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Richard Elen
2005-03-10, 10:12
> From: Jonathan Buschmann <Jonathan.Buschmann (AT) ericsson (DOT) com>
> Can anyone point me to some howto/tips on ripping vinyl?

I don't know about where you'd find them on the net, but from my own
experience - a bit specialised because I am a former engineer/producer
and mainly recover archive discs for CD release rather than just ripping
to lossy formats (suggestions not in order!):

1. A good A/D is vital. I use an Apogee Rosetta, but that's 'cos I used
to work for Apogee. If I didn't, I would still try and have one. Special
deals on their web site at www.apogeedigital.com A PC is not a good
environment for an A/D converter. Best to have a digital I/O card in the
computer and a high-quality outboard A/D (and D/A).
2. Use the right stylus. I transfer various archive discs from time to
time - mono microgroove library albums, for example, give better results
with a spherical rather than the more usual elliptical stylus.
3. Really difficult ancient worn discs sometimes yield best results
played backwards
4. Transfer to a lossless format such as WAV first, you can always throw
information away but you can't make it out of nothing.
5. Then edit in a good editor with plugins - Cedar is excellent, but the
impulse noise reduction tools even with Adobe Audition are excellent if
used carefully.
6. Don't let NR plugins do their job automatically. Go in and pinpoint
things you want to fix, don't just leave the thing running all the time.
You will lose stuff (same applies to everyone who leaves vocal retuning
plugins running on automatic in ProTools, IMHO - don't).
7. Above all don't over-use noise reduction. Better to have the odd
click (remove with waveform editing?) than to have everything sound like
its coming down a tube.
8. Transferring mono material, you can sometimes improve rumble by
recording L+R and L-R, then filtering the latter and adding it back in
to cancel the problem. Use carefuly and tweak.
9. Don't try to recover content that isn't there, for example extreme
HF. It's probably noise and/or distortion making you think there is top
there when it isn't. You can't cut very high frequencies on disc so
filtering HF out reduces the noise and doesn't lose wanted content.
10. Clean discs thoroughly before use.
11. First make sure that the disc isn't out on a CD made direct and
carefully from the original masters (usual these days), as the latter
will give much better results. Most vinyl discs were cut from
third-generation tapes unless you are in the country of origin. And even
then, the very best vinyl pressing is a million miles away from the
original masters. Assuming you want to get as close to the original
sound as possible - to the thing they heard in the studio when they
said, "That's the one!" - then you need the closest approach to the
master tapes, and that will be a CD if done properly (and even arguably
if not). Note that it may well not sound like the vinyl, and this is as
it should be. The vinyl doesn't sound like the artists intended, it
sounds like they had to put up with and was the best the medium would
let them do.

--Richard E

Lars Kellogg-Stedman
2005-03-10, 19:48
In article <42307FEC.7020902 (AT) brideswell (DOT) com>,
Richard Elen <relen (AT) brideswell (DOT) com> wrote:

> > From: Jonathan Buschmann
> > <Jonathan.Buschmann (AT) ericsson (DOT) com>
> > Can anyone point me to some howto/tips on ripping vinyl?
>
> I don't know about where you'd find them on the net,

Well, Google's always a good place to start:

"Vinyl Music Processing under Linux"
http://home.att.net/~halbower/music.html

-- Lars

Jonathan Buschmann
2005-03-11, 03:48
Thanks. Great info.
I had read some place before that ripping LPs was was probably more
trouble than it was worth. Then I saw people on Slim MLs speaking about
things like ripping to 24bit samples, and I thought maybe I shouldn't
throw away my LPs yet! OTOH from what you say I guess I shouldn't regret
having rebought many of my favorite albums on CD. (The thing that bugs
me ofcourse is paying the IP rights twice. Wouldn't it be great if music
houses were required give you a rebate on your purchase of a CD by
trading in an LP!)
Still, it sounds like an expensive proposition to get good results.

jonathan

Richard Elen waxed wise and spake thus on 03/10/2005 06:12 PM:

>>From: Jonathan Buschmann <Jonathan.Buschmann (AT) ericsson (DOT) com>
>>Can anyone point me to some howto/tips on ripping vinyl?
>>
>>
>
>I don't know about where you'd find them on the net, but from my own
>experience - a bit specialised because I am a former engineer/producer
>and mainly recover archive discs for CD release rather than just ripping
>
>to lossy formats (suggestions not in order!):
>
>1. A good A/D is vital. I use an Apogee Rosetta, but that's 'cos I used
>to work for Apogee. If I didn't, I would still try and have one. Special
>
>deals on their web site at www.apogeedigital.com A PC is not a good
>environment for an A/D converter. Best to have a digital I/O card in the
>
>computer and a high-quality outboard A/D (and D/A).
>2. Use the right stylus. I transfer various archive discs from time to
>time - mono microgroove library albums, for example, give better results
>
>with a spherical rather than the more usual elliptical stylus.
>3. Really difficult ancient worn discs sometimes yield best results
>played backwards
>4. Transfer to a lossless format such as WAV first, you can always throw
>
>information away but you can't make it out of nothing.
>5. Then edit in a good editor with plugins - Cedar is excellent, but the
>
>impulse noise reduction tools even with Adobe Audition are excellent if
>used carefully.
>6. Don't let NR plugins do their job automatically. Go in and pinpoint
>things you want to fix, don't just leave the thing running all the time.
>
>You will lose stuff (same applies to everyone who leaves vocal retuning
>plugins running on automatic in ProTools, IMHO - don't).
>7. Above all don't over-use noise reduction. Better to have the odd
>click (remove with waveform editing?) than to have everything sound like
>
>its coming down a tube.
>8. Transferring mono material, you can sometimes improve rumble by
>recording L+R and L-R, then filtering the latter and adding it back in
>to cancel the problem. Use carefuly and tweak.
>9. Don't try to recover content that isn't there, for example extreme
>HF. It's probably noise and/or distortion making you think there is top
>there when it isn't. You can't cut very high frequencies on disc so
>filtering HF out reduces the noise and doesn't lose wanted content.
>10. Clean discs thoroughly before use.
>11. First make sure that the disc isn't out on a CD made direct and
>carefully from the original masters (usual these days), as the latter
>will give much better results. Most vinyl discs were cut from
>third-generation tapes unless you are in the country of origin. And even
>
>then, the very best vinyl pressing is a million miles away from the
>original masters. Assuming you want to get as close to the original
>sound as possible - to the thing they heard in the studio when they
>said, "That's the one!" - then you need the closest approach to the
>master tapes, and that will be a CD if done properly (and even arguably
>if not). Note that it may well not sound like the vinyl, and this is as
>it should be. The vinyl doesn't sound like the artists intended, it
>sounds like they had to put up with and was the best the medium would
>let them do.
>
>--Richard E
>