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fphredd
2018-06-23, 10:13
I did try and search for this; if it's been answered previously, sorry for the dupe and could someone point me to the answer...

I have a couple of artists/bands that are showing up in completely wrong places in the sort.
The 1st picture shows a spot where a few bands are showing up in G's and I'm not sure why. The 2nd picture shows one of those artist's listing in MP3 Tag with extended tags open. There are no G's...any ideas?

I have tried deleting the oversized images with no luck - help appreciated!

Thanks in advance!

Apesbrain
2018-06-23, 10:36
What did you do differently for "Danny Gatton" to make him show up in the place you want?

I'd probably get rid of the comma in the ARTISTSORT field if there is one there. Image is too small to tell.

fphredd
2018-06-23, 11:01
What did you do differently for "Danny Gatton" to make him show up in the place you want?

I'd probably get rid of the comma in the ARTISTSORT field if there is one there. Image is too small to tell.

That's the thing...Nothing different. The comma is there for formatting to get them in the list sorted by last name, showing first name first...That comma is in Danny Gatton as well. Thx

DJanGo
2018-06-24, 00:35
That's the thing...Nothing different. The comma is there for formatting to get them in the list sorted by last name, showing first name first...That comma is in Danny Gatton as well. Thx
Get rid of the albumartistsort and artistsort tags.
btw:

only a single one track needs a wrong sort tag and your whole library uses it.
That "bad" sort tag can be everywhere eg. in a sampler /compilation !!!!

Mnyb
2018-06-24, 01:34
Or if you want the name Danny Gatton in thr list you could actually use artistsort and albumartist sort.
And make them work for you have Danny Gatton in the artisttag and then Gatton, Danny as artistsort.

Ofcourse backup the files before manipulatng tags and also be aware of the thing django pointed out ,it only takes one wrng sort tag in the whole l lbrary to sort them wrong.

fphredd
2018-06-24, 04:39
Get rid of the albumartistsort and artistsort tags.
btw:

only a single one track needs a wrong sort tag and your whole library uses it.
That "bad" sort tag can be everywhere eg. in a sampler /compilation !!!!

Those tags are what let me sort Danny Gatton into "G" the way it is.
The second point, though, has logic...These incorrectly sorted artists/bands are sandwiched between Jerry Garcia listings, so possibly a Garcia link somewhere. Only problem now is where, as Allen Toussaint is not actually anywhere else in the collection that I can come up with. This could become a very long and arduous task with 75k tracks. Anyone know a quick search shortcut...lol? Otherwise it's probably going to be something I'll just have to ignore until I happen to stumble upon the culprit track(s) at some point.

Thanks for the feedback. :)

DJanGo
2018-06-24, 04:51
Only problem now is where, as Allen Toussaint is not actually anywhere else in the collection that I can come up with. This could become a very long and arduous task wit 75k tracks. Anyone know a quick search shortcut...lol?

A shortcut?


clear your playlist
add all track from Mr. Toussaint to a player
save that playlist as somename
open that playlist with mp3tag
select all tracks
look into extended tags
fix it
do a rescan
hope 4 the best

fphredd
2018-06-24, 05:12
A shortcut?


clear your playlist
add all track from Mr. Toussaint to a player
save that playlist as somename
open that playlist with mp3tag
select all tracks
look into extended tags
fix it
do a rescan
hope 4 the best


Is that any different that opening extended tags in all of the tracks that are in the raw files in the directory? That's what I did when I was taking the above screenshot. I did this with all the Toussaint tracks. The shot above only shows one group in order to show that the ARTIST related tags were all correct. They were correct in the other ones as well as those shown. Thanks.

DJanGo
2018-06-24, 06:18
Is that any different that opening extended tags in all of the tracks that are in the raw files in the directory? That's what I did when I was taking the above screenshot. I did this with all the Toussaint tracks. The shot above only shows one group in order to show that the ARTIST related tags were all correct. They were correct in the other ones as well as those shown. Thanks.

sorry,
but my microscope is out of office ;.-)

since you didnt tell that and my eyes cant read your screenshoot - and asking for a shortcut - thats the way i would go on windows.
So i dont know your directory structure or any other detail.

And its the same with another thread here - its not easy and not all id3 tagger can read all tags the same.
btw: what kind of tags are you using?
And did you tag them all by yourself with the same tagging tool?

eg. I have some istore tracks for my kid - with some stupid tags that none of my tagger would find.
The only solution was:
read all the tags into a textfile
deleteing the whole metadata thats not audio
add the wanted tags from the textfile

Apesbrain
2018-06-24, 07:33
Load your entire library into Mp3tag and view "Extended Tags" (ALT+T). See if there are any tag fields in the resulting list that you want to inspect and/or delete. Now, cancel* and add/create a column in main window to display that field and sort on it. Easiest way to isolate those files having unwanted or suspect tags.

(*) Be careful when viewing Extended Tags of all files not to click on "OK" as it will start rewriting your files; use "Cancel" instead.

fphredd
2018-06-24, 07:40
Tagging was done with MP3 Tag. They show up as ID3v1, ID3v2, APE. Should I delete unneeded? When I export to text, the tags all look as they should. Any unused fields show up as a "-", but otherwise I can't see any other erroneous information. Is it possible something is hidden and MP3 Tag isn't exporting it? Another tool I should try reading with, perhaps?
Thanks, again!

Apesbrain
2018-06-24, 08:08
If they are MP3 files, then I'd only want ID3v2.3 tags. Unless you have a player that can't read v2.3, delete the v1 tags. You don't need APE. I believe your tagging options should look like this:

https://i.imgur.com/GEy2Yvd.jpg

If they are FLAC files, then they should only have FLAC tags.

fphredd
2018-06-24, 09:53
If they are FLAC files, then they should only have FLAC tags.

It's all FLAC, and most of the files don't have 'issues.' Looking at your MP3 Tag screenshot, where are "FLAC" tags? Thought it was alway ID3v2.3 tags...

Thank you

kidstypike
2018-06-24, 10:05
It's all FLAC, and most of the files don't have 'issues.' Looking at your MP3 Tag screenshot, where are "FLAC" tags? Thought it was alway ID3v2.3 tags...

Thank you

Are you saying your flac files don't have flac tags? They should have.

25225

fphredd
2018-06-24, 10:50
They actually do all show the tags types as FLAC. Back to hunting, I guess.

Will see about loading all 75k tracks in mp3 tag; anyone ever tried something like that? :p

DJanGo
2018-06-24, 12:56
Only problem now is where, as Allen Toussaint is not actually anywhere else in the collection that I can come up with. This could become a very long and arduous task with 75k tracks

that should be quite simple...

Album: 'Jerry Garcia Band' from 1991 .
Who is the composer of track 4 'Get Out of My Life Woman' ?

fphredd
2018-06-24, 13:48
The problem is Jerry is fine!...lol
Allen Toussaint shows no composer or other tags. Are you saying that if a Jerry tune elsewhere shows Allen Toussaint I'm going to have this problem with Toussaint in G's? Seems odd, but if you folkshave seen that, I'll start a big 75k mp3tag folder load and see how it goes...

garym
2018-06-24, 15:27
The problem is Jerry is fine!...lol
Allen Toussaint shows no composer or other tags. Are you saying that if a Jerry tune elsewhere shows Allen Toussaint I'm going to have this problem with Toussaint in G's? Seems odd, but if you folkshave seen that, I'll start a big 75k mp3tag folder load and see how it goes...

yes, if any song anywhere in your library has Allen Toussaint with a sort tag (Toussaint, Allen), then all Allen Toussaint songs will show up under "T". It's an odd feature (bug?) of LMS.

p.s. I have often loaded up over 100,000 files in mp3tag and sorted, searched, filtered, etc.

fphredd
2018-06-24, 17:20
yes, if any song anywhere in your library has Allen Toussaint with a sort tag (Toussaint, Allen), then all Allen Toussaint songs will show up under "T". It's an odd feature (bug?) of LMS.

Still not sure I get it as the Allen Toussaint files are all 'clean' tag wise, and it's not that he doesn't show up under "T" it's that he does show up under "G"...but I'm gonna have a look under everything Garcia/Toussaint related and see what bubbles up.


p.s. I have often loaded up over 100,000 files in mp3tag and sorted, searched, filtered, etc.

Good to know! :)

garym
2018-06-25, 04:53
Still not sure I get it as the Allen Toussaint files are all 'clean' tag wise, and it's not that he doesn't show up under "T" it's that he does show up under "G"...but I'm gonna have a look under everything Garcia/Toussaint related and see what bubbles up.

But it might not be a "allen Toussaint" file. It could be a file from any artist that happens to have Allen Toussaint as a composer for example, and the COMPOSERSORT tag is set that somehow is causing this. I agree that it is probably Garcia related (given the G).

fphredd
2018-06-25, 05:08
Sounds like I'm busy next weekend! Thanks again for all the help. We'll see where this rabbit hole leads...

emalvick
2018-07-02, 14:36
To add two-cents, if you ever use multiple tags (say multiple artist tags) and accidentally make a mistake with the order, that will mess things up.

Also, going back to earlier discussion about tag types, I've had instances where multiple tag types were written to files (ID3v1 and ID3v2 or even FLAC). If there are multiple tag types, MP3Tag will usually only show info from one tag type. For instance, if you have both ID3v1 and ID3v2, it will only show the v2 tags. But if the problem is in the v1 tag, you may never see it.

While tags like that are supposed to be consistent, they aren't always that way. This has especially been the problem in the odd cases where I've ended up with ID3 tags in a FLAC file.

In many cases I've had to remove all tags and start over to clean out the problems. MP3Tag (and probably most good software) know not to mix tag types, but other software can cause those problems.


By the way, I do think you can search through tags using MP3Tag or other metadata software to find all the files with the culprit field in place. For instance search for your Toussaint name as the problematic file will somehow have that name there. At least after loading your library, you could narrow it down to a more reasonable number of culprits.

One final note; when I used to have errors like this, they unfortunately existed in other places in the library for different names, etc. It just goes without fail. It's not that we do anything wrong but just that similar errors (Be it through auto-tagging or other) occur.

dolodobendan
2018-07-02, 15:03
In mp3tag, add columns for any tag that could be responsible (artistsort, albumartist, album artist, artistsort etc.)
Load your library in mp3tag as suggested.
Filter your files (F3) with "artist HAS Toussaint" or "composer HAS ..."


That should let you find the tracks responsible pretty quickly.

fphredd
2018-07-03, 20:03
I will have a go at this...feeling a bit intimidated at the moment! :p

Thanks for the help, suggestions, and needed encouragement...lol

fphredd
2018-07-11, 15:17
Thanks to all who responded. After opening the entire music directory in MP3 tag, it does seem to be stray "Composer" tags. Unfortunately for me, taking that out actually messes up what I used that field for (once upon a time...I think?). Anyway, now I know the cause, just not sure of the best solution; maybe just mass move that field to a differently titled one...but that journey is for another thread.

emalvick
2018-07-12, 08:29
Thanks to all who responded. After opening the entire music directory in MP3 tag, it does seem to be stray "Composer" tags. Unfortunately for me, taking that out actually messes up what I used that field for (once upon a time...I think?). Anyway, now I know the cause, just not sure of the best solution; maybe just mass move that field to a differently titled one...but that journey is for another thread.

Use "Composer Sort" tags much like you would use "Artist Sort", at least for the file(s) that are causing you problems. I forgot that there can be cross-over issues with names and sort fields; I think it's because LMS can (and may be set in your case) to blend Composers and Artists into one menu when browsing by Artist. I don't include Composers in that menu, but I think the indexing and sorting could still be affected. Regardless, a "Composer Sort" tag can fix things (or ruin things if it is not set right). Usually adding a or tag or removing one that is fowling things up will solve things. Occasionally, I have to wipe and rescan the database when these issues occur.

fphredd
2018-07-12, 16:26
Use "Composer Sort" tags much like you would use "Artist Sort", at least for the file(s) that are causing you problems. I forgot that there can be cross-over issues with names and sort fields; I think it's because LMS can (and may be set in your case) to blend Composers and Artists into one menu when browsing by Artist. I don't include Composers in that menu, but I think the indexing and sorting could still be affected. Regardless, a "Composer Sort" tag can fix things (or ruin things if it is not set right). Usually adding a or tag or removing one that is fowling things up will solve things. Occasionally, I have to wipe and rescan the database when these issues occur.

I do think 'moving' that tag information is going to be my shortest distance between two points. There is no 'perfect', I think, when it comes to tagging. Having a boatload of live stuff doesn't help either...