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weedie
2005-07-09, 11:57
Has anyone hooked up their squeezebox to play the streams from http://www.naxosradio.com ? If so, how?

Robin Bowes
2005-07-10, 04:23
weedie wrote:
> Has anyone hooked up their squeezebox to play the streams from
> http://www.naxosradio.com ? If so, how?

Hmmm, from their website:

- 64Kbps Broadband [Near CD quality]

They're kidding, right?

R.

jazzfan
2005-07-10, 11:36
weedie wrote:
> Has anyone hooked up their squeezebox to play the streams from
> http://www.naxosradio.com ? If so, how?

Hmmm, from their website:

- 64Kbps Broadband [Near CD quality]

They're kidding, right?

R.

Woudn't the compression used be the real property that determines FM or CD quality and not connection speed?

I'm not sure it even possible for a low compressed recording that competes with CD to stream in and buffer up correctly to be heard without breaks in the music. ? Can't say I have a grasp of where in the bps rating they consider something "CD" quality. Is there a chart anywhere that shows the different levels of compressions and what their demands are on needed bandwidth for streaming?

pfarrell
2005-07-10, 15:18
On Sun, 2005-07-10 at 11:36 -0700, jazzfan wrote:
> Robin Bowes Wrote:
> > - 64Kbps Broadband [Near CD quality]

> Woudn't the compression used be the real property that determines FM or
> CD quality and not connection speed?

Yes, but if you compress music to fit into a 64kbps stream
you have to mangle it a lot. There is no way to have it
be "CD quality"

Which means you've dropped into the "how near is near enough"
discussion. To my ears, not near enough, not enough bits.


> Can't say I have a grasp of where in
> the bps rating they consider something "CD" quality.

Red Book CDs are roughly 150kBytes/second
or roughly 1.5 Mbps

With Flac (and probably MLP or other
lossless compression) you can get about 2 to 1,
so you can talk about a 750 kBytes/s stream having
all the bits.

Anything less gets into subjective areas.
They use acoustic masking and other techniques
to drop out sounds that are not important.
Who decides, and what is important is not clear.

I have tested several codecs that deliver pretty good sound
at 500 Kbits/s or so. But I would not call it CD quality.

Plenty good enough for a car or other place where you can't
do critical listening.

The marketing folks in the music industry have
deliberately mixed "digital" and "quality"
The Sirus and XM radio folks do the same.

To me, Red Book CD without loss is the
minimum for serious listening. YMMV

--
Pat
http://www.pfarrell.com/music/slimserver/slimsoftware.html

mherger
2005-07-10, 23:11
> With Flac (and probably MLP or other
> lossless compression) you can get about 2 to 1,
> so you can talk about a 750 kBytes/s stream having
> all the bits.

750kbits/s he wanted to say :-)

--

Michael

-----------------------------------------------------------
Help translate SlimServer by using the
StringEditor Plugin (http://www.herger.net/slim/)

wprestong
2005-10-14, 22:08
I am also a Naxos Radio subscriber (www.naxosradio.com). I think the issue is how you get the URL and password in; it's not an audiophile issue.

I haven't figured it out, but I am hoping someone will. Naxos has around 30 channels of classical music for $10 a year. I have listened to it on my computer for a long time (and have bought a lot of Naxos CDs) but I'd like to get the sound coming out through my stereo speakers.

Naxos also will charge you a nominal fee that allows you to listen to complete tracks of any CD in their catalog (there are thousands). But I have never figured out how to listen to program more than one track.

Naxos CDs go for around $7 each and are of very high quality: I am hoping this is the way the record business is going to go in the future. They aren't really doing a lot for online music, but at least they aren't hostile to it.

maxheadroom
2007-01-30, 19:47
For what its worth, I have managed to stream my Naxos Radio to my squeezebox. I found this description for streaming Sirius to Tivo and it is surprisingly similar to the Naxos -> Squeezebox problem. The description is very good and while not exactly the same is about 90% of what needs to be done to make this work. This is for windows platform.

Link:

http://www.engadget.com/2006/02/07/how-to-stream-music-through-your-tivo/

In a nutshell:

1. Start Naxos radio
2. Start Winamp Lite (default settings) with Shoutcast DSP plug-in for Winamp5.x (both available at Winamp web site).
3. Start Shoutcast (default settings)
4. Start Slimserver and tune in radio using http://yourip:8000

Some tweaking is needed such as firewall for ports 8000 and 8001 and setting up the DPS plugin to capture the stream from the soundcard and create an MP3 stream for Shoutcast.

I am very pleased with this solution and the sound is excellent.

MrStan
2007-01-31, 02:57
I am also a Naxos Radio subscriber (www.naxosradio.com). I think the issue is how you get the URL and password in; it's not an audiophile issue.


I am also a Naxos Radio subscriber and unfortunately the main problem is not a password one so before anyone spends a lot of time writing a plugin to enter the username and password you need to fix the underlying problem first.

The problem lies with how they break the tracks. Most players will interpret a break of track as an end of connection therefore you would need to reconnect each track. Both MPlayer and Squeezebox behave like this and you can get Squeezebox to make a good attempt by switching on repeat but it doesn't always work. I suspect that the reconnect is not always fast enough to catch the next track.

For some reason Microsoft Mediaplayer doesn't behave in this way. It will automatically try a reconnect and is fast enough to catch the next track. Naxos embed Mediaplayer into their Web interface so that is how it works.

The easiest method is to use Mediaplayer and Icecast/Shoutcast to rebroadcast unless someone cares to rewrite MPlayer to behave like Mediaplayer.

If you want to subscribe to listen to any Naxos CD's plus a lot of other classical labels then you can either pay around 20$/Euros a year and get a 20k WM stream using their normal search facility (yes it is awful quality) or you can pay about 150 or 250$/Euros per year for www.naxosmusiclibrary.com for a 64k or 128k WM stream. The search interface allows you to preselect any tracks from a CD and yes there will be breaks between tracks. You can try Musiclibrary for 15 minutes at 64k free if you go to the site.

Mark Lanctot
2007-02-01, 11:27
If you want to subscribe to listen to any Naxos CD's plus a lot of other classical labels then you can either pay around 20$/Euros a year and get a 20k WM stream using their normal search facility (yes it is awful quality) or you can pay about 150 or 250$/Euros per year for www.naxosmusiclibrary.com for a 64k or 128k WM stream.

Is it just me, or are those prices outrageous for what you get?

$250 for 128k? That's $20 a month!

MrStan
2007-02-02, 04:34
Is it just me, or are those prices outrageous for what you get?

$250 for 128k? That's $20 a month!

Yes but you are not the intended customer.
You have to consider the quantity of CD's you have access to, not just Naxos but premium labels such as BIS and how many CD's you would be likely to play in a year. I play around 8 per day for 5 days a week, that's around 2000 per year, that's 12.5 cents a CD to listen or around 8.5p in the UK. Fortunately I have already collected a large catalogue therefore I don't need to purchase much so it's not worth my while.

This is intended for libraries and colleges where the material can be used for research. These organisations will get a special deal which I believe is considerably cheaper and can therefore they can offer listening access to their customers as part of their normal service. The customer listens to music probably outside of their normal taste and if they like it Naxos is likely to gain a new sale since their CD prices are usual very reasonable or it is possible to get DRM free downloads from some Naxos partners at around $6 a CD for 192K MP3. (ogg used to be available, not sure if it still is.)

You have to give Naxos some credit for making their entire catalogue, including deletions available for digital download. Other companies are only just starting to consider this, but Naxos have been doing it for a couple of years now.

vinko
2007-12-13, 00:24
This is intended for libraries and colleges where the material can be used for research. These organisations will get a special deal which I believe is considerably cheaper and can therefore they can offer listening access to their customers as part of their normal service. The customer listens to music probably outside of their normal taste and if they like it Naxos is likely to gain a new sale since their CD prices are usual very reasonable or it is possible to get DRM free downloads from some Naxos partners at around $6 a CD for 192K MP3. (ogg used to be available, not sure if it still is.

Although this was originally intended for libraries, colleges and music schools, Naxos Radio has grown to be very popular service among individual music enthusiast.

The cost is USD9.95/year for 20Kbps quality and USD19.95/year for 64kpbs quality.

Naxos music tracks and albums are also available DRM free from their online music download store ClassiscOnline (http://ClassicsOnline.com), among others like, iTunes Store, Amazon, eMusic, etc.

kkitts
2007-12-13, 14:48
I've recorded a lot of music at 320Kbps/mp3. I think, like you said, that for a lot of purposes such as car or at work I would not be able to tell the difference. I *think* I can hear just a slightly more crisp sound out of a CD on some but not all music selections - but, in general, 320kbps/mp3s are pretty darn good.

I couldn't agree more on XM - I was very disappointed in the quality. The talk shows on XM are very funny - I'm talking about the sound quality - it has a real bizarre digital/flange quality to it. Also, I've noticed that some XM stations are better than other - I don't know this for a fact - but I suspect that the bit rate between different channels on XM is different - and that talk stations get the lowest bit-rate possible...