Lms 7.8?

[mherger]

> @Michael, did you move from Bern to Fremont, CA, United States?

I'd still be in bed then. But I'm rather heading out to have lunch soon
:-).

--

Michael

[simonjedrake]

> Oh, did we ever mention we're hiring?

http://hire.jobvite.com/CompanyJobs/...ion&j=oRydWfwi
http://hire.jobvite.com/CompanyJobs/...ion&j=oVydWfwm

Michael

This is the best piece of news I have seen on this forum for a VERY long time.
I consider this to be a long term investment in the product line which is desperately needed. I have used SS/SB products for nearly 10 years & I enjoy the "geekiness" of the product, but I have a lot of rich friends whose IT knowledge is limited to turning on their iPad. Sadly all these friends are now on Sonus systems due to it's ease of setup/maintenace/use.................
They are NOT interested in the lower sound quality, restricted menu options, etc - they just want something that "runs" just like their iPods, iPhones, iPads, etc. To the mp3 generation sound quality is also NOT an issue which I know goes against the grain of most of the active posters on this forum, but......!
So I hope this expanded development software team will be allowed to take the product line into the high end Sonus market area as otherwise I fear for just how long Logitech will continue with this product before it is ditched!

[bits]

Powerful systems are complex. It is the nature of the beast.

I dont know how you can dumb down such a powerful product without just making it not powerful.

Eg Android versus iPhone; is powerful versus not(but with a whole lot of swanky features to compensate)


Every person I put onto Squeezebox NEVER looks back but always requires a bit of assistance to really get to what they want from the product. The more I think about it the more I feel there is no way this product could do all it is requested to do without a geek customizing it to what the user wants.

I'm a PABX programmer by trade and well all users pay a professional like me to install and configure it for them. It is just a given with the industry that it is that way you do it. No one is buying a PABX of the computer store shelves, that is nonsense. You pay a brick layer to lay your bricks straight; self install computer stuff is some weird voodoo Microsoft created a decade ago. The quicker users get over it the quicker the industry can move forward.

Somehow Logitech need to just tap into more users willing to pay someone else to set it up for them?

[erland]

Powerful systems are complex. It is the nature of the beast.

I dont know how you can dumb down such a powerful product without just making it not powerful.

Powerful at what ?

Powerful at supporting all possible configuration possibilities and making it as fast as possible to scan your music library ?
or
Powerful at making it an easy and enjoyable experience to discover and listen to music ?

I'd rather prefer the later and that's not where the focus has been during the last years, the focus during last years has been very technical and more about making the product more stable, decrease the maintenance costs and make the scanner faster. There has been very little focus on improving the functionality related to music listening/discovery.

Sure, stability and correcting bugs are important, but will it result in Logitech selling more Squeezeboxes ?
Maybe some through recommendations from forum members, but how do they reach other users ? Can they use less bugs and faster scanner as an argument to make your non technical friends select a Squeezebox ?

I think the single most important thing to get rid of is the computer.
There are two reasons which have stopped my friends to use the Squeezebox:
1. The requirement to have a computer powered on (people don't have stationary computer these days, they have tablets or laptops)
2. The requirement to rip all their CD-collection.

For youths the second point is not an issue because their collection already is in electronic form, but for older people which have a large CD or even LP collection it is.

The first point is an issue for most non technical users, but it's not an issue for many community members, for us it's an advantage to have the server on a computer since it means that we can easily improve it by getting a better computer.

I also think many non technical users use the "Music Folder" view instead of the other menus, mainly because it's too complicated for them to correct the tags. Starting another program, finding the incorrect track, correct it in a way so SBS/LMS understands it properly, is not something non technical users want to spend time doing. Of course, many non technical users also mostly use it for streaming services and internet radio.

I think it's important that we start to think about what features/changes are needed to make the Squeezebox attractive to our non technical friends. If Logitech can't reach these users the Squeezebox is going to die or be abandoned by Logitech, they aren't going to continue to maintain a geek product, they want something which they can use to expand to the masses.

Of course, the biggest issue at the moment is not limitations of the product itself, it's the lack of marketing.

[finnbrodersen]

Powerful at what ?

....

+1, wise words, I agree 95% (or more)

[bits]

I think the single most important thing to get rid of is the computer.
There are two reasons which have stopped my friends to use the Squeezebox:
1. The requirement to have a computer powered on (people don't have stationary computer these days, they have tablets or laptops)
2. The requirement to rip all their CD-collection.

Squeezebox supports connecting to mysqueezebox.com and using subscription music services in regions where they are available. Squeezebox has no requirement to have a PC anymore, you have a PC because it has the files you want to play.

The fact is for most is they still do have a local media library.
It is local because:
-Lack of subscription services in many regions
-Internet connections to many mobile devices are not cost effective or stable to use for music services.
-ongoing costs of subscription services versus own the music outright so dont need to continue paying a subscription to access it.

And while they have a local media library the most common sense thing for multiple devices to access that same library would be to have a "server".

I dont think making Squeezebox double as a NAS is at all smart.
-It'll cost too much to buy
-It'll be too big and ugly
-many users already have a more powerful server to use

To have instant searching and abstraction of a local media library the server software will need to scan the files and use a protocal that suits. iTunes, WMP and every media player worth 2 cents scans the music first.


A server is 100% going to be required by all products for hosting the local files that users want and for software that allows for flexible access to those files. When users dont want local files the server can disappear, like is already possible with the Squeezebox product.


This forum has been regurgitating 2 ideas constantly which I find are just totally wrong things some armchair expert forum user dreamed up one day.

These 2 things need to be dropped already by this community because they are just utter nonsense
1)Logitech is going to close down the Squeezebox product or other similar ideas. This has run around in circles for a few years now, all while more Squeezeboxes get released and still maintain their strong price point.
2)Logitech need to make Squeezebox run without LMS. As stated this is just a crazy insane idea. Squeezebox, like your ps3 or Samsung/Sony/LG TV, play files from a server, that is how computers work.


If the user wants basic, they already own it in and wont buy a Squeezebox ever regardless of what changes. Stop trying to push Squeezebox on users that don't want or need it.
If users want more than what their TV, game console, disc player does currently but cant understand how to set it up, they will need to hire someone to do it for them.
These users want a server, they want it customized to their needs, they want those things because they want it to do more because they are the power user.

[bits]

Powerful at what ?

Powerful at integrating/consolidating numerous media types from both local and internet sources into a single common interface.

Powerful at allowing full control over the way the products works so it can be tailored to how a user wants. Eg advance configuration options, Plugins that allow for much much more, near complete control over the entire UI.

Powerful media library management when compared to other "hardware" based players, eg TV, AV Receiver, Disc player, etc. Fast access to different views, eg by artist, album, year, genre. Fast access to searching for specific files that match certain criteria. Strong playlist management for playlist creation, queue management.

Powerful integration of other desired features eg visualizations, weather forecasts, home automation via already mentioned powerful full control of app


It can do 1 million different things for 1 million different people and that flexibility causes complexity, that is the nature of the beast. You can only dumb it down so far before you start removing the features listed above and at that point you lose everything that made Squeezebox stand out from the pack to begin with.

The reason Squeezebox has been such a popular product for so many years is because it is powerful. If you didn't want powerful you would just use your existing TV's media interface that you already owned(or your PS3, Xbox 360, Bluray player etc).

[frank1969]

When will we get 7.8 nightlies from http://downloads.slimdevices.com/nightly/ ?

[erland]

This forum has been regurgitating 2 ideas constantly which I find are just totally wrong things some armchair expert forum user dreamed up one day.

These 2 things need to be dropped already by this community because they are just utter nonsense
1)Logitech is going to close down the Squeezebox product or other similar ideas. This has run around in circles for a few years now, all while more Squeezeboxes get released and still maintain their strong price point.
2)Logitech need to make Squeezebox run without LMS. As stated this is just a crazy insane idea. Squeezebox, like your ps3 or Samsung/Sony/LG TV, play files from a server, that is how computers work.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that Logitech needs to make Squeezebox run without LMS, I'm just saying that they need to give people who don't have a stationary computer to run LMS on an option.

Many of my non technical friends have purchased new computers during the last 3 years but I think none of them got a stationary computer, all got a laptop which is wifi connected. A wifi connected laptop which usually runs on battery is not going to give them an enjoyable Squeezebox experience.

These people either need a player which they can attach a USB drive to directly or a separate server box with pre-installed LMS and a built-in hard drive. However, the issue with a server box is that it's going to get too expensive for them, so that solution won't work.

You can say that these people shouldn't use Squeezebox but then you are also saying that Logitech should ignore at least 80% of the potential market.

[erland]

Powerful at integrating/consolidating numerous media types from both local and internet sources into a single common interface.

Powerful at allowing full control over the way the products works so it can be tailored to how a user wants. Eg advance configuration options, Plugins that allow for much much more, near complete control over the entire UI.

Powerful media library management when compared to other "hardware" based players, eg TV, AV Receiver, Disc player, etc. Fast access to different views, eg by artist, album, year, genre. Fast access to searching for specific files that match certain criteria. Strong playlist management for playlist creation, queue management.

Powerful integration of other desired features eg visualizations, weather forecasts, home automation via already mentioned powerful full control of app


It can do 1 million different things for 1 million different people and that flexibility causes complexity, that is the nature of the beast. You can only dumb it down so far before you start removing the features listed above and at that point you lose everything that made Squeezebox stand out from the pack to begin with.

The reason Squeezebox has been such a popular product for so many years is because it is powerful. If you didn't want powerful you would just use your existing TV's media interface that you already owned(or your PS3, Xbox 360, Bluray player etc).

I just wish you had mentioned the words "music", "audio" or "listen" at least once... ;-)
Because that's my point, functionality related to music discovery/listening has not been in focus during the last years, at least not enough.