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seanadams
2004-04-06, 14:32
Darren, have you tried this test tone as a WAV?


On Apr 6, 2004, at 7:35 AM, Darren White wrote:

> I need a favor. :) Download this MP3:
> http://www.genelec.com/support/g_sweep1.mp3
>
> You can learn more about it at:
> http://www.genelec.com/support/testsignal.php
>
> The relevant details are that it is a linear frequency sweep from 10HZ
> to
> 150HZ. It should be a smoothly changing, pure tone.
>
> On my system it does not play correctly. I want at least one person
> to try it
> with a SLiMP3 and a Squeezebox, and give me feedback on or off the
> list. If
> it works, I would appreciate firmware and server version info.
>
> If you could help me with this, I would really appreciate it. If you
> want to
> know more about my problem, read on. Otherwise, I have taken enough of
> your time and I thank you for it.
>
> I have discovered that when I play tones of approx 600HZ and below, I
> get
> repetitive thumps in the output. I have generated and encoded my own
> frequency samples, and used the ones available at the page above. I
> have
> had my SLiMP3 replaced with a squeezebox, so its not a slim vs. squeeze
> thing. I tried optical, analog, and headphone outputs. So that
> eliminates the
> outputs. I have tried different inputs on my receiver, eliminating
> the inputs. I
> tried different rca cables, just in case.. No help there either. I
> burned the
> mp3's to CD (audio-cd) and played them with my dvd player. It worked,
> eliminating my receiver and speakers. I have tried wireless,
> eliminating my
> network cabling. I have setup a server on my laptop, and hooked it to
> the
> squeezebox with an ethernet crossover cable, eliminating my PC and my
> switch. I have powered the squeeze with a DC/AC converter from my
> car,
> and used headphones and the laptop, eliminating possible ground loop
> problems. I have tried the mp3's on winamp, streaming from Slimserver
> and
> locally, and they play fine. The kicker is, I have played .wav files
> of these
> sound samples through the Squeezebox and, THEY PLAY FINE. So the
> problem is related to mp3 decoding on the slimp3/squeezebox, and is, as
> best as I can tell, not related to my pc, encoder, hardware, receiver
> or
> speakers.. I am running server 5.1.1 on WinXP, and whatever firmware
> comes with that.
>
> So, I appreciate anyone else that can test that file and let me know
> how it
> works, and I am open to any suggestions of further things to try.
>
> Darren White
> InterStar Inc.
> 530-224-6866 x 103
>
>

Darren White
2004-04-06, 15:27
I need a favor. :) Download this MP3:
http://www.genelec.com/support/g_sweep1.mp3

You can learn more about it at:
http://www.genelec.com/support/testsignal.php

The relevant details are that it is a linear frequency sweep from 10HZ to
150HZ. It should be a smoothly changing, pure tone.

On my system it does not play correctly. I want at least one person to try it
with a SLiMP3 and a Squeezebox, and give me feedback on or off the list. If
it works, I would appreciate firmware and server version info.

If you could help me with this, I would really appreciate it. If you want to
know more about my problem, read on. Otherwise, I have taken enough of
your time and I thank you for it.

I have discovered that when I play tones of approx 600HZ and below, I get
repetitive thumps in the output. I have generated and encoded my own
frequency samples, and used the ones available at the page above. I have
had my SLiMP3 replaced with a squeezebox, so its not a slim vs. squeeze
thing. I tried optical, analog, and headphone outputs. So that eliminates the
outputs. I have tried different inputs on my receiver, eliminating the inputs. I
tried different rca cables, just in case.. No help there either. I burned the
mp3's to CD (audio-cd) and played them with my dvd player. It worked,
eliminating my receiver and speakers. I have tried wireless, eliminating my
network cabling. I have setup a server on my laptop, and hooked it to the
squeezebox with an ethernet crossover cable, eliminating my PC and my
switch. I have powered the squeeze with a DC/AC converter from my car,
and used headphones and the laptop, eliminating possible ground loop
problems. I have tried the mp3's on winamp, streaming from Slimserver and
locally, and they play fine. The kicker is, I have played .wav files of these
sound samples through the Squeezebox and, THEY PLAY FINE. So the
problem is related to mp3 decoding on the slimp3/squeezebox, and is, as
best as I can tell, not related to my pc, encoder, hardware, receiver or
speakers.. I am running server 5.1.1 on WinXP, and whatever firmware
comes with that.

So, I appreciate anyone else that can test that file and let me know how it
works, and I am open to any suggestions of further things to try.

Darren White
InterStar Inc.
530-224-6866 x 103

seanadams
2004-04-06, 15:32
For the purpose of testing frequency response and such, you really
don't want to have a perceptual codec between your source and your
speakers! That's not to say you haven't found a file that the decoder
barfs on - I'm just wondering why not use .wav for this?

On Apr 6, 2004, at 8:27 AM, Darren White wrote:

> Not this one, just the ones I made myself.. But this one had the same
> playback problems, so I figured it was as good a test as any for the
> rest of you guys, and it rules me out since I didn't encode it. :)
>
> I'd be happy to provide my original wavs, mp3's (256cbr, abr, 128,
> etc.).
>
> From: Sean Adams <sadams (AT) slimdevices (DOT) com>
> Subject: Re: [slim] Problem with SLiMP3 and Squeezebox MP3
> Decoding
> Date sent: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:32:30 -0700
> To: Slim Devices Discussion
> <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> Send reply to: Slim Devices Discussion
> <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=subscribe>
>
>>
>> Darren, have you tried this test tone as a WAV?
>>

Darren White
2004-04-06, 16:19
Not this one, just the ones I made myself.. But this one had the same
playback problems, so I figured it was as good a test as any for the
rest of you guys, and it rules me out since I didn't encode it. :)

I'd be happy to provide my original wavs, mp3's (256cbr, abr, 128,
etc.).

From: Sean Adams <sadams (AT) slimdevices (DOT) com>
Subject: Re: [slim] Problem with SLiMP3 and Squeezebox MP3 Decoding
Date sent: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:32:30 -0700
To: Slim Devices Discussion <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
Send reply to: Slim Devices Discussion <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
<mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=unsubscribe>
<mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=subscribe>

>
> Darren, have you tried this test tone as a WAV?
>
>
> On Apr 6, 2004, at 7:35 AM, Darren White wrote:
>
> > I need a favor. :) Download this MP3:
> > http://www.genelec.com/support/g_sweep1.mp3
> >
> > You can learn more about it at:
> > http://www.genelec.com/support/testsignal.php
> >
> > The relevant details are that it is a linear frequency sweep from 10HZ
> > to
> > 150HZ. It should be a smoothly changing, pure tone.
> >
> > On my system it does not play correctly. I want at least one person
> > to try it
> > with a SLiMP3 and a Squeezebox, and give me feedback on or off the
> > list. If
> > it works, I would appreciate firmware and server version info.
> >
> > If you could help me with this, I would really appreciate it. If you
> > want to
> > know more about my problem, read on. Otherwise, I have taken enough of
> > your time and I thank you for it.
> >
> > I have discovered that when I play tones of approx 600HZ and below, I
> > get
> > repetitive thumps in the output. I have generated and encoded my own
> > frequency samples, and used the ones available at the page above. I
> > have
> > had my SLiMP3 replaced with a squeezebox, so its not a slim vs. squeeze
> > thing. I tried optical, analog, and headphone outputs. So that
> > eliminates the
> > outputs. I have tried different inputs on my receiver, eliminating
> > the inputs. I
> > tried different rca cables, just in case.. No help there either. I
> > burned the
> > mp3's to CD (audio-cd) and played them with my dvd player. It worked,
> > eliminating my receiver and speakers. I have tried wireless,
> > eliminating my
> > network cabling. I have setup a server on my laptop, and hooked it to
> > the
> > squeezebox with an ethernet crossover cable, eliminating my PC and my
> > switch. I have powered the squeeze with a DC/AC converter from my
> > car,
> > and used headphones and the laptop, eliminating possible ground loop
> > problems. I have tried the mp3's on winamp, streaming from Slimserver
> > and
> > locally, and they play fine. The kicker is, I have played .wav files
> > of these
> > sound samples through the Squeezebox and, THEY PLAY FINE. So the
> > problem is related to mp3 decoding on the slimp3/squeezebox, and is, as
> > best as I can tell, not related to my pc, encoder, hardware, receiver
> > or
> > speakers.. I am running server 5.1.1 on WinXP, and whatever firmware
> > comes with that.
> >
> > So, I appreciate anyone else that can test that file and let me know
> > how it
> > works, and I am open to any suggestions of further things to try.
> >
> > Darren White
> > InterStar Inc.
> > 530-224-6866 x 103
> >
> >

seanadams
2004-04-06, 16:26
I remember this issue. I'd like to determine if using a different
*en*coder makes it go away - not that it's the encoder's fault - just
trying determine what triggers the glitch you're getting, eg is it a
combination of a *particular* encoder plus this decoder, or do you get
the glitch for this waveform no matter how it's encoded. Also I was not
aware that you'd encountered this with regular music tracks...


On Apr 6, 2004, at 9:23 AM, Darren White wrote:

> I am not trying to test frequency response. I am trying to figure out
> why when I listen to things like "Butthole Surfers - Pepper" my sub
> pops. Since listening to music is so much just my perception or
> opinion, I am trying to "prove" that the squeezebox can properly play
> all MP3's, so I play very simple ones to make sure I am really hearing
> what I am hearing. Playing a wav only proves that the problem is
> limited to mp3's, but doesnt really fix it now does it? :)
>
> It would be a shame to think that I need to rip all my CD's to wav,
> because of a problem with MP3. If I am the only guy in the world with
> this problem (2 players, different sources, etc make it not that
> likely)
> then fine. If I am not the only person with this problem, and its a
> simple software patch, then we all benefit.
>
> And yes, this is the same problem you guys replaced my SLiMP3 for.
> I have been busy, but the problem hasn't gone away. And nothing I
> have done has eliminated it. If its is somehow that "specific" file,
> then
> can the decoder be fixed?
>
>> For the purpose of testing frequency response and such, you really
>> don't want to have a perceptual codec between your source and your
>> speakers! That's not to say you haven't found a file that the decoder
>> barfs on - I'm just wondering why not use .wav for this?
>>
>> On Apr 6, 2004, at 8:27 AM, Darren White wrote:
>>
>>> Not this one, just the ones I made myself.. But this one had the same
>>> playback problems, so I figured it was as good a test as any for the
>>> rest of you guys, and it rules me out since I didn't encode it. :)
>>>
>>> I'd be happy to provide my original wavs, mp3's (256cbr, abr, 128,
>>> etc.).
>>>
>>> From: Sean Adams <sadams (AT) slimdevices (DOT) com>
>>> Subject: Re: [slim] Problem with SLiMP3 and Squeezebox MP3
>>> Decoding
>>> Date sent: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:32:30 -0700
>>> To: Slim Devices Discussion
>>> <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
>>> Send reply to: Slim Devices Discussion
>>> <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
>>> <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=unsubscribe>
>>> <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=subscribe>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Darren, have you tried this test tone as a WAV?
>>>>
>>
>>

Darren White
2004-04-06, 17:15
I am not trying to test frequency response. I am trying to figure out
why when I listen to things like "Butthole Surfers - Pepper" my sub
pops. Since listening to music is so much just my perception or
opinion, I am trying to "prove" that the squeezebox can properly play
all MP3's, so I play very simple ones to make sure I am really hearing
what I am hearing. Playing a wav only proves that the problem is
limited to mp3's, but doesnt really fix it now does it? :)

It would be a shame to think that I need to rip all my CD's to wav,
because of a problem with MP3. If I am the only guy in the world with
this problem (2 players, different sources, etc make it not that likely)
then fine. If I am not the only person with this problem, and its a
simple software patch, then we all benefit.

And yes, this is the same problem you guys replaced my SLiMP3 for.
I have been busy, but the problem hasn't gone away. And nothing I
have done has eliminated it. If its is somehow that "specific" file, then
can the decoder be fixed?

> For the purpose of testing frequency response and such, you really
> don't want to have a perceptual codec between your source and your
> speakers! That's not to say you haven't found a file that the decoder
> barfs on - I'm just wondering why not use .wav for this?
>
> On Apr 6, 2004, at 8:27 AM, Darren White wrote:
>
> > Not this one, just the ones I made myself.. But this one had the same
> > playback problems, so I figured it was as good a test as any for the
> > rest of you guys, and it rules me out since I didn't encode it. :)
> >
> > I'd be happy to provide my original wavs, mp3's (256cbr, abr, 128,
> > etc.).
> >
> > From: Sean Adams <sadams (AT) slimdevices (DOT) com>
> > Subject: Re: [slim] Problem with SLiMP3 and Squeezebox MP3
> > Decoding
> > Date sent: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:32:30 -0700
> > To: Slim Devices Discussion
> > <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> > Send reply to: Slim Devices Discussion
> > <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> > <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> > <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=subscribe>
> >
> >>
> >> Darren, have you tried this test tone as a WAV?
> >>
>
>

Darren White
2004-04-06, 17:32
> I remember this issue. I'd like to determine if using a different
> *en*coder makes it go away - not that it's the encoder's fault - just
> trying determine what triggers the glitch you're getting, eg is it a
> combination of a *particular* encoder plus this decoder, or do you get
> the glitch for this waveform no matter how it's encoded. Also I was not
> aware that you'd encountered this with regular music tracks...

What would be best for me is this. I'll post some wav files, you can
check them and make sure they look good. Encode with any means
at your disposal, and when you find an encoder that works, give me
the file and I'll try it. I have only used 2 version of lame (one 1 or 2
years old, one current as of 3 or 4 months ago) to encode, and I do
not know what that company encoded their sweep with. I have tried
CBR, VBR, and ABR, 128, 256, and 320k. All exhibited the same
problems.

Let me know if that sound acceptable. If you don't want to spend the
time encoding, just give me some links to free encoders available on
Windows and I'll try it. I tried to go down this road, and the first music
studio encoder thing I installed came with adware. So I figured lame
was good enough for me. :)

> On Apr 6, 2004, at 9:23 AM, Darren White wrote:
>
> > I am not trying to test frequency response. I am trying to figure out
> > why when I listen to things like "Butthole Surfers - Pepper" my sub
> > pops. Since listening to music is so much just my perception or
> > opinion, I am trying to "prove" that the squeezebox can properly play
> > all MP3's, so I play very simple ones to make sure I am really hearing
> > what I am hearing. Playing a wav only proves that the problem is
> > limited to mp3's, but doesnt really fix it now does it? :)
> >
> > It would be a shame to think that I need to rip all my CD's to wav,
> > because of a problem with MP3. If I am the only guy in the world with
> > this problem (2 players, different sources, etc make it not that
> > likely)
> > then fine. If I am not the only person with this problem, and its a
> > simple software patch, then we all benefit.
> >
> > And yes, this is the same problem you guys replaced my SLiMP3 for.
> > I have been busy, but the problem hasn't gone away. And nothing I
> > have done has eliminated it. If its is somehow that "specific" file,
> > then
> > can the decoder be fixed?
> >
> >> For the purpose of testing frequency response and such, you really
> >> don't want to have a perceptual codec between your source and your
> >> speakers! That's not to say you haven't found a file that the decoder
> >> barfs on - I'm just wondering why not use .wav for this?
> >>
> >> On Apr 6, 2004, at 8:27 AM, Darren White wrote:
> >>
> >>> Not this one, just the ones I made myself.. But this one had the same
> >>> playback problems, so I figured it was as good a test as any for the
> >>> rest of you guys, and it rules me out since I didn't encode it. :)
> >>>
> >>> I'd be happy to provide my original wavs, mp3's (256cbr, abr, 128,
> >>> etc.).
> >>>
> >>> From: Sean Adams <sadams (AT) slimdevices (DOT) com>
> >>> Subject: Re: [slim] Problem with SLiMP3 and Squeezebox MP3
> >>> Decoding
> >>> Date sent: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 14:32:30 -0700
> >>> To: Slim Devices Discussion
> >>> <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> >>> Send reply to: Slim Devices Discussion
> >>> <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
> >>> <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=unsubscribe>
> >>> <mailto:discuss-request (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com?subject=subscribe>
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Darren, have you tried this test tone as a WAV?
> >>>>
> >>
> >>