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jw111
2008-06-28, 05:28
I need to get a new router and would like to pick the 802.11n router that works best with my Duet Controller. I am using a wired connection for the receiver.

What 802.11n router is as reliable as possible with the Controller?

Maybe the Squeezebox people could say what routers they develop with?

Thanks

bonze
2008-06-28, 07:16
Define 'best'....
If you want a router that is reliable with the Controller, then you want a reliable router.

Unless there are any forum members with a collection of routers to do a comparison you're just going to get a list of working routers.
It would be difficult to say if my router (Netgear) is better than any other as I it's the only one I have :)

Try trawling the net for comparison sites.

jw111
2008-06-28, 08:19
I have already been looking at comparison sites.

Still, a list of working routers would be better than nothing. If I get enough comments then I will see some trends about which ones tend work.

Also, If enough people say which routers do not work then I will get a sense of which ones to avoid. I seem to recall reading that there were problems with Zyxel routers.

Thanks.

funkstar
2008-06-28, 10:20
The wireless portion of Zyxel and Drayteck routers historically have caused problems, I don't know if this is still the case.

There are a few new routers utilising the 5GHz portion of the 802.11n spec. However this won't benefit G users as it is 2.4GHz only. It's not that they won't work (they still have a2.4GHz radio as well) you just won't get the benefit of those extra dollars you spent.

amcluesent
2008-06-28, 10:24
The D-Link DIR-655 has had good reviews. Mine is fine, with a laptop and SB3 off the wi-fi.

Jeff Flowerday
2008-06-28, 23:20
The D-Link DIR-655 has had good reviews. Mine is fine, with a laptop and SB3 off the wi-fi.

I'm running the same one, it works great. A buddy has it as well, works great for him as well.

jw111
2008-06-29, 05:24
Are you running the Duet with it?



I'm running the same one, it works great. A buddy has it as well, works great for him as well.

pablolie
2008-06-29, 09:23
the duet and the linksys wrt54gx4 do *not* like each other, the receiver works most of the time, the controller drops out all the time despite all the tricks in the forums.

Jeff Flowerday
2008-06-29, 15:29
Are you running the Duet with it?


Yes, that's why I replied to your thread.

Nonreality
2008-06-29, 16:22
I use the Netgear WNR854T N which replaced a Netgear Rangemax G+ that was about 10 mths old when I replaced it in Feb. I made a huge difference with both my Laptop and my SB3. I don't know how it works with the Duet but I'd highly recommend it for laptops and the SB3. You definitely want to get a matching card for any laptop you use regardless of what brand you buy if you want it to work at the higher speeds. If anyone out there has this model you need to go and update it and your card. I regularly had the router check for updates and ended up missing 2 of them and just happened to check the site 3 days ago. The new firmware has made it really fast with both N and wired. Major update and well worth it, I was really surprised as were my kids.

irablumberg
2008-06-30, 13:37
I like the Linksys WRT600N. It has both 5GHz and 2.4GHz radios. I run all my home computers on the 5GHz channels. This leaves maximum bandwidth for Duet communications on 2.4GHz. It works quite well.

Ira

radish
2008-07-01, 06:43
The D-Link DIR-655 has had good reviews. Mine is fine, with a laptop and SB3 off the wi-fi.

Same here.

Sike
2008-07-01, 09:20
I have a WRT160N, works fine.

doggieflyer
2008-07-01, 10:26
I chose the Belkin N1 Vision wireless router in part because it has a display on the router where I can clearly see which devices are connecting and the bandwidth they are utilizing. It has four Ethernet ports as well. The browser-based config tool has been easy to use and full featured. The firewall can be disabled or configured as can DHCP.

So far it's worked fine with my SB receivers. They are wired via ethernet while the controller connects over wireless.

Pascal Hibon
2008-07-01, 10:54
Just keep in mind that 802.11n (or MIMO) is not a standard yet. It is still in draft. The current draft is 2.0 I believe. If for some reason the draft gets important changes, those changes could affect hardware requirements of Access Points. The IEEE will need at least until the end of 2008 before it gets into a standard. I donít want to be negative about 802.11n, just be advised when shopping for such devices.

I currently run a D-Link 802.11b/g Access Point. This works flawlessly with my SB3. The throughput of the g radio is still enough for my application. The g radio has enough bandwidth available for devices such as SBís, Receivers and Transporters.

amcluesent
2008-07-01, 12:18
I wonder if there will ever be an 802.11n upgrade for the SB3, Receiver and Transporter, IIRC they all use mini-PCI cards for the wi-fi like this, poss. based on Atheros chip-set. Probably just a few lines of code in the firmware...

radish
2008-07-01, 13:37
I wonder if there will ever be an 802.11n upgrade for the SB3, Receiver and Transporter, IIRC they all use mini-PCI cards for the wi-fi like this, poss. based on Atheros chip-set. Probably just a few lines of code in the firmware...

This has been discussed a number of times before. Short answer: no. Longer answer: there's no reason to use n in devices like this with low bandwidth requirements.

jw111
2008-07-01, 18:13
I thought that 802.11n includes MIMO, which could help increase the range.


This has been discussed a number of times before. Short answer: no. Longer answer: there's no reason to use n in devices like this with low bandwidth requirements.

JimC
2008-07-01, 18:14
I need to get a new router and would like to pick the 802.11n router that works best with my Duet Controller. I am using a wired connection for the receiver.

What 802.11n router is as reliable as possible with the Controller?

Maybe the Squeezebox people could say what routers they develop with?

Thanks

Sean (Slim's founder) uses the Linksys WRT600N and told me he really likes them.

Personally, I use the WRT54GL with Tomato FW; anything that needs lots of bandwidth is wired in my house, so G is fine for me and I really like that router from a stability perspective.


-=> Jim

pfarrell
2008-07-01, 20:41
Just to agree with "Pascal Hibon", the standard is not agreed upon. It may happen this year, it may not. IEEE moves in mysterious ways.

There is no "need" for an 11N router in the SlimDevices world. The bandwidth requirements do not push 11G.

Some of the better "11N" marketed routers use 5 gHz band in addition to the overcrowded and overused 2.4gHz band. This is a really good thing (tm), but it will be years before the world gives up on 2.4, if ever.

MrSinatra
2008-07-01, 21:21
the obvious requirement for N has nothing to do with slim, and everything to do with the router.

a LOT of wireless networks are BETTER when the router need only support N instead of a mixed mode of G and N or B, G and N.

it would be nice for slim to allow customers to pick N so mixed mode was not made a necessity.

it is problematic that the N standard is not official, but when it is a fw upgrade should allow todays recent draft N stuff to be official, so i don't see why that should stop slim.

i use a d-link 655 as well and think its a great router, (it does N btw), and i think linksys is more often than not totally junk. netgear stuff is good too from my exposure to it. (i used to think d-link was junk after some years ago bad exp's, but this router got such rave reviews i gave it a shot and it hasn't disappointed. very good imo)

booguss
2008-07-02, 03:17
For me the combination DIR-635 as router and DAP-1353 as Access Point in Repeater Mode works great. Now I have a really good wireless strenght throughout the whole house ( never under 80% :-) )
However, before I got this to work I had to spend some great time with the the D-Link telephone support. Now I have learned that it's there are compatibility issues between the wless router and the DAP.

A wireless modem/router DI-624 and DAP does not work. There must be first a simple ADSL-modem, then wireless router (preferably DIR-635 or DIR-655) and then - somewhere else in the house - the DAP, everything setup according to the standards of same SSID, Subnet IP etc... But once set up - rock on!!
Cheers!

/Boo

Nonreality
2008-07-02, 03:48
the obvious requirement for N has nothing to do with slim, and everything to do with the router.

a LOT of wireless networks are BETTER when the router need only support N instead of a mixed mode of G and N or B, G and N.

it would be nice for slim to allow customers to pick N so mixed mode was not made a necessity.

it is problematic that the N standard is not official, but when it is a fw upgrade should allow todays recent draft N stuff to be official, so i don't see why that should stop slim.

i use a d-link 655 as well and think its a great router, (it does N btw), and i think linksys is more often than not totally junk. netgear stuff is good too from my exposure to it. (i used to think d-link was junk after some years ago bad exp's, but this router got such rave reviews i gave it a shot and it hasn't disappointed. very good imo)Thats one thing I really like about my netgear N router. It doesn't have any problem with mixed speeds. No need to turn off any of the advanced settings.

radish
2008-07-02, 06:31
a LOT of wireless networks are BETTER when the router need only support N instead of a mixed mode of G and N or B, G and N.


The N standard (such as it is) has full backwards compatability with G. There is no performance penalty associated with a mixed G/N network as there is with a mixed B/G. Hence my statement (based on statements made by those better informed than myself) that there's no reason for low bandwidth clients to move to N hardware. Sean posted an excellent Q&A with a wifi expert a while back which explained this in more detail.

MrSinatra
2008-07-02, 07:43
well, besides the idea that being all N is good in that it keeps those without N from any possible way in, (a slight but nonetheless considered position), it was my understanding from this article, (which used to be toms hardware i think?) that in any mode other than pure N the router goes from 40mhz channels to 20.

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30087/96/1/4/

lots of good info in that article, worth reading the whole thing. i'm no expert so i can't say that mixed mode impacts me in any perceptible way even if it does technically, but another consideration is that the SBs can bridge wirelessly right? so if i have some gear hooked into it via ethernet and using it as the wireless adapter, isn't it a good idea to have more BW for the SB and its client?

radish
2008-07-02, 07:55
but another consideration is that the SBs can bridge wirelessly right? so if i have some gear hooked into it via ethernet and using it as the wireless adapter, isn't it a good idea to have more BW for the SB and its client?
That's kind of an edge case :) I'm sure that once N is ratified and the chipsets are down to the same prices as G now that the SB5 or whatever it is will have N. There's just no reason for Logi to jump on the retrofit bandwagon yet.

Nonreality
2008-07-02, 11:25
well, besides the idea that being all N is good in that it keeps those without N from any possible way in, (a slight but nonetheless considered position), it was my understanding from this article, (which used to be toms hardware i think?) that in any mode other than pure N the router goes from 40mhz channels to 20.

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30087/96/1/4/

lots of good info in that article, worth reading the whole thing. i'm no expert so i can't say that mixed mode impacts me in any perceptible way even if it does technically, but another consideration is that the SBs can bridge wirelessly right? so if i have some gear hooked into it via ethernet and using it as the wireless adapter, isn't it a good idea to have more BW for the SB and its client?I need to read up more on how mine works. I know it has a switch for mixed mode if you have problems but I haven't need it. As far as Logitech jumping in with the sb I really don't know how they could at this moment in time. To pick one as the evidential winner could be disaster if they picked wrong. Maybe the winning stardard could be accepted by firware changes maybe not. I'd error on caution if I were them until a standard is set and then I would think they would add it. It might be that only new ones will do this but thats part of life. If it's important enough to me I guess I'd upgrade. Hopefully they can upgrade the current ones. I do know with the update that I just did to my router and card some big changes happened. Speeds are way up on mine and it was pretty fast already. Hopefully it's getting close to a standard and everyone can more on.

DeVerm
2008-07-03, 13:30
I need to get a new router and would like to pick the 802.11n router that works best with my Duet Controller. I am using a wired connection for the receiver.

What 802.11n router is as reliable as possible with the Controller?

Maybe the Squeezebox people could say what routers they develop with?

Thanks

I am using the D-Link DGL4500 for a month or so now and it's great. IMHO the "gaming grade" stuff is sturdier/better, just like with mice and keyboards.

Also, I am of the opinion that 802.11n might help SB with increasing range. Also again: I think that people that say SB is fine with 802.11g are right but they miss a point: it's not just the SB using the wifi so how does the mixed environment impact performance on other 802.11n devices. Just saying that "an expert" said that it doesn't matter is irrelevant. One poster wrote that channel bandwidth is restricted to 20 MHz in mixed mode g/n while n-only would use 40 MHz. That sounds like a big difference to me and I'm supposed to be an expert on this stuff too (electronics- and network-designer).

cheers,
DeVerm.

radish
2008-07-03, 16:26
Just saying that "an expert" said that it doesn't matter is irrelevant.

It's not "an expert", it's the VP of engineering at one of the leading designers of wifi chipsets. Feel free to point to evidence that he's wrong, but in the absence of that I'll take his word for it.

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?p=263658#post263658