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Richard
2005-03-13, 05:20
I made the move to 6.0 B1-1 last evening, with mixed results. Here are my findings:

1) FLAC. I have been running 5.4 since it was releases with never a skip on FLAC files. Every FLAC file I play on 6.0 B1-1 results in playback skips. Any suggestions for improving throughput? I am using a wired Ethernet Network with 3 Wired Squeezeboxes. (I did reboot my server and the problem seems to have cleared up somewhat I still get drops when doing HTML web interface commands while music is playing)
2) The overall speed of the Web Interface is slower. Sometimes considerably slower. I have never had any sort of performance issues with the web interface under 5.4 and below, and have started experiencing some frustrating delays when using the server html.
3) Searching. Simply put, a frustrating step backward. When using the Fishbone interface, I could search for an artist out of my 17,000 simply from the browse pages, now I have to go to advanced search. When I try the Search Music screen, all I get is the names of songs returned not artists. This is not at all accommodating for the way I look for music.
4) The Advanced Search is a good step forward as a search improvement, NOT a replacement.
5) I thought cataloging music into the DB would be faster based on claims. I found it to take about the same amount of time as 5.4.
6) Fishbone Skin does not always display correctly. My personal choice of skin ends up losing its navigation on the left frame after some actions (I think after being in Server Settings and hitting Home link).
7) Even after new install, had to select Wipe Cache to begin proper song cataloguing. Not obvious for the new user.
8) Ogg files worked straight out of the box where I had to do some tweaking under 5.4.

richard / at / richardascott.com

Charles Stanton
2005-03-13, 06:51
Using th 3/11 nightly on XP Pro, fishbone skin.

I second a couple of these observations (recoginising that the
software is still beta), in particular:

1. Web interface is slower, sometimes extremely so; on occassion so
much so I have thought SimServer must have crashed....but it has not.
2. The search does not always work (which is already reported as a
bug) and I think it is a bit confusing: if you select Search Music in
the top dialog, it immediately goes back to Search Song but displays
Live Search below, with a button that says 'Search for Songs'. But
if you put in an artist name, it will give you any album, artist or
song that has the artist name in it. It is not very straighforward
and the old way was better. Then you also get results that point
basically to nowhere (all you get is "Title:")


On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 12:20:56 +0000, Richard <richard (AT) richardascott (DOT) com> wrote:
> I made the move to 6.0 B1-1 last evening, with mixed results. Here are my findings:
>
> 1) FLAC. I have been running 5.4 since it was releases with never a skip on FLAC files. Every FLAC file I play on 6.0 B1-1 results in playback skips. Any suggestions for improving throughput? I am using a wired Ethernet Network with 3 Wired Squeezeboxes. (I did reboot my server and the problem seems to have cleared up somewhat – I still get drops when doing HTML web interface commands while music is playing)
> 2) The overall speed of the Web Interface is slower. Sometimes considerably slower. I have never had any sort of performance issues with the web interface under 5.4 and below, and have started experiencing some frustrating delays when using the server html.
> 3) Searching. Simply put, a frustrating step backward. When using the Fishbone interface, I could search for an artist out of my 17,000 simply from the browse pages, now I have to go to advanced search. When I try the Search Music screen, all I get is the names of songs returned not artists. This is not at all accommodating for the way I look for music.
> 4) The Advanced Search is a good step forward as a search improvement, NOT a replacement.
> 5) I thought cataloging music into the DB would be faster based on claims.. I found it to take about the same amount of time as 5.4.
> 6) Fishbone Skin does not always display correctly. My personal choice of skin ends up losing its navigation on the left frame after some actions (I think after being in Server Settings and hitting Home link).
> 7) Even after new install, had to select Wipe Cache to begin proper song cataloguing. Not obvious for the new user.
> 8) Ogg files worked straight out of the box where I had to do some tweaking under 5.4.
>
> richard / at / richardascott.com
>

Dan Sully
2005-03-13, 10:51
* Richard shaped the electrons to say...

>I made the move to 6.0 B1-1 last evening, with mixed results. Here are my findings:

Richard - thanks for the feedback. Most of these have been fixed in the
latest nightly builds, and will be in the next beta release.

> 1) FLAC. I have been running 5.4 since it was releases with never a skip
> on FLAC files. Every FLAC file I play on 6.0 B1-1 results in playback
> skips. Any suggestions for improving throughput? I am using a wired
> Ethernet Network with 3 Wired Squeezeboxes. (I did reboot my server and the
> problem seems to have cleared up somewhat – I still get drops when doing
> HTML web interface commands while music is playing)

Has the server finished scanning all your files? Did you have a large
playlist loaded while viewing the web UI?

> 2) The overall speed of the Web Interface is slower. Sometimes
> considerably slower. I have never had any sort of performance issues with
> the web interface under 5.4 and below, and have started experiencing some
> frustrating delays when using the server html.

What browser are you using? Fishbone skin it looks like?

Are there specific operations that you find are slower?

> 3) Searching. Simply put, a frustrating step backward. When using the
> Fishbone interface, I could search for an artist out of my 17,000 simply
> from the browse pages, now I have to go to advanced search. When I try the
> Search Music screen, all I get is the names of songs returned not artists.
> This is not at all accommodating for the way I look for music.

This has been fixed - search now displays Artist, Album and Tracks. It sounds
like you hit the fallback search, instead of the "Live Search"

> 4) The Advanced Search is a good step forward as a search improvement, NOT a replacement.

Agreed.

> 5) I thought cataloging music into the DB would be faster based on claims.
> I found it to take about the same amount of time as 5.4.

Things like MP3 scanning have been speed up, but we're also doing a lot more
at the database level. I've personally heard varying degrees of improvment,
but most have been improved.

Know what type of system you're running, and specifics of your library would help.

> 6) Fishbone Skin does not always display correctly. My personal choice of
> skin ends up losing its navigation on the left frame after some actions (I
> think after being in Server Settings and hitting Home link).

I'll let kdf answer this, as he maintains this skin.

> 7) Even after new install, had to select Wipe Cache to begin proper song
> cataloguing. Not obvious for the new user.

Did you install any of the 6.0 alpha releases?

> 8) Ogg files worked straight out of the box where I had to do some tweaking under 5.4.

Great.

-D
--
They're techno trousers, ex-NASA, fantastic for walkies!

kdf
2005-03-13, 12:25
Quoting Dan Sully <dan (AT) slimdevices (DOT) com>:

> > 6) Fishbone Skin does not always display correctly. My personal choice of
> > skin ends up losing its navigation on the left frame after some actions (I
> > think after being in Server Settings and hitting Home link).
>
> I'll let kdf answer this, as he maintains this skin.

This particular example is fixed in the nightly builds, as well as some a few
others, both fishbone skin related and some links that affect all skins using
search. Any others, please let us know.

-kdf

Daryle A. Tilroe
2005-03-13, 15:10
Since I am just now trying the latest nightly of 6.0b1 - r2461 (XPproSP1
running as a service) I can corroborate much of what Richard wrote:

> 1) FLAC. I have been running 5.4 since it was releases with never a skip
> on FLAC files. Every FLAC file I play on 6.0 B1-1 results in playback
> skips. Any suggestions for improving throughput? I am using a wired

Same here. I had the odd (once a day/week) dropout before but it is
unusable now. It happens several times per song and when watching
the buffer it is obvious the server is having an incredible problem
keeping it full. And yes the server is all quiescent with rescanning
done.

> 2) The overall speed of the Web Interface is slower. Sometimes considerably slower.

Ditto again. However rather inconsistent. For example the
Player Settings->Menus took forever a couple times but now seems
fine.

> 5) I thought cataloging music into the DB would be faster based on claims.
> I found it to take about the same amount of time as 5.4.

Ditto again. I have 7500 FLACs and it takes over 5 minutes; at
least as long as before, if not longer. Also the memory footprint
is at least as large as before.

Definitely not ready for prime time. I will probably be rolling
back to 5.4.1 tonight so I can listen again. I find the playback
issues particularly disappointing. I am surprised that there are
such severe problems with such core functionality in a late beta.

--
Daryle A. Tilroe

Daryle A. Tilroe
2005-03-14, 19:33
Daryle A. Tilroe wrote:

> Since I am just now trying the latest nightly of 6.0b1 - r2461 (XPproSP1
> running as a service) I can corroborate much of what Richard wrote:
>
>> 1) FLAC. I have been running 5.4 since it was releases with never a skip
>
> > on FLAC files. Every FLAC file I play on 6.0 B1-1 results in
> playback
> > skips. Any suggestions for improving throughput? I am using a wired
>
> Same here. I had the odd (once a day/week) dropout before but it is
> unusable now. It happens several times per song and when watching
> the buffer it is obvious the server is having an incredible problem
> keeping it full. And yes the server is all quiescent with rescanning
> done.

Got good news on this although not from the latest nightly.
This is a bit of a story but here goes:

Many months ago I upgraded my trusty BEFSR41v2 router to
the newer eight port version; BEFSR81v3. Now in order
to save a few cents Linksys stopped putting speed and
duplex leds on their v3 routers when they updated the
rest of the hardware. The reason this becomes pertinent
is that in all my IT career I have never trusted auto
duplex negotiation since there is no standard. I always
fix it on both ends with the settings.

Now some of you may know that duplex mismatch problems
can be very odd, intermittent, and difficult to diagnose.
With the old 41v2 I fixed my PC to 100full and made certain
the lights matched and all was good.

Fast forward to the 81v3 upgrade. I upgraded the router
at about the same time I upgraded to the latest slimserver
and SB1G. At this point I noticed some FLAC dropouts.
Being no fool, I suspected duplex since with the new
router I could not confirm what mode the switch was in
(the idiots didn't even put speed/duplex status on their
web interface status page). However since the dropouts
were so rare I could never definitively say what the
problem was: new slimserver or router. Anyhow, I actually
ended up leaving the PC on the 'bad' setting of 100/full
fixed rather than auto. I say 'bad' but with 5.4 it
was still good enough that most sessions had no dropouts
and it could be weeks in-between.

Fast forward again to 6.0b and the dropouts appear with
a vengeance. Since the *possible* duplex problem had an almost
insignificant effect before I did not immediately suspect it
yesterday; particularly since others had noted severe dropouts.
However tonight after downloading the latest nightly which
was supposed to have pertinent improvements I was still
plagued by dropouts. I then realized that there may have
been some change that made 6.0b much more susceptible
to duplex issues. Sure enough I go back to Auto and the
dropouts basically disappear.

Morals to the story:

-Newer Linksys hardware/firmware is not good at duplex
sensing, or more accurately it assumes auto and gives
you no indication what it is actually set to if you
fix the other end.

-Slimserver 6.0b is much more sensitive to duplex issues and
likely packet loss; not sure if this is a good or bad thing.

So I hope this is solved for me. I'll do some more listening
and watch for dropouts.

--
Daryle A. Tilroe