PDA

View Full Version : OH NO! I may have fried my SB3



Club1820
2018-12-02, 19:54
So I was checking the breakers in my house and I mistakenly switched off and on the Breaker that my SB3 was connected to. The SB3 was currently powered on and playing music when I switched the breaker. After this, the SB3 display was off and no more audio playing. I did the usual disconnect of power cord back on/off and nothing. tried to connect it to another outlet and then noticed the SB3 did have power as the red light in back was on.

I then checked both iPeng controller and web interface and sure enough the SB3 was powered on, connected to my server and actually playing the tracks on the playlist. But just no display and no audio coming out when connected to the receiver.

So, anyone else experience anything like this? Am I just out of luck on this? I've had this puppy for over ten years and hate to see it go.

Thanks in advance for any insights or suggestions.

Club1820
2018-12-02, 20:39
WhooHooo! I took the unit to another setup I have in the basement. Connected the SB3 using those cables (both audio & PSU) and it worked! Display turned on and audio came out. So I can only assume its the actual original Power Supply Unit upstairs that is fried.

So, .... where is the best place to get a replacement or can I use any ol' PSU that would have the same specs. I have plenty of power cords laying around the house for various outdated tech, - from old power calculators to PC External DVD drives, external Hard Drives etc.

Thanks.

philippe_44
2018-12-02, 21:48
WhooHooo! I took the unit to another setup I have in the basement. Connected the SB3 using those cables (both audio & PSU) and it worked! Display turned on and audio came out. So I can only assume its the actual original Power Supply Unit upstairs that is fried.

So, .... where is the best place to get a replacement or can I use any ol' PSU that would have the same specs. I have plenty of power cords laying around the house for various outdated tech, - from old power calculators to PC External DVD drives, external Hard Drives etc.

Thanks.

You need 5V, at least 2A (more works as well of course) and 2.5mm jack (ground external)

Club1820
2018-12-03, 15:33
You need 5V, at least 2A (more works as well of course) and 2.5mm jack (ground external)

Thanks!

Does it matter if its 100-240v? Most PSUs i've found on Amazon that supposedly work with Squeezebox are 100-240 v where as the original is 110-120v. this one listed below is also 18 v. Is that too much higher than the 5 v? Sorry, I don't know anything about PSUs/voltage etc.

Thanks again!!!

https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Squeezebox-993-000385-534-000245-PSAA18R-180/dp/B078T7PJH7/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1543875635&sr=8-5&keywords=logitech+squeezebox+power+adapter

"Input: 100-240V 50-60Hz Output:18V 1A~1.5A DC "

philippe_44
2018-12-03, 17:49
Thanks!

Does it matter if its 100-240v? Most PSUs i've found on Amazon that supposedly work with Squeezebox are 100-240 v where as the original is 110-120v. this one listed below is also 18 v. Is that too much higher than the 5 v? Sorry, I don't know anything about PSUs/voltage etc.

Thanks again!!!

https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Squeezebox-993-000385-534-000245-PSAA18R-180/dp/B078T7PJH7/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1543875635&sr=8-5&keywords=logitech+squeezebox+power+adapter

"Input: 100-240V 50-60Hz Output:18V 1A~1.5A DC "

Be careful!!! it *must* be 5Volts output, no more, no less. The current can be anything *above* 2A. The input of these PSU is nowadays 100-240V, so anything including your country voltage works. So 100-240 basically means "works everywhere in the world". The rule basically is that the voltage is imposed by the PSU and the equipment drains the current it needs. So even if you use a 10A "capable" PSU and the equipment needs a 0.5A, then it will drain 0.5A. But if you force 18V on something that can only accept 5V, it will fry (there is more than that depending on the internal of equipment, but let's keep it here for now).

The PSU you show is all wrong: 18V will kill the SB3 because it's way above 5V and the amperage is not enough (again, it's a bit more complicated, but anyway, don't try this one!)

Fizbin
2018-12-03, 20:23
Strange how turning a breaking off and on would do that. I wonder if the outcome would have been the same if the power (lines) went off and on?

Club1820
2018-12-03, 20:49
Be careful!!! it *must* be 5Volts output, no more, no less. The current can be anything *above* 2A. The input of these PSU is nowadays 100-240V, so anything including your country voltage works. So 100-240 basically means "works everywhere in the world". The rule basically is that the voltage is imposed by the PSU and the equipment drains the current it needs. So even if you use a 10A "capable" PSU and the equipment needs a 0.5A, then it will drain 0.5A. But if you force 18V on something that can only accept 5V, it will fry (there is more than that depending on the internal of equipment, but let's keep it here for now).

The PSU you show is all wrong: 18V will kill the SB3 because it's way above 5V and the amperage is not enough (again, it's a bit more complicated, but anyway, don't try this one!)

Thanks for all the responses and assistance. To be safe, I gave up on making sure I got the right compatible PSU and found the original on EBay. Better safe than sorry.

Thanks again!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Logitech-Squeezebox-Slim-Device-Classic-Touch-Power-Supply-UL110-0520-NEW-OEM/360417980249?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

DJanGo
2018-12-04, 03:28
Strange how turning a breaking off and on would do that. I wonder if the outcome would have been the same if the power (lines) went off and on?

Thats everything else but strange...

If you got some devices with big capacitors in that line and kick the breaker the capacitors from that device sends their power back to the powerlines.
And theses breakers are not supposed to act like a switch - they should safe you not your devices.

And that can bring a "10% faulty device to a 100% faulty device".

slartibartfast
2018-12-04, 04:35
Thats everything else but strange...

If you got some devices with big capacitors in that line and kick the breaker the capacitors from that device sends their power back to the powerlines.
And theses breakers are not supposed to act like a switch - they should safe you not your devices.

And that can bring a "10% faulty device to a 100% faulty device".

If these big capacitors are on the DC side of a rectifier how would they send power back to the power lines? Wouldn't spikes from inductive components be more likely?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Jeff07971
2018-12-04, 04:44
If these big capacitors are on the DC side of a rectifier how would they send power back to the power lines? Wouldn't spikes from inductive components be more likely?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

This sounds like the Capacitor plague https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague Or just capacitor wear out

The main caps in a SMPSU are quite highly stressed and fail due to the above.
If the power is left on the problem goes unoticed untill the power fails then the PSU will not start up (or blows the fuse or switching transistor)
This has happened to me many times, one notable one was a stack of 4 Dell network switches all running fine untill a turn off for maintenance. All 4 switches failed to turn back on.
I replaced the caps in the PSU's and all were fine again (and still are after another 5 years)

Jeff

DJanGo
2018-12-04, 04:58
If these big capacitors are on the DC side of a rectifier how would they send power back to the power lines?
remember most of these "cheap" devices doesnt have a Transformer Protector Diode like a laboratory power supply.
Only this diode will stop the current to go back.

Anyway The only thing that solves his proble is dismantle the PSU, check everything or buy a new one.
There are too many may and be s what really happend.

Jeff07971
2018-12-04, 05:03
remember most of these "cheap" devices doesnt have a Transformer Protector Diode like a laboratory power supply.
Only this diode will stop the current to go back.

Anyway The only thing that solves his proble is dismantle the PSU, check everything or buy a new one.
There are too many may and be s what really happend.

The "main" Caps in a SMPSU are on both sides of the transformer, smoothing and storage @ 320Vdc on the primary and smoothing and storage @ 5Vdc on the secondary.

sgmlaw
2018-12-09, 08:59
remember most of these "cheap" devices doesnt have a Transformer Protector Diode like a laboratory power supply.
Only this diode will stop the current to go back.

Anyway The only thing that solves his proble is dismantle the PSU, check everything or buy a new one.
There are too many may and be s what really happend.

Every DC supply regardless of cost has such ‘transformer protector diode’ already built-in.

It is called the rectifier bridge. And in a DC supply, there is nowhere for the rectified current to backfeed to, as it is a transformer-coupled topology. Perhaps you are confusing such a mystery diode with an inrush current thermistor, which are more common on better supplies with heavier filter loads.

The primary difference between a $5 wallwart and a $500 ‘precision’ supply are the quality, quantity and values of the core parts. Big toroidal core windings, exotic diode types, and banks of first-tier filter electrolytics are not cheap. All the rest are variations of the same old three step: voltage stepping, rectification, and filtering.

Back to the OT: powering a SB3 or Touch is child’s play. All they need is a 5vdc output at 2A or better. Nothing too fancy, and even a higher current USB charger could probably handle the job. They do sound a little better on a quieter supply, in my experience.

sgmlaw
2018-12-09, 09:18
Strange how turning a breaking off and on would do that. I wonder if the outcome would have been the same if the power (lines) went off and on?


Probably. Depending on the utility provider, and the configuration of the circuits and their respective loads on energizing, every time you re-energize at the service panel or elsewhere, you run the risk of a transient on the line. Some larger loads push all sorts of irregularities on the local circuit as they cycle off and on.

Depending on the voltage sensitivity of the connected equipment, that can either weaken internal components over time or take them out outright. And few power supplies are going to stop those kinds of transients from reaching the supply rails for a few milliseconds. So the equipment slowly takes hits, eroding the weakest parts (usually microprocessors) to eventual failure. And today, even major appliances like refrigerators are stuffed full of chips.

So your best bet with today’s electronics is always a three tiered transient protection strategy, starting at the meter, continuing at the service panel, with final local protection at the outlets supplying the devices. This will catch the bigger grid spikes from getting too far into your location, while catching the smaller remainder waveform and protecting the devices from each other at the outlets themselves. On the most critical equipment, full sine-wave protection UPS is practically a necessity today.

You would be amazed at how much longer all electrical devices last when given comprehensive transient protection.

Club1820
2019-01-12, 12:33
Just checking back in after some time to let everyone know that the replacement PSU I got on ebay did the trick. Little did I know that the conversation on why this happened in the first place, continued. Love this community !

thanks.

Greg Erskine
2019-01-12, 12:51
:)