Announce: Enhanced Digital Output app - USB Dac and 192k Digital Ouput

[BodieBill]

I found this thread:

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr...gtl&1298043544

Quote: "All data feed into the digital inputs of a Prestige (or a Capitole Ref) are feed through the STARS processing system and hence are up-sampled. The SPDIF digital inputs on the Prestige and I think the current Capitole Ref does accept up to 24/96 data though and as I understand it up-samples 24/96 through the stars system as well to 24/192 (24/96 source material played this way sounds really good too!)."

So for now I assume this explains that I could not get EDO to work.

My question remains:
Should I de-install EDO or not? There was mention in this thread that EDO also affects 44, 88 and 96 playback in a positive way...

Thanks for your help!

I think your DAC is OK for 192/24, so that shouldn't be it. Did you read the posts just above yours? It may not seem related, but could be. At this time (with current LMS release) for 192/24 you must be playing FLAC, and it must be decoded on the Touch. This is *not* what many people prefer; many decode on the server, or play WAVs for example. So check that stuff; you may have changed decoding to on the server which is generally considered preferable, but that won't work with 24/192, so you need to set it back to the Touch. Good luck with it, you're almost there, it really does work!

[BodieBill]

I should have looked first. Answer found in Triode's message:

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showth...l=1#post701929

[lcrim]

Has anyone tested or tried the NuForce Icon uDAC2 Signature Edition (with Asynchronous USB) with EDO to tell whether it will work w/ alsa linux. Drivers for WIN7 are available for download and it apparently works natively w/ OSX 10 but no mention of linux.
Thanx
Larry

[Alenakiu]

I've posted a new applet to the 3rd party apps list for Squeezebox Touch. This is designed to enhance the digital output capabilities of the device for use with external Dacs. It is based on the software which people have helped me test on the "Async USB Dac Experiments" thread but should now be suitable for less experienced users to install.

The app should add support of the following to your Squeezebox Touch:
- External USB dacs using either USB audio class 1 or 2 protocols [USB 1 dacs normally state they support up to 96k sample rates, USB 2 dacs normally state up to 192k]
- Support of 176 and 192k playback via the standard digital output

There are a number of limitations to be aware of:
1) USB 1 dacs which operate in asynchronous mode probably need an external high speed hub to work without "clicks" - this is due to what appears to be a limitation in the Touch hardware. It is completely resolved with a cheap (<$10) bus powered hub connected between the dac and squeezebox. There is a workaround option which works with some dacs if a hub is not used, but it limits playback to 44/48k sample rates. At present is has only been proved to work with Audiolab/Lakewest dacs.
2) USB support does not yet support hot plugging of usb dacs - please connect your dac and leave turned on at present [this is likely to improve in future]
3) 192k playback requires a dac which supports it and is only supported with flac files using native decoding at present. [In future 7.8 LMS and firmware should support 192k wav streaming] It will also require sufficient bandwidth on your network.
4) Only one output can be selected at once, this means when a USB dac or the Digital Output are selected there will be no sound on the analog outputs.

The app is called "Enhanced Digital Output" and is the main 3rd party apps list.

To install, please following the following steps:
1) Ensure your Squeezebox Touch is running 7.7.x or later firmware
2) Go to Apps Gallery -> 3rd Party Apps on the touch screen
3) Deselect the "recommended applets only" option, so that you see a longer list of apps
4) Select "Enhanced Digital Output" and select it for installation
5) Your touch should download the app, reboot, then download a new custom linux kernel and reboot again
6) You should now get a list of possible output devices - this should include "Digital Output" and your USB Dac if it is plugged in, select the appropriate output
7) Touch should reboot again and then be ready to start playing with the selected output

If you want to change the output go to Setting > Audio Settings > Digital Output; if you want to change some of the advanced options go to Settings > Advanced > Digital Output

Please note that if you perform a firmware update, then the app and kernel will need to be reinstalled, this should be automated just requiring you to install the app again or to have the "reinstall after update" option selected from the 3rd party apps list.

If you want to completely remove the app, then uninstall it and force a firmware upgrade to reinstall the Logitech firmware and kernel.

Please post your feedback on this thread - I would like to create a list of USB DACs which are known to work with it, we started that on the experiment thread, but I think it would be cleaner to maintain a list here.

Sorry if this has been asked, but will EDO be available for Transporter?

[Mnyb]

Has anyone tested or tried the NuForce Icon uDAC2 Signature Edition (with Asynchronous USB) with EDO to tell whether it will work w/ alsa linux. Drivers for WIN7 are available for download and it apparently works natively w/ OSX 10 but no mention of linux.
Thanx
Larry

Nuforce , read this rather long article it is quite revealing but maybe not to your liking .
The product has some very basic design flaws , can it really be an upgrade ?

http://nwavguy.blogspot.se/2011/02/n...c-2-drama.html

[cfraser]

^ Cool link. It sounds MUCH worse in every way than what's built into the Touch, so why bother? If somebody is new to external DACs, they should know that there are plenty of them in the under-few-hundred-$ range that *are* worse than what's in the Touch. External does not equal better, necessarily.

[Mnyb]

^ Cool link. It sounds MUCH worse in every way than what's built into the Touch, so why bother? If somebody is new to external DACs, they should know that there are plenty of them in the under-few-hundred-$ range that *are* worse than what's in the Touch. External does not equal better, necessarily.

There are several in the multi k$$$ department too for example anything audionote or other brands that abandoned science and trust in voodo instead ( no the silver wiring won't help if the product has 1000 times more noise and distortion than a Walmart DVD player ) .

There are two main ways to fleece the audiophile by expectational bias .

Trust completely in placebo , the product is often ok but indistinguishable from other such products in controlled tests but it has good data, but sales is propelled by cosmetics heavy chassis and expensive looks etc , the audiophile fills in the dot's in their head.

Make it sound *different* this is to often perceived as better , beware .
Look out for to many buzzwords about about musicality and how the product not have any " digital glare " :P .

Just because triode have made Touch work with a much vider selection of DAC's than previously , does not make it worthwhile in every case , just beware in you DAC shopping go for technically competent designs, like the popular M-dac .

Things like the nuforce DAC turns arguments on it's head in the sound quality treads in the audiophile forum .
Note that many including me uses arguments that you " normally " should not be able to perceive a difference because of [ x ]

But audiophile land is filled with products that " makes " those differences happen ? But the cause may not be the one you expect.

[JaMo]

@Mnyb
I couldn't have said it better ; )
/Jan

[lcrim]

EDO and the use of asynchronous USB DACs is a real move towards better sound quality. The cabal that exists on this forum that insists that the status quo must be maintained and anything else is voodoo is becoming a pita.
I asked whether the device would work w/ linux and this was greeted w/ a lecture on what a pos that device is and the question was ignored. I am getting tired of this nonsense. Every question I've asked has been handled in this fashion.
Larry

[cfraser]

^ We are only trying to help you. Did you understand what that guy in the link was saying? Now if you had asked about a quality USB DAC that many have heard, maybe a W4S or even an Ayre (just 2 common examples), then you would have got lots of encouraging responses. Or maybe consider one of the other cheaper USB DACs the guy linked to has tried. Or find somebody else who's tried a lot in that category. Maybe the Schiit Bifrost would suit, lower cost but good performance. Really though, the DAC in the Touch isn't total rubbish, sorry if we made it sound that way, even if many of us don't use it...

Make sure you are looking at *asynchronous* USB DACs if you are looking for improved sonics with EDO. Most of the very cheap ones aren't, or it's not well/reliably done. Otherwise you are better off with S/PDIF with the Touch.

Edit: Larry, no offense or discouragement was intended. We all hope you do find something you like better.