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View Full Version : Which LOSSLESS format? FLAC? Monkey? Shorten?



David Ranch
2004-01-14, 19:48
Hey Everyone,

I'm about to get a Squeezebox for the digital-out ability. Once I have this, I
finally plan to encode my entire CD collection in a lossless format. Once
lossless, I can stream to the Squeezebox in raw PCM, encode to MP3 for my
SLIMP3 and iPOD, and when some new codec-de-jour comes out, I can encode for
that format without dealing with any transcoding quality loss.

The question is WHICH lossless format?

FLAC? - open (good) but larger file footprint (bad)
Monkey?
Shorten?

These URLS show the various encoding times, resulting file sizes, etc.

http://mp3.radified.com/audio_codec_comparison.htm

http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/flac/flac/doc/Attic/comparison.html?rev=1.50

More URLs of course:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=comparison+of+FLAC+MP3&btnG=Google+Search


Ps. The ripper, encoder, and SlimDevices server will be a SMP Linux
box. Windows nor OSX is an option. Time is not an issue.. resulting file size
is somewhat important.

Thanks!

--David
..----------------------------------------------------------------------------.
| David A. Ranch - Linux/Networking/PC hardware dranch (AT) trinnet (DOT) net |
!---- ----!
`----- For more detailed info, see http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~dranch -----'

kdf
2004-01-14, 20:05
Quoting David Ranch <dranch (AT) trinnet (DOT) net>:
>
> FLAC? - open (good) but larger file footprint (bad)
> Monkey?
> Shorten?
First off, I dont' put much faith in online reports. In my own tests, FLAC
resulted in smaller filesizes than shorten. Granted, I've only tested with 10
out of 400 cd's in my collection, but it was enough to choose.

Monkey...not supported yet in the server.

Shorten...works well using EAC, with shorten.exe set as the external encoder in
EAC. However, with existing WAV files, ripped in separate sessions and not
necessarily from EAC, the shorten files read as a duration of zero, and thus do
not play. I'm sure this will be fixed eventually.

FLAC...has given me no issues at all. The drawback here is that I have not yet
figured out how to get it to work with EAC, which is my ripper of choice. If I
can' get it to work with grip that might be nice too as I would like to set up a
Linux box an an automatic rip and serve jukebox. I can even store ID3 tags,
which I haven't figured out for shorten.

My choice, FLAC. Now I just have to psyche myself up to rip all my cd again :)

-kdf

Jeffrey Gordon
2004-01-15, 05:28
I use EAC to rip to FLAC all the time.

Check out this page for how to config it, the FLAC instructions are near
the bottom.
http://www.saunalahti.fi/cse/EAC/index.html

You want to DISABLE ID3 tags, sure some programs willl read them ok,
however many get royally confused by it. Use the native flac tags instead.

As for FLAC having larger file sizes, if you are comparing lossless
codecs, the difference is very little. FLAC has an advantage in that
decode time is faster which means less load on your Slimserver that is
decoding the data.


kdf wrote:

>Quoting David Ranch <dranch (AT) trinnet (DOT) net>:
>
>
>>FLAC? - open (good) but larger file footprint (bad)
>>Monkey?
>>Shorten?
>>
>>
>First off, I dont' put much faith in online reports. In my own tests, FLAC
>resulted in smaller filesizes than shorten. Granted, I've only tested with 10
>out of 400 cd's in my collection, but it was enough to choose.
>
>Monkey...not supported yet in the server.
>
>Shorten...works well using EAC, with shorten.exe set as the external encoder in
>EAC. However, with existing WAV files, ripped in separate sessions and not
>necessarily from EAC, the shorten files read as a duration of zero, and thus do
>not play. I'm sure this will be fixed eventually.
>
>FLAC...has given me no issues at all. The drawback here is that I have not yet
>figured out how to get it to work with EAC, which is my ripper of choice. If I
>can' get it to work with grip that might be nice too as I would like to set up a
>Linux box an an automatic rip and serve jukebox. I can even store ID3 tags,
>which I haven't figured out for shorten.
>
>My choice, FLAC. Now I just have to psyche myself up to rip all my cd again :)
>
>-kdf
>
>
>
>

Thomas B. Malsbury
2004-01-15, 06:43
----- Original Message -----
From: "kdf" <slim-mail (AT) deane-freeman (DOT) com>
To: "Slim Devices Discussion" <discuss (AT) lists (DOT) slimdevices.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 10:05 PM
Subject: [slim] Which LOSSLESS format? FLAC? Monkey? Shorten?


>
> FLAC...has given me no issues at all. The drawback here is that I have not
yet
> figured out how to get it to work with EAC, which is my ripper of choice.
If I
> can' get it to work with grip that might be nice too as I would like to
set up a
> Linux box an an automatic rip and serve jukebox. I can even store ID3
tags,
> which I haven't figured out for shorten.
>
> My choice, FLAC. Now I just have to psyche myself up to rip all my cd
again :)
>
> -kdf
>

I have just set up EAC to use FLAC.EXE as the external encoder yesterday.
It seems to work great, tags the files and everything. The lucky break was
finding a webpage that had the extra command line options needed by EAC to
open up FLAC and start the compression.

The page was: http://www.saunalahti.fi/~cse/EAC/. See the FLAC section about
half way down the page. This page also has info on setting up EAC to encode
to AAC, Ogg Vorbis, Monkey's, LAME MP3 and some others.

Tom