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mortslim
2009-01-10, 13:50
How about this for a Logitech Music Server:

Instead of Logitech debuting a hard disk based server, how about a Logitech Music Server that, instead of incorporating a hard disk, instead just has an iPod dock?

Logitech already has several iPod dock speaker products:

http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/speakers_audio/ipod_mp3_speakers/&cl=us,en

How about just using the dock part of these products, take out the speakers, take out the amp, and just have a flashable (for firmware updates) dock that incorporates the SqueezeCenter software and wifi? Then connect your music library via your iPod. Voila, a Logitech Music Server based upon its own existing products.

That way, Logitech doesn't have to compete with existing hard disk based servers (your own computer or a NAS). It would be inventing a whole new category of product: the iPod based wireless Music Server to serve the Squeezebox line of products.

Also, since the SqueezeCenter software would be embedded into this dock, there would be no need to have your computer powered on.

An analogous product would be the Linksys NSLU2, because that product also doesn't have built-in storage, but rather, you add your own.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSLU2

Since Logitech already supports the iPod with an entire range of products, it already has the expertise to make this type of Music Server.

mortslim
2009-01-10, 14:25
It looks like the newly announced Linksys/Cisco home audio system has an iPod component intergrated into it.

http://www.shoplinksys.com/Docking-Station-for-iPod---Wired-Accessory--MCCI40-Home-Audio-Devices_stcVVproductId59095235VVcatId544640VVviewp rod.htm

I am suggesting a more stand-alone iPod dock that incorporates the SqeezeCenter and wifi.

Letten
2009-01-10, 14:28
First, believe it or not, many people don't own an ipod.

Second, the devices you mention also lacks both CPU processing power and internet access for SC to run. NAS'es and computers have this.

Actually that device would have to have every thing a NAS or a computer has apart from a harddrive, which it would then use the iPod for.

For that purpose an iPod has very limited capacity because many people use Lossless format in combination with squeezeboxes.

Actually Logitechs biggest disadvantage compared to Sonos and soon also Linksys is they don't have control over the WIFI, many problems are related to this. Now there's a product need :-)

peter
2009-01-10, 14:43
mortslim wrote:
> How about this for a Logitech Music Server:
>
> Instead of Logitech debuting a hard disk based server, how about a
> Logitech Music Server that, instead of incorporating a hard disk,
> instead just has an iPod dock?
>

It would be a pretty cool product IMO. (and I don't even own an iPod).

Regards,
Peter

Goodsounds
2009-01-10, 16:34
First, believe it or not, many people don't own an ipod.


You're right, and I'm one of them. But tens and tens (hundreds?) of millions of people do own ipods. Imagine if you sold one of these new gizmos to one or two percent of them - that might make it one of Logitech's biggest products.

It may be interesting to try to flesh out.

Mortslim, this is an interesting idea, but in general, I have to say your posts bust me up. Your steady flow of ideas and suggestions could keep a whole department busy. Perhaps not productive, but busy!

JJZolx
2009-01-10, 17:47
It's not clear yet whether or not the Linksys product lets you distribute the audio from the iPod to other players on the network, or if it's just a simple audio input port for the local system. I suppose the latter would have some value, but the first would really be slick. But neither is at all in keeping with how Squeezebox or SqueezeCenter work, so I'd say there's very little chance of seeing anything remotely like it.

mortslim
2009-01-10, 18:30
It's not clear yet whether or not the Linksys product lets you distribute the audio from the iPod to other players on the network

The Linksys webpage cited above seems to indicate the audio from the iPod is distributed:

"Share your favorite tunes and playlists, advance tracks, adjust volume on each Wireless Home Audio device in your home."

However whether the Linksys system does or doesn't, I am suggesting that wireless distribution of an iPod is a good idea for Logitech. The idea I propose is to make an iPod based server for access by any Squeezebox on the local network so that when the Squeezebox is directed to connect to SqueezeCenter, that the connection is made to an iPod based music server which has SqueezeCenter embeded.

JJZolx
2009-01-10, 18:45
The Linksys webpage cited above seems to indicate the audio from the iPod is distributed:

"Share your favorite tunes and playlists, advance tracks, adjust volume on each Wireless Home Audio device in your home."

However whether the Linksys system does or doesn't, I am suggesting that wireless distribution of an iPod is a good idea for Logitech. The idea I propose is to make an iPod based server for access by any Squeezebox on the local network so that when the Squeezebox is directed to connect to SqueezeCenter, that the connection is made to an iPod based music server which has SqueezeCenter embeded.
I think it would be a good idea, too. I'd also like the ability to digitize and distribute analog audio input from either an FM tuner or CD player. Which doesn't mean much, because Slim/Logitech is never going to do this. They're very much locked into (or painted themselves into a corner, depending on your viewpoint) the 'scan file metadata into a library database, then play the file based on the metadata' model and it would be extremely labor intensive to get out of it. They'll be streaming Netflix video and WMV files to your plasma TV before that happens.

bpa
2009-01-10, 18:51
The idea I propose is to make an iPod based server for access by any Squeezebox

Seems to be unnecessarily limited solution. I have done plugins to provides access to a PC CDplayer and Tuner cards.

If an Ipod is plugged into USB port - there is no reason why a plugin cannot access the iPod disk and then handle the iPod files as if it was a podcast server - no need to bring the files into the SC database. The files can browsed and when selected then be streamed to any or all connected Squeezeboxes through SC.

mortslim
2009-01-10, 20:02
If an Ipod is plugged into USB port

I am envisioning a stand-alone product. There are many situations where I don't want my computer on while listening to music (save energy to save the planet). I assume that the proposed iPod server would consume far less energy as a "slim" client.

In addition, having the embedded SqueezeCenter include the WaveInput plugin should enable playing radio streams from the iPhone/iPod Touch as well. I see that at the moment there are some internet radio services available to these Apple devices which are not currently available on the Squeezebox: Wolfgang's Concert Vault, Finetune, Ourstage, and Deezer (only available in Europe on the Squeezebox). It would be great to have these services connected to any Squeezebox on the local network as well.

Finally, maybe add a usb port to the proposed iPod server in case you want to add a usb hard drive instead of an iPod.

peter
2009-01-11, 00:44
mortslim wrote:
> bpa;382500 Wrote:
>
>> If an Ipod is plugged into USB port
>>
>
> I am envisioning a stand-alone product. There are many situations
> where I don't want my computer on while listening to music (save energy
> to save the planet). I assume that the proposed iPod server would
> consume far less energy as a "slim" client.
>
> In addition, having the embedded SqueezeCenter include the WaveInput
> plugin should enable playing radio streams from the iPhone/iPod Touch
> as well. I see that at the moment there are some internet radio
> services available to these Apple devices which are not currently
> available on the Squeezebox: Wolfgang's Concert Vault, Finetune,
> Ourstage, and Deezer (only available in Europe on the Squeezebox). It
> would be great to have these services connected to any Squeezebox on the
> local network as well.
>
> Finally, maybe add a usb port to the proposed iPod server in case you
> want to add a usb hard drive instead of an iPod.
>

I think the biggest problem with this is that the SC software is written
in Perl and requires a whole OS (and DBMS) underneath
it, which makes the hardware requirements rather large. OTOH, there's
lots of fairly powerful mini-stuff available judging the netbook craze.
It could be done, but it probably wouldn't be cheap.

Regards,
Peter

pfarrell
2009-01-11, 00:53
Peter wrote:
> I think the biggest problem with this is that the SC software is written
> in Perl and requires a whole OS (and DBMS) underneath
> it

That is not a "problem" its a feature. Something has to be the OS and
then you add the application on it. Perl is not the problem, but if you
want to argue that dead horse, the developer's forum section is the
proper place.

> lots of fairly powerful mini-stuff available judging the netbook craze.

My kid just got a $440 EEE netbook that except for the disk size, is far
more capable than SC needs. While the SC software needs today what was
considered a lot of RAM, in today's market, it needs about $30 worth of
it. (a gig, or so, the $440 EEE has 2GB and has far more speed than is
needed.)

If you look at the specs of the Controller (bundled in the Duet) it is a
hand held computer comperable to desktops of not many years ago. And
those desktops cost several grand late last century. Moore's law has
done amazing things.

If it had disks, an iPhone could probably run SqueezeCenter.

--
Pat Farrell
http://www.pfarrell.com/

peter
2009-01-11, 04:31
Pat Farrell wrote:
> Peter wrote:
>
>> I think the biggest problem with this is that the SC software is written
>> in Perl and requires a whole OS (and DBMS) underneath
>> it
>>
>
> That is not a "problem" its a feature. Something has to be the OS and
>
It's a feature in PC/server setups and a problem in NAS and embedded
setups.

> then you add the application on it. Perl is not the problem, but if you
> want to argue that dead horse, the developer's forum section is the
> proper place.
>
Oh, I thought anything was game in this forum. We were discussing
politics not long ago ;)

Maybe I'll start an anti Hamas-thread. See how that goes ;)

>
>> lots of fairly powerful mini-stuff available judging the netbook craze.
>>
>
> My kid just got a $440 EEE netbook that except for the disk size, is far
> more capable than SC needs. While the SC software needs today what was
> considered a lot of RAM, in today's market, it needs about $30 worth of
> it. (a gig, or so, the $440 EEE has 2GB and has far more speed than is
> needed.)
>
> If you look at the specs of the Controller (bundled in the Duet) it is a
> hand held computer comperable to desktops of not many years ago. And
> those desktops cost several grand late last century. Moore's law has
> done amazing things.
>

You're making my point.
> If it had disks, an iPhone could probably run SqueezeCenter.
>

It might be able to run it, but probably not well.

Regards,
Peter

andynormancx
2009-01-11, 05:07
> If it had disks, an iPhone could probably run SqueezeCenter.
> [/color]

It might be able to run it, but probably not well.

Indeed, memory might be a bit of a problem. It only has 128MB of RAM and third party apps are typical only allowed to use about 30MB.

Zaragon
2009-01-11, 06:35
The core of a lot of posts that seem to come up, and this one is perhaps in keeping with that, is that there should be some form of device that plugs into existing systems be it an iPOD or existing hifi etc. Then we get into discussions about the limitations, not many people have them, limited size, others do it better/faster etc.

Whilst it would still need the SC in its current form the ideal device would seem to be a small wifi capable embedded device that could act as an audio input. This then only needs to support a limited webserver/streaming protocol and you can satisfy most of what many people want. You could have it support analogue or digital inputs and it would still be in the 'Slim' client mould. Mmmm almost a receiver but backwards.

The Squeezeboxes could then attach to it as they do any other steaming source. Sorts out plugging in iPods or any other portable player, CD players, distributing (non synchronised) TV sound, DAB radios, satellite radios etc

I guess Sean would want their usual excellent sound quality so it would probably cost about the same as a receiver.

amey01
2009-01-11, 15:41
Has it been discussed before, but with falling memory prices, I'd like to see the SlimServer/Database incorporated in the actual Squeezebox - that way there would genuinely be no need for a server of any description.

robermax
2009-01-11, 20:31
bpa
I think that a plug in to access the ipods files when plugged into USB would be useful. Many folks come over with their ipods and it would be fun to broadcast audio from it.
ra