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View Full Version : how to set an in point on a song



exile
2007-01-09, 08:03
my apologies if this has already been thoroughly covered in this forum but in multiple searches I haven't found any threads dealing with setting an in point in a track.

I have many tracks (especially grateful dead live tracks) in which the first 30 secs of a song is just crowd noise or tuning and so I'd like to mark an in point at the actual start of the music in the track instead of at the beginning of the song. I'd like it to work so that whenever the song is selected in any fashion (playlist, random mix,etc) that the song starts at the marked in point.

is there a plugin out there that will easily do this? thanks for your help!

exile
2007-01-11, 16:22
since I've gotten no response I gotta ask, is this a request that anyone else would like to have as a feature? For me, the need to set in points in songs comes up relatively often and not just for live music.

aubuti
2007-01-11, 18:52
Hmm, that's odd, because I thought I had posted a reply to your first post. You don't say what format your files are in, but I strongly suspect that you'll have to go back to a "raw" format, like WAV. Then use cutpoints to define the tuning/crowd noise as a separate track. You can do this using a cue sheet (leaving everything as a single file) or by separating them into different files.

Useful tools for doing this are Audacity (audacity.sourceforge.net), GoldWave, or several other packages. They will analyze the tracks and try to guess where the useful cutpoints are, but it still usually involves a fair bit of work. I hope there are simpler options, but I can't think of any.

cliveb
2007-01-12, 01:43
I have many tracks (especially grateful dead live tracks) in which the first 30 secs of a song is just crowd noise or tuning and so I'd like to mark an in point at the actual start of the music in the track instead of at the beginning of the song. I'd like it to work so that whenever the song is selected in any fashion (playlist, random mix,etc) that the song starts at the marked in point.
I wasn't going to reply, since I'm not sure that what I'm thinking is actually the case in your situation, but since nobody else has offered anything, here goes...

In my experience, these "intro" parts to tracks on live albums are usually in index 0 of the track. You can check this by playing the original CD on a CD player and looking at the CD player's display. If, while these intros are playing, the CD display is counting down, then it's in index 0.

When you rip a CD, what happens to the stuff in index 0 depends on the ripper you use, and possibly the way you configure it. There are basically three possibilities:

1. The index 0 contents are included at the start of the track. It sounds like this is how your ripper is currently working.

2. The index 0 contents are appended to the end of the preceding track. I believe this the the default setting for EAC. If you rip your CDs like this, then when you go to a particular track, you won't get the intro noise, which is what you want. It will be played if you play the album through, which is probably also what you want. But if you play an individual track that has the next track's index 0 tacked on to the end, then it will also be played, which is probably not what you want. But of course you can always stop the playback (or skip to the next track in the playlist) when the appended index 0 content starts.

3. The index 0 contents are discarded. I can't think of a case where this would be useful to me, but I think some people like to remove the gaps between tracks.

[4. In principle, the index 0 contents could be put into a separate file all by itself, but I've never heard of a ripper that has that option, unless there's some obscure option in EAC I've not seen].

So, I reckon from a ripping point of view, there is no simple solution. Option 2 above seems the closest to what you want. The suggestion of a "track startpoint" tag that gives an offset into the file where the music starts sounds like a pretty neat idea to me.

exile
2007-01-12, 12:48
thanks a bunch for the responses.

most of my music is either flac or mp3. the ripping software is max because i'm on a mac.

I haven't dabbled with cue sheets yet but I'd like to give that a shot. I have used audacity in the past and so that seems like one possible option.

and clive, thanks for laying out the other possibilities. one problem with re-ripping is that I have a lot of music that I don't possess original cd's of.

my feeling is that having a marked in point (which would just be another tag field) is the simplest approach. I'm a video editor and setting in points on media files is probably one the simplest things that can be done in editing software programs so i thought it could be easily translatable to the slim realm.

Pale Blue Ego
2007-01-12, 14:30
FLAC has support for index points, but I'm not sure how Slimserver handles them or how they'd be controlled. I don't have any CDs with indexes, so the issue never arose.