly subscription fee to Logitech for some of
them.

No hardware is going to change the world with the current software
status, it's the software that needs improvements to make the
SqueezePlay based devices better.

Unfortunately, most of the software features listed above has been on
many peoples wish lists several years now, so I don't really believe
Logitech will start focusing on them now. Of course, I would be very
happy if they proved me wrong regarding this and decided to put some
focus on the music listening experience.


--
erland

Erland Isaksson
'My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info) (Install my plugins through
Extension Downloader)
(Developer of 'TrackStat, SQLPlayList, DynamicPlayList, Custom Browse,
Custom Scan, Custom Skip, Multi Library, Title Switcher and Database
Query plugins'
(http://wiki.erland.isaksson.info/index.php/Category:SlimServer))
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Mr_Orange
2010-05-09, 13:58
id like to see a digital transport only product no dac's analog or headphone out, but 5.1 spdif or hdmi multi channel out. I want to play 5.1 24/96 Flac files.

You can do this already. I play loads of DTS 96/24 files through the SPDIF out of my SB3, which is connected to an AVP.

With the right software you can also rip and convert 96/24 resolution DVD-As to DTS 96/24.

Mr_Orange
2010-05-09, 13:58
Mnyb;544664 Wrote:
> id like to see a digital transport only product no dac's analog or
> headphone out, but 5.1 spdif or hdmi multi channel out. I want to play
> 5.1 24/96 Flac files.

You can do this already. I play loads of DTS 96/24 files through the
SPDIF out of my SB3, which is connected to an AVP.

With the right software you can also rip and convert 96/24 resolution
DVD-As to DTS 96/24.


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Goodsounds
2010-05-09, 14:13
I would like to see continued progress to improve sound quality (as was done with Touch) and improve the user experience. Some of what I would like might run counter to some of the other comments made. I think simplifying and reducing customization options, streamlining menu trees, cleaning up the more troublesome and nagging software problems, etc., will make the products more broadly attractive. And more successful.

I think the days of courting former Heathkit customers are long gone, there just aren't enough of you guys around to warrant the attention.

I'm concerned whether anyone's wish list will be achieved, given the staffing reductions and turnover.

Goodsounds
2010-05-09, 14:13
I would like to see continued progress to improve sound quality (as was
done with Touch) and improve the user experience. Some of what I would
like might run counter to some of the other comments made. I think
simplifying and reducing customization options, streamlining menu
trees, cleaning up the more troublesome and nagging software problems,
etc., will make the products more broadly attractive. And more
successful.

I think the days of courting former Heathkit customers are long gone,
there just aren't enough of you guys around to warrant the attention.

I'm concerned whether anyone's wish list will be achieved, given the
staffing reductions and turnover.


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peterw
2010-05-09, 14:25
99% of the time a Radio/Touch whatever will be running compiled code - it will be playing music files, or it will be decoding jpgs, or it will be scaling them for display, or it will be displaying text. Unless I'm very much mistaken, these functions are all done in compiled C/C++.

Ah, yes, exactly, that's how it should be now. Obviously I take libraries for granted. :-)

peterw
2010-05-09, 14:25
Aslak3;544853 Wrote:
> 99% of the time a Radio/Touch whatever will be running compiled code -
> it will be playing music files, or it will be decoding jpgs, or it will
> be scaling them for display, or it will be displaying text. Unless I'm
> very much mistaken, these functions are all done in compiled C/C++.

Ah, yes, exactly, that's how it should be now. Obviously I take
libraries for granted. :-)


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Mnyb
2010-05-09, 15:13
You can do this already. I play loads of DTS 96/24 files through the SPDIF out of my SB3, which is connected to an AVP.

With the right software you can also rip and convert 96/24 resolution DVD-As to DTS 96/24.

Yes but DTS is not lossles, I also do this occasionally. I want to rip my >100 DVD-A to 5.1 lossles

Mnyb
2010-05-09, 15:13
Mr_Orange;545014 Wrote:
> You can do this already. I play loads of DTS 96/24 files through the
> SPDIF out of my SB3, which is connected to an AVP.
>
> With the right software you can also rip and convert 96/24 resolution
> DVD-As to DTS 96/24.

Yes but DTS is not lossles, I also do this occasionally. I want to rip
my >100 DVD-A to 5.1 lossles


--
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--------------------------------------------------------------------
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Classe'Primare and Dynadio speakers (including a pair of Contour 4 )
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: SB3 + powered Fostex PM0.4
Miscellaneous use: Radio (with battery)
I use a Controller various ir-remotes and a Eee-PC with squeezeplay to
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toby10
2010-05-09, 16:10
Boom II = Boom + Touch + Radio, best of all three

with Touch attributes:
- Color LCD display, same size as Touch (but I'll take larger ;))
- TinySC onboard
- USB
- Full size alpha/num IR remote

with Radio attributes:
- Keep the physical buttons (don't need touch screen)
- Dedicated Volume knob
- Built in carry handle

with Boom attributes:
- Stereo speakers (bit larger is better, but I'll take the current Boom speakers)
- Line Out (stereo, sub, headphones)
- Backlit buttons

Improved Boom attributes:
- Larger enclosure (for the slightly larger speakers mentioned above adding a bit more thump)
- Selectable X-over for Sub out
- Add programmable buttons
- Dual selection Presets (press Preset 1 = x, press & hold Preset 1 = y)
- Presets and/or Programmable buttons can also be set for Folders, sub-Folders, or Playlists

And for the love of god, DO NOT INCLUDE ANY ALARM FUNCTION and don't market it as such!

toby10
2010-05-09, 16:10
Boom II = Boom + Touch + Radio, best of all three

with Touch attributes:
- Color LCD display, same size as Touch (but I'll take larger ;))
- TinySC onboard
- USB
- Full size alpha/num IR remote

with Radio attributes:
- Keep the physical buttons (don't need touch screen)
- Dedicated Volume knob
- Built in carry handle

with Boom attributes:
- Stereo speakers (bit larger is better, but I'll take the current
Boom speakers)
- Line Out (stereo, sub, headphones)

Improved Boom attributes:
- Larger enclosure (for the slightly larger speakers mentioned above
adding a bit more thump)
- Selectable X-over for Sub out
- Add programmable buttons
- Dual selection Presets (press Preset 1 = x, press & hold Preset 1 =
y)
- Presets can also be set for Folders, sub-Folders, or Playlists

And for the love of god, DO NOT INCLUDE ANY ALARM FUNCTION and don't
market it as such!


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Steve Agnew
2010-05-09, 17:08
Heresy maybe, but I'd love the next Boom/Radio units to have an iPod/iPhone dock and charger to help declutter our kitchen bench.

Steve Agnew
2010-05-09, 17:08
Heresy maybe, but I'd love the next Boom/Radio units to have an
iPod/iPhone dock and charger to help declutter our kitchen bench.


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cliveb
2010-05-10, 03:58
I echo others' requests for a "Receiver 2" (simplified Touch minus the display), provided of course it can be configured without a Controller.

But I would add one other requirement: word clock input, so that suitably-equipped external DACs can be taken advantage of fully.

cliveb
2010-05-10, 03:58
I echo others' requests for a "Receiver 2" (simplified Touch minus the
display), provided of course it can be configured without a
Controller.

But I would add one other requirement: word clock input, so that
suitably-equipped external DACs can be taken advantage of fully.


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Mr_Orange
2010-05-10, 04:10
Yes but DTS is not lossles, I also do this occasionally. I want to rip my >100 DVD-A to 5.1 lossles

Sounds like you are asking for MLP decoding to be added with the resulting PCM passed via HDMI to a processor.

Mr_Orange
2010-05-10, 04:10
Mnyb;545037 Wrote:
> Yes but DTS is not lossles, I also do this occasionally. I want to rip
> my >100 DVD-A to 5.1 lossles

Sounds like you are asking for MLP decoding to be added with the
resulting PCM passed via HDMI to a processor.


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Phil Leigh
2010-05-10, 04:44
I echo others' requests for a "Receiver 2" (simplified Touch minus the display), provided of course it can be configured without a Controller.

But I would add one other requirement: word clock input, so that suitably-equipped external DACs can be taken advantage of fully.

+1 - please please please

Phil Leigh
2010-05-10, 04:44
cliveb;545131 Wrote:
> I echo others' requests for a "Receiver 2" (simplified Touch minus the
> display), provided of course it can be configured without a
> Controller.
>
> But I would add one other requirement: word clock input, so that
> suitably-equipped external DACs can be taken advantage of fully.

+1 - please please please


--
Phil Leigh

You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it
ain't what you'd call minimal...
Touch(wired/XP) - TACT 2.2X (Linear PSU) + Good Vibrations S/W - MF
Triplethreat(Audiocom full mods) - Linn 5103 - Aktiv 5.1 system (6x
LK140's, ESPEK/TRIKAN/KATAN/SEIZMIK 10.5), Townsend Supertweeters, Blue
Jeans Digital,Kimber Speaker & Chord Interconnect cables
Kitchen Boom, Outdoors: SB Radio
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iPhone
2010-05-10, 06:13
Heresy maybe, but I'd love the next Boom/Radio units to have an iPod/iPhone dock and charger to help declutter our kitchen bench.

No heresy, just don't understand why. OK, I see the de-clutter part but it is just as simple to charge in another room removing the clutter completely. What songs do you have on an iPod that aren't already available on the PC with SBS?

Now don't say they are on somebody else's iPod, because it sounds like you already have a dock and could listen to them there. Or if one has a Touch, move songs to a USB stick and listen on any Squeezebox in the house.

Personally, I don't need my Squeezeboxen cluttered up with iPod docks and line ins. But that's just me.

Am I being to much of a purist?

iPhone
2010-05-10, 06:13
Steve Agnew;545054 Wrote:
> Heresy maybe, but I'd love the next Boom/Radio units to have an
> iPod/iPhone dock and charger to help declutter our kitchen bench.

No heresy, just don't understand why. OK, I see the de-clutter part but
it is just as simple to charge in another room removing the clutter
completely. What songs do you have on an iPod that aren't already
available on the PC with SBS?

Now don't say they are on somebody else's iPod, because it sounds like
you already have a dock and could listen to them there. Or if one has a
Touch, move songs to a USB stick and listen on any Squeezebox in the
house.

Personally, I don't need my Squeezeboxen cluttered up with iPod docks
and line ins. But that's just me.

Am I being to much of a purist?


--
iPhone

*iPhone*
Media Room:
Transporter, VTL TL-6.5 Signature Pre-Amp, Ayre MX-R Mono's, VeraStarr
6.4SE 6-channel Amp, Vandersteen Speakers: Quatro Mains, VCC-5
Reference Center, four VSM-1 Signatures, Video: Runco RS 900 CineWide
AutoScope 2.35:1

Living Room:
Duet, ADCOM GTP-870HD, Cinepro 3K6SE III Gold, Vandersteen Model 3A
Signature, Two 2Wq subs, VCC-2, Two VSM-1

Kitchen: Squeezebox BOOM
Bedroom: Second Boom
Bathroom: Squeezebox Radio
Ford Thunderbird: Duet, Mac Mini
Ford Expedition: SB Touch, USB drive
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JJZolx
2010-05-10, 11:50
What if all of your music _is_ on that iPod? Marketing's strategy has been to sell these boomy boxes as Internet radios and alarm clocks. You now have a significant group of SB users that not only don't want to run a server, they have no idea how to do so. An iPod dock would make a lot of sense for the new target audience.

JJZolx
2010-05-10, 11:50
What if all of your music _is_ on that iPod? Marketing's strategy has
been to sell these boomy boxes as Internet radios and alarm clocks.
You now have a significant group of SB users that not only don't want
to run a server, they have no idea how to do so. An iPod dock would
make a lot of sense for the new target audience.


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Jim
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toby10
2010-05-10, 12:28
I agree with both of you.

For my usage, no iPod docking needed nor wanted.
For mass market appeal selling more Boom's/Radio's, iPod docking would make sense.

toby10
2010-05-10, 12:28
I agree with both of you.

For my usage, no iPod docking needed nor wanted.
For mass market appeal selling more Boom's/Radio's, iPod docking would
make sense.


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pippin
2010-05-10, 12:29
What if all of your music _is_ on that iPod? Marketing's strategy has been to sell these boomy boxes as Internet radios and alarm clocks. You now have a significant group of SB users that not only don't want to run a server, they have no idea how to do so. An iPod dock would make a lot of sense for the new target audience.

Make Apple allow streaming from the iPhone to the Squeezebox :)

pippin
2010-05-10, 12:29
JJZolx;545244 Wrote:
> What if all of your music _is_ on that iPod? Marketing's strategy has
> been to sell these boomy boxes as Internet radios and alarm clocks.
> You now have a significant group of SB users that not only don't want
> to run a server, they have no idea how to do so. An iPod dock would
> make a lot of sense for the new target audience.

Make Apple allow streaming from the iPhone to the Squeezebox :)


--
pippin

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iPhone
2010-05-10, 12:55
What if all of your music _is_ on that iPod? Marketing's strategy has been to sell these boomy boxes as Internet radios and alarm clocks. You now have a significant group of SB users that not only don't want to run a server, they have no idea how to do so. An iPod dock would make a lot of sense for the new target audience.

Come on Jim. A $300 docking station, that makes no sense. There are so many cheaper ways to get sound out of an iPod. And if its iTunes one wants all over the house or tunes from an iPod, one probably already has all the other stuff and just needs an airport express and a couple of modules.

iPod docking station on an SB Radio or Boom is not going to make them mass market. Besides, Boom already has line in if somebody is desperate to get tunes out of an iPod and out of a Boom.

iPhone
2010-05-10, 12:55
JJZolx;545244 Wrote:
> What if all of your music _is_ on that iPod? Marketing's strategy has
> been to sell these boomy boxes as Internet radios and alarm clocks.
> You now have a significant group of SB users that not only don't want
> to run a server, they have no idea how to do so. An iPod dock would
> make a lot of sense for the new target audience.

Come on Jim. A $300 docking station, that makes no sense. There are so
many cheaper ways to get sound out of an iPod. And if its iTunes one
wants all other the house or tunes from an iPod, one probably already
has all the other stuff and just needs an airport express and a couple
of modules.


--
iPhone

*iPhone*
Media Room:
Transporter, VTL TL-6.5 Signature Pre-Amp, Ayre MX-R Mono's, VeraStarr
6.4SE 6-channel Amp, Vandersteen Speakers: Quatro Mains, VCC-5
Reference Center, four VSM-1 Signatures, Video: Runco RS 900 CineWide
AutoScope 2.35:1

Living Room:
Duet, ADCOM GTP-870HD, Cinepro 3K6SE III Gold, Vandersteen Model 3A
Signature, Two 2Wq subs, VCC-2, Two VSM-1

Kitchen: Squeezebox BOOM
Bedroom: Second Boom
Bathroom: Squeezebox Radio
Ford Thunderbird: Duet, Mac Mini
Ford Expedition: SB Touch, USB drive
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JJZolx
2010-05-10, 12:59
Come on Jim. A $300 docking station, that makes no sense. There are so many cheaper ways to get sound out of an iPod. And if its iTunes one wants all other the house or tunes from an iPod, one probably already has all the other stuff and just needs an airport express and a couple of modules.

What docking station? SB Radio is a $150 alarm clock that streams Pandora. Wouldn't it be better if it did _something_ useful?

JJZolx
2010-05-10, 12:59
iPhone;545266 Wrote:
> Come on Jim. A $300 docking station, that makes no sense. There are so
> many cheaper ways to get sound out of an iPod. And if its iTunes one
> wants all other the house or tunes from an iPod, one probably already
> has all the other stuff and just needs an airport express and a couple
> of modules.

What docking station? SB Radio is a $150 alarm clock that streams
Pandora. Wouldn't it be better if it did _something_ useful?


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JJZolx

Jim
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Muele
2010-05-10, 13:00
Full/better support for WAN streaming +1

Software:
+Stabilization.
+Make it darn easy for ordinary people to set up. One way could be partnering with Vortexbox and a few select router-brands (specific models).
+More services. Grooveshark. Spotify. We are lots of customers that don't life in the US.
+DRM. If my server has the rights to play a track, it should be able to stream it through SBS.
+Better interaction with ones musiclibrary (browse, search, randomplay)
+Fix the ui for setting up synchronization. (!) This is one thing that should just work out of the box.

Hardware.
+Build stuff on basis of the Radio and Touch: I would like to see a one-in-all stationary (wall mountable) box with enough oompf to replace the average living room stereo. Throw in a few analog and digital inputs.
+Controller mk 2. Touchscreen but with presetbuttons and a few other hard-buttons.

Muele
2010-05-10, 13:00
bhaagensen;544731 Wrote:
> Full/better support for WAN streaming +1

Software:
+Stabilization.
+Make it darn easy for ordinary people to set up. One way could be
partnering with Vortexbox and a few select router-brands (specific
models).
+More services. Grooveshark. Spotify. We are lots of customers that
don't life in the US.
+DRM. If my server has the rights to play a track, it should be able to
stream it through SBS.
+Better interaction with ones musiclibrary (browse, search,
randomplay)
+Fix the ui for setting up synchronization. (!) This is one thing that
should just work out of the box.

Hardware.
+Build stuff on basis of the Radio and Touch: I would like to see a
one-in-all stationary (wall mountable) box with enough oompf to replace
the average living room stereo. Throw in a few analog and digital
inputs.
+Controller mk 2. Touchscreen but with presetbuttons and a few other
hard-buttons.


--
Muele

BR Mogens

2 Radios (1 battery), 2 Controllers, 2 Receivers, 1 Squeezeplay. Served
by an old 800 mhz IBM T21 Thinkpad (Yes I know most phones have more
cpu-power these days, but it gets the job done).
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snarlydwarf
2010-05-10, 15:04
+DRM. If my server has the rights to play a track, it should be able to stream it through SBS.

That is almost certainly out of the hands of Logitech.

It comes down to "you are licensed to play this on X registered devices".

In this case, it isn't your PC that is playing it, rather a SB, which isn't a registered device, nor is it easy to extend the usual DRM t&c to squeezeboxes (ie, what if you have multiple SBs? what if they're synced? or what if they're each playing different DRM'd material?)

If you have DRM'd itunes content, for example: can you play it on every iPod you own, or only on a limited number of devices, including computers?

Just say no to DRM: the restrictions on DRM'd content are far too random to work well at all when multiple devices are involved. Not just for technical reasons (someone would have to get a copy of the drm decoder that was possible to use within SBS), but also for legal reasons on deciding what devices can play content.

It sucks, yes, but, then, DRM isn't there to make your life better, rather it is specifically designed to limit your playback options.

snarlydwarf
2010-05-10, 15:04
Muele;545270 Wrote:
>
> +DRM. If my server has the rights to play a track, it should be able to
> stream it through SBS.

That is almost certainly out of the hands of Logitech.

It comes down to "you are licensed to play this on X registered
devices".

In this case, it isn't your PC that is playing it, rather a SB, which
isn't a registered device, nor is it easy to extend the usual DRM t&c
to squeezeboxes (ie, what if you have multiple SBs? what if they're
synced? or what if they're each playing different DRM'd material?)

If you have DRM'd itunes content, for example: can you play it on every
iPod you own, or only on a limited number of devices, including
computers?

Just say no to DRM: the restrictions on DRM'd content are far too
random to work well at all when multiple devices are involved. Not
just for technical reasons (someone would have to get a copy of the drm
decoder that was possible to use within SBS), but also for legal reasons
on deciding what devices can play content.

It sucks, yes, but, then, DRM isn't there to make your life better,
rather it is specifically designed to limit your playback options.


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garym
2010-05-10, 15:24
If you have DRM'd itunes content, for example: can you play it on every iPod you own, or only on a limited number of devices, including computers?

I'm no fan of DRM, but if you have a DRM song on itunes, you can synch this to 1,000 ipods if you have that many. The restriction is how many different COMPUTERS (running itunes) can be authorized to use that DRM song. I think the number is 5, but this may have changed.

garym
2010-05-10, 15:24
snarlydwarf;545303 Wrote:
> If you have DRM'd itunes content, for example: can you play it on every
> iPod you own, or only on a limited number of devices, including
> computers?

I'm no fan of DRM, but if you have a DRM song on itunes, you can synch
this to 1,000 ipods if you have that many. The restriction is how many
different COMPUTERS (running itunes) can be authorized to use that DRM
song. I think the number is 5, but this may have changed.


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snarlydwarf
2010-05-10, 16:10
I'm no fan of DRM, but if you have a DRM song on itunes, you can synch this to 1,000 ipods if you have that many. The restriction is how many different COMPUTERS (running itunes) can be authorized to use that DRM song. I think the number is 5, but this may have changed.

Not quite that simple: an iPod can only contain music from 5 iTunes accounts. But yeah, seems there is no restriction on the number of iPods. (not like I'd ever buy an ipod...)

It's still silly, and still nothing Logitech can do about it.

(Nor, really, can those who sell DRM -- they have contracts in place that list the terms of playback, and would have to define exactly how a Squeezebox fits into the scheme of limits... which is hard to do when you already have signed contracts in place. No one wants to renegotiate.)

snarlydwarf
2010-05-10, 16:10
garym;545307 Wrote:
> I'm no fan of DRM, but if you have a DRM song on itunes, you can synch
> this to 1,000 ipods if you have that many. The restriction is how many
> different COMPUTERS (running itunes) can be authorized to use that DRM
> song. I think the number is 5, but this may have changed.

Not quite that simple: an iPod can only contain music from 5 iTunes
accounts. But yeah, seems there is no restriction on the number of
iPods. (not like I'd ever buy an ipod...)

It's still silly, and still nothing Logitech can do about it.

(Nor, really, can those who sell DRM -- they have contracts in place
that list the terms of playback, and would have to define exactly how a
Squeezebox fits into the scheme of limits... which is hard to do when
you already have signed contracts in place. No one wants to
renegotiate.)


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amey01
2010-05-10, 17:34
I'd like to see a car system. It could access via SAP (SIM Access Protocol) on your mobile phone to your home music collection. As well as internet radio of course, eliminating the continual FM drizzle I have to endure now.

As others have said, I'd also like to see a "Touch Plus" or something that looks a little more like a real (full width) hi-fi component (but not the Transporter as I run a DAC anyway).

amey01
2010-05-10, 17:34
I'd like to see a car system. It could access via SAP (SIM Access
Protocol) on your mobile phone to your home music collection. As well
as internet radio of course, eliminating the continual FM drizzle I
have to endure now.

As others have said, I'd also like to see a "Touch Plus" or something
that looks a little more like a real (full width) hi-fi component (but
not the Transporter as I run a DAC anyway).


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cunobelinus
2010-05-12, 09:38
+1

On 8 May 2010, at 13:41, sleepysurf wrote:

>
> I'd suggest the "Touch Plus" which would be a full (or half) rack width
> device with a WIDER (and more legible screen), high quality DAC, better
> analog output section, and both RCA and balanced outputs. Price it
> below the Transporter (say $600-700), and it will beat the pants off
> the Olive, Meridian/Sooloos, and other (forthcoming) streaming devices
> in that market segment.
>