FUD, intellectual honesty, digital facts, and the TAS articles...

[darrenyeats]

Then again “I can't see how that could be true” might only indicate a lack of imagination, and doesn't allow for future variables.

When it comes to copying files or converting from FLAC to WAV and back affecting SQ I don't say "I can't see how that could be true". I say "I know it is not true".
Darren

[chill]

Some of the claims made by the TAS article, however, do seem to cross the line and imply something either revolutionary or crazy. Then again “I can't see how that could be true” might only indicate a lack of imagination, and doesn't allow for future variables. Is it not better to reserve judgment than look an idiot in hindsight?

Would you care to say which of their claims, in your opinion, have crossed this line, and why those particular claims stand out? Is it perhaps their claim that WAV-FLAC-WAV degrades the sound, or maybe that identical files produced by different rippers can sound different? After all, all of this claptrap is supported by the same level of 'evidence'. At what point do you personally start to question this 'evidence'?

[ralphpnj]

Without some sort of quality control (not to say a sanity filter), we might as well all go looking for Russell's teapot.

Good point, however Russell's teapot is very easy to find: the teapot is the difference between an original wav file and the wav file one gets after doing 10,000 wav to flac to wav conversions of the original wav file. The number 10,000 is very, very important since even doing 9,999 conversions will not produce the right teapot.

Oh wait, you wrote "teapot"! Duh! I was thinking crackpot! Sorry. In the case of crackpot any number of wav > flac > wav conversions will produce a clearly visible and audible crackpot!

[Mnyb]

There are an infinite number of unfounded hypotheses which we could consider, but it would be a complete waste of time. Of course, scientists sometimes need imagination to take a leap into the unknown, and discover something new about our universe. But let's not kid ourselves - the assertion that a binary data file is identical to another binary data file, but at the same time not capable of delivering the same information content, is not an issue at the frontiers of science, it is simple madness.

Without some sort of quality control (not to say a sanity filter), we might as well all go looking for Russell's teapot.

+1

I would include the alleged WAV FLAC difference here and " only experience count "is bs, well this difference is mostly reported in sigthed test anecdotes by audiophiles aka crackpots , do you want an more unreliable source of " information "if so I don't know where to find it.

Take this question to hydrogen audio they have exhausted the subject thoroughly for us . So we can move on to do something else.

completely different environment WAV/flac ? The PC literally do >1000's of things at the same time the
exceptionally undemanding task of yet open another file of any kind makes a difference ?? The " environment " change more depending on where on the disk the file is or what weekday it is.

The laws of probability is against that any serous effort is to be spent chasing the unicorn in this case.

There is well established explanations for this ( and most other tweak crap ) available from the field of psychoacoustic one name for it is expectation bias or placebo or confirmation bias, this is the most likely
explanation .

And why is there no anecdotes that says that FLAC is better than WAV the offered explanation model of " environment " could easily apply to this POW to ( this makes this " explanation " crap but anyway ).

Because in audiophile cargo cult fairytale land " compression " is such a scary word and the ignorant can't se the difference between lossles and lossy so this myth gained momentum and as all audiophile myths it never goes away :-/ initially some audiofools thought FLAC was similar to mp3 , you still get questions like this on some fora, sigh.

The typical audiophile knee jerk reaction that you have to try yourself for everything is pure nonse , you must filter out things for example I'm not very likely to try out any magic pebbles from machine dynamica anytime soon .
Nor I'm I likely to try homeopathy when I'm unwell there really is no mechanism by which it could work.

[ralphpnj]

+1

I would include the alleged WAV FLAC difference here and " only experience count "is bs, well this difference is mostly reported in sigthed test anecdotes by audiophiles aka crackpots , do you want an more unreliable source of " information "if so I don't know where to find it.

Here in the USA that unreliable of "information" is known as Fox News. Sorry but I just couldn't resist. Now back the normal audio discussion.

[item_audio]

By way of getting at the core issues - because some of you guys have evidently thrown out the baby with the bath-water here - if your SB is connected via optical SPDIF to a DAC, do you believe it is possible for an upgraded power supply to make any difference?

No takers?

[mlsstl]

Here in the USA that unreliable of "information" is known as Fox News. Sorry but I just couldn't resist. Now back the normal audio discussion.

All the network news shows have their shortcomings. Who can forget NBC and their infamous "expose" on how the gas tanks in GM pickups were likely to explode and it turned out NBC had used explosives in the gas tank to make sure they had good video. Or CBS's forged documents relating to President Bush's Air National Guard service, with their later excuse they were "fake, but accurate." Then there was ABC that faked part of their story on allegedly runaway Toyotas.

I quit watching national news on TV a long time ago. A pox on all their houses.

However, this thread on audio is contentious enough without expanding the subject.

[adamdea]

All the network news shows have their shortcomings. Who can forget NBC and their infamous "expose" on how the gas tanks in GM pickups were likely to explode and it turned out NBC had used explosives in the gas tank to make sure they had good video. Or CBS's forged documents relating to President Bush's Air National Guard service, with their later excuse they were "fake, but accurate." Then there was ABC that faked part of their story on allegedly runaway Toyotas.

I quit watching national news on TV a long time ago. A pox on all their houses.

However, this thread on audio is contentious enough without expanding the subject.

I think the most extraordinary one was the famous Disney wild life documentary about lemmings which showed them jumping off cliffs because "everyone knows" that they do, and it would be boring to have to wait for them to do what we know they do; in fact it turns out that there are other reasons why the lemming population varies sharply over time. The lemmings in the documentary were specifically flown in and launched of the cliff using a turntable!

I take your point about topic expansion; but we have established that no one can find any coherent justification of the articles referred to in the OP, so the topic seems to be dead.

[Phil Leigh]

No takers?

Perhaps if you just spelled out what you are talking about instead of being cryptic... Which is neither big or clever....

[ralphpnj]

However, this thread on audio is contentious enough without expanding the subject.

Agreed, which is why I did apologize for my brief lapse.