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ajkidle
2009-12-01, 17:24
Can someone explain to me what it means to scrobble? (I'm assuming it's a verb, but maybe not.) I'm experimenting with Last.FM and saw a reference to it there, and have seen in numerous times on these boards. What can scrobbling do for me?

ajkidle
2009-12-01, 17:38
Okay, I think I figured out the scrobbling thing. Everything I listen to gets sent to Last.FM, and it learns about my preferences. Is this a Last.FM only thing?

And at the risk of going off topics, is there a way to create multiple Last.FM stations, similar to Pandora? Or am I thinking about Last.FM wrong?

snarlydwarf
2009-12-01, 17:38
Can someone explain to me what it means to scrobble? (I'm assuming it's a verb, but maybe not.) I'm experimenting with Last.FM and saw a reference to it there, and have seen in numerous times on these boards. What can scrobbling do for me?

Scrobbling is "send what I listen to off to Last.fm in mostly realtime".

What that does is lets last.fm track what you listen to.

They they can combine what you listen to with what other people listen to: and match you, like a dating service. But instead of some scary people, they will match your tastes and assume that if you listen to Artist A, and a lot of people that listen to Artist A also like Artist B, they can recommend that you listen to Artist B.

From that, you get some online stations made up based on your tastes:
You can listen to your library (ie, songs you have played), your recommendations (songs their software thinks you may like based on prior listening habits), songs your 'neighbors' (people with similar tastes) listen to, songs your 'friends' (ie, like myspace/facebook/etc) listen to, etc.

Some stations need payment (which is all of $3 or so a month, I think), some are free in US/UK/DE.. not sure about Canada), etc.

But think of it as, I guess, Amazon's "recommendations" but based on music you actually listen to, not just what you've purchased recently.

snarlydwarf
2009-12-01, 17:41
Okay, I think I figured out the scrobbling thing. Everything I listed to gets sent to Last.FM, and it learns about my preferences. Is this a Last.FM only thing?

And at the risk of going off topics, is there a way to create multiple Last.FM stations, similar to Pandora? Or am I thinking about Last.FM wrong?

You can also play 'similar artists'.

Sometimes I will do recommended radio, and then hear something interesting... and then choose "play artists similar to this" and go wandering down a tangent.

It is similar to Pandora, but Pandora is "human selected" in that humans studied the music and added specific tags to each track, "latin rhythm" or "female vocalist". Last.fm's grouping is MUCH more computer-driven.

ajkidle
2009-12-01, 18:20
So does everything I listen to get scrobbled? Local FLACs, Rhapsody, Pandora, etc.? This seems potentially very cool, why am I just now discovering it???

lrossouw
2009-12-01, 19:00
So does everything I listen to get scrobbled? Local FLACs, Rhapsody, Pandora, etc.? This seems potentially very cool, why am I just now discovering it???

Local files definitely. Not sure about Rhapsody\Pandora\Other online sources as I don't really listen to these.

You can also download their software on your PC so songs you listen on itunes\media player are also tracked. It also would add plays from your ipod to last.fm when you sync it.

htrd
2009-12-02, 01:27
So does everything I listen to get scrobbled? Local FLACs, Rhapsody, Pandora, etc.?

The scrobbler tells lastfm whether each track is local, lastfm radio, other personalised radio, or other radio. Everything appears on your charts, but lastfm treat those sources differently when calculating your recommendations to avoid feedback from one recommendations system into another.

DoomWolf
2009-12-03, 08:26
it will scrobble from many streaming services including online radio. There is however an option in Squeezecenter/Squeezebox Server to disable scrobbling from online radio (I find that option very useful and online radio can be varied and unpredictable).

I can't speak for all the Squeezebox streaming services but I know it scrobbles from Napster and I'm sure it scrobbled from Pandora when I was able to use it (before access was removed from UK users).

MikeekiM
2009-12-03, 10:16
I find that all of my MP3/FLAC listening from my library gets scrobbled, as do tracks from most of the Rhapsody and Pandora tracks...

For some reason, some stuff just doesn't get scrobbled correctly... As an example, when I listen to Rhapsody channels, the song will show up as being listened to...but when the song is over, it won't log it in my permanent history... Other sources do this as well...

And even though I have the option to scrobble online internet radio, I haven't gotten this to work at all... Even when I see that the song information is being passed to the display, it still won't even show up as being listened to...forget about recording it in the history...

I'll need to sort out a list:

1. Sources that scrobble and record into history
2. Sources that last.fm seems to recognize I am listening to realtime, but no log into history
3. Sources that don't scrobble at all

snarlydwarf
2009-12-03, 11:26
For some reason, some stuff just doesn't get scrobbled correctly... As an example, when I listen to Rhapsody channels, the song will show up as being listened to...but when the song is over, it won't log it in my permanent history... Other sources do this as well...


That's some mysterious Last.fm feature, as I recall.

They -get- the data (obviously), but since it is flagged as radio, they don't show it as part of your usual play history. It is supposed to be stored there and used as part of the recommendation process, though I would assume with a lower 'priority' than local music.

http://www.last.fm/api/submissions lists this as the 'source' type to be sent as part of the scrobbling submission:

The source of the track. Required, must be one of the following codes:



P Chosen by the user (the most common value, unless you have a reason for choosing otherwise, use this).

R Non-personalised broadcast (e.g. Shoutcast, BBC Radio 1).

E Personalised recommendation except Last.fm (e.g. Pandora, Launchcast).

L Last.fm (any mode). In this case, the 5-digit Last.fm recommendation key must be appended to this source ID to prove the validity of the submission (for example, "o[0]=L1b48a").

U Source unknown.


So, clearly, according to last.fm docs, Pandora and such should be type E...

But they seem to behave badly with that.

Rhapsody 'channels' (and slacker, radioio, etc) would be 'R', I would think.. they may be unique randomly generated lists, but it's still not that specifically tuned to your tastes, and much closer to broadcast... but then they handle that oddly, too..

MikeekiM
2009-12-03, 12:30
Thanks for this clarification SnarlyDwarf! I wish last.fm and/or logitech would make this more clear in their documentation/FAQs...

I think it is clearly more a last.fm issue than it is a logitech one...but since so many of us are "into" our music, I think logitech would benefit a lot by putting this information in a scrobbing FAQ section...

This explains a lot... But it doesn't explain why my broadcast radio listening through squeezebox is not recognized at all... Not even when the info is clearly being passed to the squeezebox display, and I have the option to scrobble radio flipped on... It doesn't even show up while the song is being played, nevermind logging it into permanent history...

I have mixed feelings about how last.fm handles scrobbles... On the one hand, it appears that they are trying to be thoughtful on what should and shouldn't count... at the same time, what is a scrobble worth if it disappears... I see the playcount on last.fm as my listening odometer of sorts... And sometimes you are on roads you like...and other times you are not on a great road at all...but you are still accumulating miles...

I guess the thought is that if you choose to listen to the music, that you like it, and it deserves a place in your history... I think that is so far from the truth... I do a lot of experimenting and exploring with my music listening...especially since I have Rhapsody...and I may choose to listen to something that I read about in a CD review, but end up not liking it at all...

Not sure how I feel about it all (not that anyone cares how I feel about it!!!) :)

Nonreality
2009-12-06, 00:37
I really don't care about the tags or what they recommend but what I like is to see what I've listened to over the last week, month, 6mths, year and etc. It amazes me on how much I play my Squeezebox and also how much I listen to certain artists. My son also influences mine as he uses the SB3 when I'm not around. All in all it's pretty cool to see the breakdown of your listening habits.

MikeekiM
2009-12-06, 09:59
I really don't care about the tags or what they recommend but what I like is to see what I've listened to over the last week, month, 6mths, year and etc. It amazes me on how much I play my Squeezebox and also how much I listen to certain artists. My son also influences mine as he uses the SB3 when I'm not around. All in all it's pretty cool to see the breakdown of your listening habits.

Yea... each family member has a last.fm account in my household... But when they listen to their music on someone elses SB, it screws up the data... Oh well... It's nearly right anyway!

I really don't want to teach my kids the hassle of going in and reconfiguring the SB to their profile, and then remembering to switch it back when they stop listening... And my wife definitely will have none of this nonsense! :)

MikeekiM
2009-12-20, 18:32
Rhapsody plays aren't scrobbling for me now... Hopefully it's a temporary problem... I am not talking about Rhapsody channels... I am talking about normal Rhapsody plays where you select an album to play...

Used to scrobble just fine...