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4mula1
2006-12-05, 13:05
I would've searched but the search isn't currently working. Please forgive me.

It looks like my parents will be getting a SB3 and I was wondering if there was a plugin that could make their Slimserver act like a player and connect to my Slimserver? I would need to be able to set bandwidth limiting since my music collection is in FLAC, as well as be able to do SSH.

Is there such a beast as this?

JJZolx
2006-12-05, 13:49
I would've searched but the search isn't currently working. Please forgive me.

It looks like my parents will be getting a SB3 and I was wondering if there was a plugin that could make their Slimserver act like a player and connect to my Slimserver? I would need to be able to set bandwidth limiting since my music collection is in FLAC, as well as be able to do SSH.

Is there such a beast as this?
Why not have their Squeezebox connect to your SlimServer?

4mula1
2006-12-05, 18:44
Why not have their Squeezebox connect to your SlimServer?

My SlimServer is behind a firewall. I have port 22 open so I can use SoftSqueeze at work, and I thought it would be nice to be able to link one SlimServer to another via SSH. I don't see SSH being added to the Squeezebox firmware so SlimServer will have to do that work. The client SlimServer could then appear like another player (ala SoftSqueeze) and be able to browse and stream from the remote server.

SuperQ
2006-12-05, 19:58
My SlimServer is behind a firewall. I have port 22 open so I can use SoftSqueeze at work, and I thought it would be nice to be able to link one SlimServer to another via SSH. I don't see SSH being added to the Squeezebox firmware so SlimServer will have to do that work. The client SlimServer could then appear like another player (ala SoftSqueeze) and be able to browse and stream from the remote server.

you could use ssh to forward the TCP ports to the other slim server. You would need an ssh client on your parrents network, if they have windows, putty would work fine.. you just need to do something like this:

ssh -g -L 9000:localhost:9000 -L 3483:localhost:3483 user@host

the -g will allow the squeezebox to connect over the ssh tunnel.

be warned, this could be really slow over DSL/Cable.

mherger
2006-12-05, 22:29
> be warned, this could be really slow over DSL/Cable.

It isn't if you have a decent DSL/cable connection. I started doing this
when I had 400k outgoing. But I must admit that there's little going on at
times when I access slimserver from outside - as I'm typically not at home
then :-)

--

Michael

-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.herger.net/SlimCD - your SlimServer on a CD
http://www.herger.net/slim - AlbumReview, Biography, MusicInfoSCR

peter
2006-12-05, 23:58
4mula1 wrote:
> I would've searched but the search isn't currently working. Please
> forgive me.
>
> It looks like my parents will be getting a SB3 and I was wondering if
> there was a plugin that could make their Slimserver act like a player
> and connect to my Slimserver? I would need to be able to set bandwidth
> limiting since my music collection is in FLAC, as well as be able to do
> SSH.
>
> Is there such a beast as this
I don't know if I understood you correctly, but it's perfectly possible
to connect one slimserver to another. Just use Radio tune in to connect
to http://remote.ip:9000/stream.mp3. It's a bit slow chaning tracks,
probably due to buffering.

Regards,
Peter

peter
2006-12-06, 00:00
SuperQ wrote:
> 4mula1;160010 Wrote:
>
>> My SlimServer is behind a firewall. I have port 22 open so I can use
>> SoftSqueeze at work, and I thought it would be nice to be able to link
>> one SlimServer to another via SSH. I don't see SSH being added to the
>> Squeezebox firmware so SlimServer will have to do that work. The
>> client SlimServer could then appear like another player (ala
>> SoftSqueeze) and be able to browse and stream from the remote server.
>>
>
> you could use ssh to forward the TCP ports to the other slim server.
> You would need an ssh client on your parrents network, if they have
> windows, putty would work fine.. you just need to do something like
> this:
>
> ssh -g -L 9000:localhost:9000 -L 3483:localhost:3483 user@host
>
> the -g will allow the squeezebox to connect over the ssh tunnel.
>
> be warned, this could be really slow over DSL/Cable.
>
Why not just open a port on your router accessible only to their IP
address. In practice that's just as secure as an SSH tunnel and a lot
less complicated/error prone. IP restrictions are perfectly secure in
practice (and faster as well).

Regards,
Peter

mherger
2006-12-06, 00:18
> IP restrictions are perfectly secure in practice (and faster as well).

....except if your ISP changes your IP every day.

--

Michael

-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.herger.net/SlimCD - your SlimServer on a CD
http://www.herger.net/slim - AlbumReview, Biography, MusicInfoSCR

4mula1
2006-12-06, 04:30
There are some ideas here, which is good, I'm glad to see soem interest. But maybe I need to clarify some things to make what I am really looking for more clear.

Like I said before, this is for my parents. My parents aren't computer savvy, therefore I am the family IT manager. I want a minimum of things that can go wrong but make it super easy to use.

I would like to be able to initiate the remote connection from the SB3 and also be able to browse the remote library as if it were a local library. I do understand the slow changing tracks, that's due to buffering. I see it with SoftSqueeze.

To be able to browse the remote music collection the remote SS would have to send the track data formatted for the local SS to format it for the local player. I prefer Artist - Album but my parents may like something else. I don't want to shove my preferred format down their throat if that's not what they want. SS must pass the tag info, something which current stream.mp3 streaming won't do as effectively. That's why I believe so much that this needs to be a seperate plugin, because there are a few caveats to doing this where the local SS needs to control the local player but needs to parse specially formatted data from the remote SS to keep everything looking consistent with the local users' preferences.

For a wider audience, who don't have a static IP address, the ability to resolve a hostname would be important, especially if using dyndns or other similar services. I have a static IP address, so that's no issue for me. My parents have a dynamic IP address, so IP address filtering comes down to the block of addresses my ISP has, not ideal.

Integrated SSH may not be required as long as putty or or similar tunneling tools can keep a persistent connection. It would also need to be able to reconnect if the remote server goes down (it is Windows, you have to reboot for EVERYTHING). Even with that, the plugin would need to make periodic checks for the remote SS availability and if it's not available show it unavailable and have an option to notify when it is.

JJZolx
2006-12-06, 10:36
There are some ideas here, which is good, I'm glad to see soem interest. But maybe I need to clarify some things to make what I am really looking for more clear.

Ok, maybe it needs to be explicitly stated: The capability that you're looking for does not exist in SlimServer.


Like I said before, this is for my parents. My parents aren't computer savvy, therefore I am the family IT manager. I want a minimum of things that can go wrong but make it super easy to use.

Connecting SlimServer to a library located on a remote network is a _long_ way from "a minimum of things that can go wrong".


I would like to be able to initiate the remote connection from the SB3 and also be able to browse the remote library as if it were a local library.

Again, this doesn't exist in the long list of SlimServer capabilities. The only thing I can think of (and I have no idea if it would work): Push your library data into their database and then change the URL of each track to something pointing at the file on your server. I'm not sure if that could work, but if it's important to you may be worth exploring. How you'll get the data to them I have no idea. FTP a MySQL database dump, or a delimited text file to their server, then import it into MySQL I guess. You want a tunnel? Build one.


I do understand the slow changing tracks, that's due to buffering. I see it with SoftSqueeze.

To be able to browse the remote music collection the remote SS would have to send the track data formatted for the local SS to format it for the local player. I prefer Artist - Album but my parents may like something else. I don't want to shove my preferred format down their throat if that's not what they want. SS must pass the tag info, something which current stream.mp3 streaming won't do as effectively. That's why I believe so much that this needs to be a seperate plugin, because there are a few caveats to doing this where the local SS needs to control the local player but needs to parse specially formatted data from the remote SS to keep everything looking consistent with the local users' preferences.

I thought display formatting was player specific.


For a wider audience, who don't have a static IP address, the ability to resolve a hostname would be important, especially if using dyndns or other similar services. I have a static IP address, so that's no issue for me. My parents have a dynamic IP address, so IP address filtering comes down to the block of addresses my ISP has, not ideal.

Unless they're on dialup the address may be a lot more static than you realize. I've had the same Comcast IP address for going on two years. Other cable company users and DSL users report similar experiences. If you only had to fiddle with a single firewall rule every two years, isn't that good enough?


Integrated SSH may not be required as long as putty or or similar tunneling tools can keep a persistent connection. It would also need to be able to reconnect if the remote server goes down (it is Windows, you have to reboot for EVERYTHING). Even with that, the plugin would need to make periodic checks for the remote SS availability and if it's not available show it unavailable and have an option to notify when it is.

Why in the world do you need SSH for streaming audio?

If you don't like the ideas given previously, here's what you do: Copy your library to an external hard drive. When you visit your parents for Christmas, attach it to their server, configure SlimServer to look at the external disk, then go drink some eggnog.

azinck3
2006-12-06, 11:55
There are some ideas here, which is good, I'm glad to see soem interest. But maybe I need to clarify some things to make what I am really looking for more clear.

Like I said before, this is for my parents. My parents aren't computer savvy, therefore I am the family IT manager. I want a minimum of things that can go wrong but make it super easy to use.

I would like to be able to initiate the remote connection from the SB3 and also be able to browse the remote library as if it were a local library. I do understand the slow changing tracks, that's due to buffering. I see it with SoftSqueeze.

To be able to browse the remote music collection the remote SS would have to send the track data formatted for the local SS to format it for the local player. I prefer Artist - Album but my parents may like something else. I don't want to shove my preferred format down their throat if that's not what they want. SS must pass the tag info, something which current stream.mp3 streaming won't do as effectively. That's why I believe so much that this needs to be a seperate plugin, because there are a few caveats to doing this where the local SS needs to control the local player but needs to parse specially formatted data from the remote SS to keep everything looking consistent with the local users' preferences.

For a wider audience, who don't have a static IP address, the ability to resolve a hostname would be important, especially if using dyndns or other similar services. I have a static IP address, so that's no issue for me. My parents have a dynamic IP address, so IP address filtering comes down to the block of addresses my ISP has, not ideal.

Integrated SSH may not be required as long as putty or or similar tunneling tools can keep a persistent connection. It would also need to be able to reconnect if the remote server goes down (it is Windows, you have to reboot for EVERYTHING). Even with that, the plugin would need to make periodic checks for the remote SS availability and if it's not available show it unavailable and have an option to notify when it is.

I'm confused by your confusion. I was doing just what you want to do with my own parents and it works perfectly. You don't need them to have a version of Slimserver that's "slaved" to your version. Rather, you just point their SB's at your (remote) Slimserver directly (this is made especially easy since you've already said you have a static IP). Just forward the proper ports from on your router to your server and point their SB's at your global IP then they'll connect to your server just as though they were on your local network. They have a dynamic IP so you can't use IP filtering, but you can at least protect your web interface via a password. If you feel that you need more security than this you can setup an SSH tunnel, as was previously mentioned (though this would require them to have a computer on at all times).

Player settings like track formatting are maintained separately for each player so you won't have conflicts of preference like you mention.

snarlydwarf
2006-12-06, 12:12
They have a dynamic IP so you can't use IP filtering, but you can at least protect your web interface via a password. If you feel that you need more security than this you can setup an SSH tunnel, as was previously mentioned (though this would require them to have a computer on at all times).

Or if you are running Linux on your server, use something like knockd, and have them "knock" on your server, which will open things up for them and only them.

A bit trickier to set up, and I don't know of a knock client for windows, but something like that should work well. They would only have to run it when they got a new dynamic IP from their ISP.

erland
2006-12-06, 12:34
Or if you are running Linux on your server, use something like knockd, and have them "knock" on your server, which will open things up for them and only them.

A bit trickier to set up, and I don't know of a knock client for windows, but something like that should work well. They would only have to run it when they got a new dynamic IP from their ISP.

Or a SSH client like putty on their computer that is automatically started at boot and tunnels the correct ports through SSH to your SSH server and slimserver.

peter
2006-12-06, 12:43
On Wed, 6 Dec 2006 11:34:02 -0800, "erland"
<erland.2iessb1165433701 (AT) no-mx (DOT) forums.slimdevices.com> said:
>
> snarlydwarf;160205 Wrote:
> > Or if you are running Linux on your server, use something like knockd,
> > and have them "knock" on your server, which will open things up for
> > them and only them.
> >
> > A bit trickier to set up, and I don't know of a knock client for
> > windows, but something like that should work well. They would only
> > have to run it when they got a new dynamic IP from their ISP.
>
> Or a SSH client like putty on their computer that is automatically
> started at boot and tunnels the correct ports through SSH to your SSH
> server and slimserver.

If he's going to do the tunnel stuff, use a tool that was made for it
like OpenVPN (a bit hairy to set up) or the wonderfully simple Hamachi.
No dynamic IP problems, no security problems, clean solution. They'll
also allow you to use remote console or vnc to connect to your parent's
PC, which can be handy or even share a disk folder with them. (you must
be running a halfway decent version of windows or Linux for these VPN
tools, no ME, no 98)

Regards,
Peter

peter
2006-12-06, 13:11
Michael Herger wrote:
>> IP restrictions are perfectly secure in practice (and faster as well).
>
> ...except if your ISP changes your IP every day.
Change you ISP, that'll teach 'm...

But you're right. Whitelisting IPs on the router requires static IP's on
both sides, or DynDNS on one side and a static IP on the other.
Alternatives:

- SSH tunneling: Requires a static IP (or dynDNS) on the server side
(could be either side)
- OpenVPN: Requires a static IP (or dynDNS) on the server side (could be
either side)
- Hamachi: Requires no static IP's or DynDNS

SSH is a hassle on Windows platfoms IMHO, OpenVPN less so but still
rather technical. Hamachi is a breeze if you run supported OSes.

Regards,
Peter

mherger
2006-12-06, 13:21
>> ...except if your ISP changes your IP every day.
> Change you ISP, that'll teach 'm...

In Switzerland this is still standard. You don't have to change, though,
but only to pay. Almost all of them offer fixed addresses for a little
more money...

> SSH is a hassle on Windows platfoms IMHO, OpenVPN less so but still
> rather technical. Hamachi is a breeze if you run supported OSes.

One day I'll configure my Zaurus as a pocket, energy efficient SlimServer
gateway: connect to my remote home server using SSH and forward the
necessary ports to the local network. :-)

--

Michael

-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.herger.net/SlimCD - your SlimServer on a CD
http://www.herger.net/slim - AlbumReview, Biography, MusicInfoSCR