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slartibartfast
2018-02-20, 04:13
Having read good reports about these batteries I ordered one from Amazon and it was delivered today. After installing it I checked Settings/Advanced/Power and found the Battery Voltage Monitor values are different to a genuine Logitech battery.

Battery Vmon1 = 1.8V instead of 4.1V
Battery Vmon2 = 4.0V instead of 8.2V
All of these readings are at a battery voltage of 14.3V. If the cells are balanced properly 1.8V should not even be possible.

The taps are obviously in the wrong places. This raises a few questions

1. Are they all like this?
2. Does the Radio use these voltages for anything important?
3. Do they test them?

I think I know the answer to number 3. After waiting 10 days I would rather not have to return it.



Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

bpa
2018-02-20, 05:14
IIRC Battery charging and conditioning are managed through battery voltages & temp and Radio uses a microcontroller MSP340 to do battery charging so not all the code is in the Radio source.

To get a better answer I think you may need to look at code.

Diagnostic will show where Vmon1 and Vmon2 are found (i.e. what device)
https://github.com/Logitech/squeezeplay/blob/public/7.8/src/squeezeplay_squeezeos/share/applets/Diagnostics/DiagnosticsApplet.lua

The code which access battery when Radio running is here
https://github.com/Logitech/squeezeplay/blob/public/7.8/src/squeezeplay_baby/share/applets/SqueezeboxBaby/SqueezeboxBabyApplet.lua

slartibartfast
2018-02-20, 05:38
IIRC Battery charging and conditioning are managed through battery voltages & temp and Radio uses a microcontroller MSP340 to do battery charging so not all the code is in the Radio source.

To get a better answer I think you may need to look at code.

Diagnostic will show where Vmon1 and Vmon2 are found (i.e. what device)
https://github.com/Logitech/squeezeplay/blob/public/7.8/src/squeezeplay_squeezeos/share/applets/Diagnostics/DiagnosticsApplet.lua

The code which access battery when Radio running is here
https://github.com/Logitech/squeezeplay/blob/public/7.8/src/squeezeplay_baby/share/applets/SqueezeboxBaby/SqueezeboxBabyApplet.luaThanks, I had a look at the code in the two links and it looks as though the Voltages are only read and displayed in the first one and there is no reference at all to the Vmon values in the second. So it might be safe but I am still tempted to return it.

I still wonder if this is a one off or they are all like this.


Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

bpa
2018-02-20, 06:06
I think all the info read by lua code is supplied via the MSP430 which controls the actual charging.
The MSP430 can be used to charge a variety of battery types ( http://www.ti.com/lit/ug/sluu369/sluu369.pdf ) . If the MSP430 board & code is mostly standard reference code supplied by Ti, then the Vmon1 & VMon2 might be needed by the MSP430 to determine cell type, cell capacity, etc. and so adjust its charging algorithm,

drmatt
2018-02-20, 06:15
I am sure it is normal, and will work fine, despite readings being odd. They are the best known 3rd party battery supplier and I can't see them being fatally flawed.

Interesting insights into the battery code though. Anyone got any clues from that as to why Radios routinely fail to charge the batteries when plugged in?

Transcoded from Matt's brain by Tapatalk

bpa
2018-02-20, 06:37
I am sure it is normal, and will work fine, despite readings being odd. They are the best known 3rd party battery supplier and I can't see them being fatally flawed.

Interesting insights into the battery code though. Anyone got any clues from that as to why Radios routinely fail to charge the batteries when plugged in?

Transcoded from Matt's brain by Tapatalk

I don't use battery so I don't know normal operations but if it happens "routinely" you could have a look at the info provided by the MSP430 directory "/sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-1/1-0010" and perhaps you can identify the bad state. You might be lucky and find it is lua code but if problem is in MSP430 nothgin will happen.



# ls /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-1/1-0010
adc_0 adc_2 alarm_time battery_vmon1_voltage fw power_mode time
adc_1 adc_3 ambient battery_vmon2_voltage gp_register rtc:rtc0 uevent
adc_10 adc_4 battery_capacity battery_voltage input:input2 subsystem wall_voltage
adc_11 adc_5 battery_charge bus ir sys_voltage
adc_12 adc_6 battery_charge_rate charger_event kill test_1
adc_13 adc_7 battery_disable charger_state modalias test_2
adc_14 adc_8 battery_discharge_rate driver msp_buffer test_4
adc_15 adc_9 battery_temperature flash name test_8
# cat /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-1/1-0010/power_mode
3
# cat /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-1/1-0010/battery_capacity
2000
#

drmatt
2018-02-20, 08:19
I guess I would say it seems to happen once they reach about a year of age or so, sporadically at first but increasing in frequency as they age. It may even just be a problem with the physical socket detecting the plug being inserted, but my feeling is that it's not since waggling the plug doesn't help, whereas removing electrical power and reinstating it does help, sometimes.


Transcoded from Matt's brain by Tapatalk

slartibartfast
2018-02-20, 08:25
I am sure it is normal, and will work fine, despite readings being odd. They are the best known 3rd party battery supplier and I can't see them being fatally flawed.

Interesting insights into the battery code though. Anyone got any clues from that as to why Radios routinely fail to charge the batteries when plugged in?

Transcoded from Matt's brain by TapatalkAre you saying you are sure all Radio batteries made by HQRP have incorrect taps? The 1.8V reading is really odd as it is far too high for 1 cell and far too low for 2 cells.

Does anyone else use one of these batteries? If so could they post their readings for Vmon1 and Vmon2.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

slartibartfast
2018-02-20, 08:27
I guess I would say it seems to happen once they reach about a year of age or so, sporadically at first but increasing in frequency as they age. It may even just be a problem with the physical socket detecting the plug being inserted, but my feeling is that it's not since waggling the plug doesn't help, whereas removing electrical power and reinstating it does help, sometimes.


Transcoded from Matt's brain by TapatalkI've seen this quite frequently although more with one Radio than the other.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

drmatt
2018-02-20, 12:08
Are you saying you are sure all Radio batteries made by HQRP have incorrect taps?

That is not something I'm sure of no, it just seems to be a slightly unlikely manufacturing fault and seems more likely to be a design fault to me. Something they are likely to overlook when copying the real thing.. ( "what does this do? No idea, let's just connect it here...".)


Transcoded from Matt's brain by Tapatalk

slartibartfast
2018-02-20, 12:14
That is not something I'm sure of no, it just seems to be a slightly unlikely manufacturing fault and seems more likely to be a design fault to me. Something they are likely to overlook when copying the real thing.. ( "what does this do? No idea, let's just connect it here...".)


Transcoded from Matt's brain by TapatalkYou would think they would take one apart to copy it. After all there is also a thermistor in there which needs to be the correct one. They could even have looked on the internet. I've contacted them via Amazon so we will see what the response is.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

slartibartfast
2018-02-23, 01:03
You would think they would take one apart to copy it. After all there is also a thermistor in there which needs to be the correct one. They could even have looked on the internet. I've contacted them via Amazon so we will see what the response is.

Sent from my SM-G900F using TapatalkWell I didn't receive any confirmation that this was an isolated issue but to their credit after I sent a couple of photos of the battery diagnostics screen for both batteries they offered me a refund with no requirement to return the battery.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Sb42
2019-03-18, 11:55
My 2011 manufacturred Logitech battery no longer keeps a charge and has these values

Vmon1 3.9
Vmon2 7.7
Battery Temp: 20.6C
Battery Voltage: 13.5V
Wall Voltage: 18.1

Clearly I need a new battery, but can anyone tell me if this looks like the charger could be the problem? Radio runs fine on wall power and screen ocassionally shows Charging, but if I unplug the wall charger the Radio goes blank and won't function until power is restored from wall.







Having read good reports about these batteries I ordered one from Amazon and it was delivered today. After installing it I checked Settings/Advanced/Power and found the Battery Voltage Monitor values are different to a genuine Logitech battery.

Battery Vmon1 = 1.8V instead of 4.1V
Battery Vmon2 = 4.0V instead of 8.2V
All of these readings are at a battery voltage of 14.3V. If the cells are balanced properly 1.8V should not even be possible.

The taps are obviously in the wrong places. This raises a few questions

1. Are they all like this?
2. Does the Radio use these voltages for anything important?
3. Do they test them?

I think I know the answer to number 3. After waiting 10 days I would rather not have to return it.



Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

slartibartfast
2019-03-18, 12:20
My 2011 manufacturred Logitech battery no longer keeps a charge and has these values

Vmon1 3.9
Vmon2 7.7
Battery Temp: 20.6C
Battery Voltage: 13.5V
Wall Voltage: 18.1

Clearly I need a new battery, but can anyone tell me if this looks like the charger could be the problem? Radio runs fine on wall power and screen ocassionally shows Charging, but if I unplug the wall charger the Radio goes blank and won't function until power is restored from wall.

When the Radio is running on Wall Power and the display shows that the battery should be charging does the battery voltage show any signs of changing?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Sb42
2019-03-18, 17:47
No, the screen shows charging for a few seconds and then reverts to showing wall power.

slartibartfast
2019-03-19, 00:26
No, the screen shows charging for a few seconds and then reverts to showing wall power.Hmm I have never heard of the charger circuit failing so it appears that the charger thinks the battery is fully charged. If you pull the power cord does the Radio shut down immediately?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Sb42
2019-03-19, 07:48
Yep! Plug the power back in and it reboots, logs into wifi, LMS, and then plays. I'm hesitant to just add a new battery because it may be the charger circuit rather than the battery. Not having a battery is a 30 second annoyance, but not life-changing. That being said....I'd like it to be portable.

Sb42
2019-03-19, 07:49
Hmm I have never heard of the charger circuit failing so it appears that the charger thinks the battery is fully charged. If you pull the power cord does the Radio shut down immediately?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

The battery doesn't show as full charged..

pseud
2019-03-21, 13:22
How bizarre... Somebody suffering the exact same problem with their SB Radio as me and looking for an answer at the same time!

My battery, I bought it a few years ago (couple?)

Cameron Sino; Model CS-LSR533RC; Part No: HRMR15/51

I've pulled the cover off the battery to test the cell voltages, all the cells seemed to show what I understand to be good voltages (1.2 v?):
01- 1.276
02- 1.262
03- 1.293
04- 1.276
05- 1.298
06- 1.270
07- 1.291
08- 1.300
09- 1.292
10- 1.300

T 12.858

Measuring the voltages off the plug contacts I get:
Bl-Gr: 3.82 V
Bl-Br: 7.69 V
Bl-Rd: 12.84 V


The Diagonistics Power read out is:
Battery temperature
17.2 C
Battery voltage
13.1 V
Battery vmon1
3.8 V
Battery vmon2
7.5 V

When I turned it on following the battery being out of a few days (while I probed it) it showed charged for a short period before it shows fully charged, and has since. (When I turned it back on after making the above checks, it went straight to fully charged.)

Like Sb42, I really would like to know if it's the charging circuit or the battery - but, don't know how. I built my own battery before this back in 2011 which lasted for a good 5 years...

Thanks for any pointers anyone has.

(BTW, what's the MSP version? Version number 1598)

Sb42
2019-03-21, 14:24
What's an MSP?

pseud
2019-03-21, 15:42
What's an MSP?

It's the top item under the Power menu - other than that, I don't know what it is but I'd like to...

Sb42
2019-03-21, 17:01
Mine shows 1598