Alternative to Touch

[StridingEdge]

Hey all

My Touch was working perfectly until the scan started terminating after a minute or so. I have decided that I can no longer run with a device that is unsupported and cannot waste any more time trying to fix a problem for which there seems to be no company support and with an issue that it seems like many others have had with no resolution for.

So, what other options are out there for a streaming device. I just want an interface to play the playlists / music on my PC - all FLAC files.

[get.amped]

Hmmm... Coming to the SB enthusiast forum looking for alternatives to the SB environment... After a little rant...

Sarcasm aside, I have yet to find anything that works as well. The LMS server platform is continuing to be developed outside of the official Logitech release and a number of player options are available on 3rd party HW.

The people in this forum are quite helpful and can probably point you towards an answer for your scanning issues. I have built numerous LMS servers and they all run quite reliably 24/7. Provide some details (LMS version, HW platform, network config) and you might be surprised how quickly you get some answers.

[yeomanspc]

Hey all

My Touch was working perfectly until the scan started terminating after a minute or so.

well, what changed? In my experience, scans usually fail because you have a bad file - either bad tags, or a playlist that refers to deleted or moved music. Did you look in the scanner log? What version of LMS are you on? IMHO, support and reliability of the squeeze system has never been better than it is now...

[StridingEdge]

Yes, bad file it turns out. It wasn't a rant at all, just sheer disappointment. I muddied the actual question by supplying the immediate reason behind it and that is, for the sake of the argument, irrelevant. I have been toying with the concept of another device since buying the Touch.

But, as with many others I have seen on here over the last year or so, I can see a finite lifetime for the Touch, as everything has of course but I know if it has any sort of actual fault it's not going to get fixed. I was merely interested in other devices on the market. When I bought the Touch there were few, if any, alternatives other than the Sonos. Now, when you look on Amazon, there are a lot of streaming boxes from the stables of a few of the well known mid-priced manufactures, such as Marantz, Denon, Pioneer etc. I was wondering if anyone had any experience of them?

One particular question is - are there any GOOD devices, that people know of, that stream (both from internet and PC) and that combine a player that can handle CD, SACD, DVD-A, CD-R etc etc

[atrocity]

One particular question is - are there any GOOD devices, that people know of, that stream (both from internet and PC) and that combine a player that can handle CD, SACD, DVD-A, CD-R etc etc

You might want to look at the Oppo players. They play all the disc formats you mentioned and do some streaming. As far as I know, streaming from your own library still involves DLNA/UPNP with no gapless playback, though you'd be able to stream multichannel FLAC.

They also stream from the Internet, though I'm not sure if you can just "tune in" a URL like you can in Squeeze World. Oppos are pre-loaded with apps for Pandora, Netflix, etc...I haven't put any serious work into investigating non-app options.

I bought my first Squeezebox in 2008 and have yet to see anything else that comes close.

[StridingEdge]

You might want to look at the Oppo players. They play all the disc formats you mentioned and do some streaming. As far as I know, streaming from your own library still involves DLNA/UPNP with no gapless playback, though you'd be able to stream multichannel FLAC.

They also stream from the Internet, though I'm not sure if you can just "tune in" a URL like you can in Squeeze World. Oppos are pre-loaded with apps for Pandora, Netflix, etc...I haven't put any serious work into investigating non-app options.

I bought my first Squeezebox in 2008 and have yet to see anything else that comes close.

Thanks for that. All my Flac files are stereo (I assume when you said "multichannel you were referring to 5.1?) and that's all I want from that side of things. Do the Oppos handle that OK?

[JJZolx]

Yes, bad file it turns out. It wasn't a rant at all, just sheer disappointment.

"Sheer disappointment" in software that is unable to read a bad file?

Anyway...

Are you unaware of the many different approaches to creating a Squeezebox equivalent from a small, inexpensive computer? It's discussed in many, many threads in these forums.

[StridingEdge]

"Sheer disappointment" in software that is unable to read a bad file?

Anyway...

Are you unaware of the many different approaches to creating a Squeezebox equivalent from a small, inexpensive computer? It's discussed in many, many threads in these forums.

Well I didn't know that was the cause - had I known what the reason was I wouldn't have asked about it on here would I? Besides, I was under the impression that the complete scan process did a clean cache at the same time - apparently not!

Er... no to your question. I only visited here a few times when I initially got the box, so I have not been party to discussions of that nature

[atrocity]

Thanks for that. All my Flac files are stereo (I assume when you said "multichannel you were referring to 5.1?) and that's all I want from that side of things. Do the Oppos handle that OK?

The Oppos will play 2.0 just fine. But if your taste runs to opera or prog rock or any other genre where a single piece of music spans multiple tracks, you'll likely be annoyed by the lack of gapless playback. Though I dimly remember hearing that Oppo was working on fixing that for directly attached storage (but not for files streamed over the network).

The suggestion about small, cheap computers is also a good one. $125 gets you a Wandboard that works just fine as both Squeeze server and player. There may be a slight learning curve involved in initially writing the operating system to the MicroSD card, but once you've got it up and running it's absurdly easy to keep updated.

[JJZolx]

Well I didn't know that was the cause - had I known what the reason was I wouldn't have asked about it on here would I?

Which is what I would do as well. This is a good place to ask such questions. I was commenting on your "sheer disappointment".

Besides, I was under the impression that the complete scan process did a clean cache at the same time - apparently not!

A full scan will clear the databases of their contents first, but it doesn't actually remove the files. So if a database file is corrupted, the only way to fix the problem is to delete the file. That's what the clear cache function does. You can also do the same thing by stopping the LMS server and deleting the files manually.

Er... no to your question. I only visited here a few times when I initially got the box, so I have not been party to discussions of that nature

Ask questions. (There are no stupid questions, right?) Educate yourself. Everyone here is glad to help.

[StridingEdge]

It would make more sense to clear cache as part of the process wouldn't it? What would it matter if it was an automated and combined process? Are there any downsides to that? I might, as new practice clear it every time I do a complete scan from now on.

The disappointment was the final straw at the end of a crap day - not just a particular reaction just to a computer based element that didn't work. If the latter was normally such a big deal I'd have topped myself years ago

[yeomanspc]

So to get back to your original question re the touch replacement, a lot of us bought a spare (or more) player. With Michael doing some excellent work on 7.9, and having looked round at a lot of players, I conclude that there is nothing around today to replace all that the Squeezebox environment does, and that whatever comes along it is unlikely to last the 12+ years that Squeezebox has. Many on here (myself included) have future-proofed and you could do the same. I expect to be using the Squeeze system in 10 years - how many tech system last that long now? When my Logitech hardware dies I have tried Raspberry Pi with the HIFiBerry cards, the Odroid, the Wandboard (mentioned above) as excellent headless players which when combined with Ipeng or other tablet controllers provide function that is fine, and a fraction of the cost of Sonos etc. I am not concerned about hardware. I moved the server to the NAS so no longer need a windows PC, and for spare server I have an Odroid which absolutely flies. The only faint worry is MySqueezeboxServer.com which has to be pulled eventually, but I am sure we'll work round that (a lot of progress already). IMHO, Logitech couldn't make this pay because it was so darned good and had insufficient levers to force users to keep upgrading the hardware that the business was flawed. It's too open, but that's your protection too.

BTW, bad files / tags etc. will mess up other systems also :-)

[StridingEdge]

Thanks - that's interesting. I will continue to look at solutions and see what is best. I might, I confess, go down the Sonos route but it is an expensive one.

Re Tags - I see more problems on home audio forums relating to poor tagging than just about anything else. I was lucky to have spent some time with Media Jukebox before going down the Logitech route and I've got a good handle on them. It does help if you're anally retentive with Tags, as I am. The more you use them (and learn to do so correctly) the more useful they are. That's aside from the problems caused by not using them, using them incorrectly or being inconsistent..

[get.amped]

Thanks - that's interesting. I will continue to look at solutions and see what is best. I might, I confess, go down the Sonos route but it is an expensive one.

Re Tags - I see more problems on home audio forums relating to poor tagging than just about anything else. I was lucky to have spent some time with Media Jukebox before going down the Logitech route and I've got a good handle on them. It does help if you're anally retentive with Tags, as I am. The more you use them (and learn to do so correctly) the more useful they are. That's aside from the problems caused by not using them, using them incorrectly or being inconsistent..

I've known others that tried Sonos and were not only disappointed, but out a bunch of cash as the resale value is not great. The single biggest issue is the inherent 64K track limitation in its internal library, but the interface and ways to interact with it are also limiting.

[StridingEdge]

^ I read somewhere, only in the last couple of days, that Sonos are changing from that limitation. I'll try and find the link...

Here we are

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/sep/03/sonos-drops-price-music-systems-high-resolution-wireless-mp3

and...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/11072032/Sonos-ditches-the-Bridge.html