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Thread: Puzzler

  1. #1
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    Puzzler

    I have six albums that appear under both "No Artist" AND in their proper artist name category when browsing Artists in LMS. Clicking on the track information, it says:

    Artist: No artist
    Track Artist: Earth Wind and Fire

    etc, etc......

    When I actually play a track from those particular albums, the information displayed reads----as you might expect:

    Head to the Sky (1973)
    No Artist, Earth Wind and Fire

    I've looked at the tags in mp3tag and cannot find any reason...all the artist tags are there and correct (I do not use AlbumArtist). Everything else is fine...artwork is fine, albums appear fine in Album browse, they play fine, et. Somewhere, something's ever so slightly amiss with these 6 (out of many hundreds), but I can't figure it out! Anybody got an idea?

    Thanks
    Rg

    System information
    ------------------------
    Main: Vortexbox > Teddy Pardo PS >Touch (wired) > USB> MF VLink II >Toslink > Rega DAC > LFD LE IV Signature amp > VA Mozart Grands > REL Acoustics R305.

    Home Theatre: Touch (Wired) > Pioneer VSX 919 > Energy Take 5 Classic 5.1.

    LMS 7.8.0 - 1395395852 on a Vortexbox Appliance, V 2.3, Touches: FW 7.8.0-r16754.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Mnyb's Avatar
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    Check the extended tag menu in mp3tag also look out for muktiole tag formats in the same file.

    also SBS/LMS can show you the tags it sees in the file info > more info > view tags

    idea an empty albumartist tag or similar.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Mnyb's Avatar
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    And You if fail completely to figure it out, strip the files of all tags and start over if it's only 6 albums .
    --------------------------------------------------------------------
    Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub.
    Bedroom/Office: Boom
    Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
    Misc use: Radio (with battery)
    iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
    (in storage SB3, reciever ,controller )
    server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

    http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

  4. #4
    Senior Member CharlieG's Avatar
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    Leading space?

    Not that I think this is the problem, but, there was a lot of talk about leading spaces a couple of months ago. Could a leading space cause this behavior? Or an artist tag with a separator followed by a space, or by nothing?
    Just asking the question because I have been extra careful about leading spaces because of all that talk. I even went through all of my tags looking for them :-)

  5. #5
    Senior Member Mnyb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CharlieG View Post
    Not that I think this is the problem, but, there was a lot of talk about leading spaces a couple of months ago. Could a leading space cause this behavior? Or an artist tag with a separator followed by a space, or by nothing?
    Just asking the question because I have been extra careful about leading spaces because of all that talk. I even went through all of my tags looking for them :-)
    Yes good idea I spent a couple of hours adjusting my tags accordingly The web-UI wont show you the difference as html strips spaces in certain circumstances like if you have double spaces in the artist name. I had two "Miles Davis" a while it could be in the album name too.

    LMS is also case sensetive
    --------------------------------------------------------------------
    Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub.
    Bedroom/Office: Boom
    Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
    Misc use: Radio (with battery)
    iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
    (in storage SB3, reciever ,controller )
    server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

    http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mnyb View Post
    And You if fail completely to figure it out, strip the files of all tags and start over if it's only 6 albums .
    This is what I finally did and it cleared up the problem. I had installed a new version of Vortexbox on my VBA which wipes the hard drive, so I'd restored all my music files from my backup. Something must've gotten slightly askew in the transfers of those 6 albums.

    Thanks for your suggestions!
    Rg

    System information
    ------------------------
    Main: Vortexbox > Teddy Pardo PS >Touch (wired) > USB> MF VLink II >Toslink > Rega DAC > LFD LE IV Signature amp > VA Mozart Grands > REL Acoustics R305.

    Home Theatre: Touch (Wired) > Pioneer VSX 919 > Energy Take 5 Classic 5.1.

    LMS 7.8.0 - 1395395852 on a Vortexbox Appliance, V 2.3, Touches: FW 7.8.0-r16754.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Mnyb's Avatar
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by rgro View Post
    This is what I finally did and it cleared up the problem. I had installed a new version of Vortexbox on my VBA which wipes the hard drive, so I'd restored all my music files from my backup. Something must've gotten slightly askew in the transfers of those 6 albums.

    Thanks for your suggestions!
    Ok, this could have been a scanning/database error too " scan for changes" is not always what it should be, especially in older versions off the server it can leave corpses behind, sometimes after a tag fix session in 7.5 or earlier you could end up with all kind of " ghost" entries in the dB with scan for changes. 7.6 and 7.7 has improved greatly but I would not bet the farm on it. Sometimes the clear and rescan is the thing you have to do .

    It could also be bug that is fixed in the new version a likely explanation.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------
    Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub.
    Bedroom/Office: Boom
    Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
    Misc use: Radio (with battery)
    iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
    (in storage SB3, reciever ,controller )
    server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

    http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mnyb View Post
    Ok, this could have been a scanning/database error too " scan for changes" is not always what it should be, especially in older versions off the server it can leave corpses behind, sometimes after a tag fix session in 7.5 or earlier you could end up with all kind of " ghost" entries in the dB with scan for changes. 7.6 and 7.7 has improved greatly but I would not bet the farm on it. Sometimes the clear and rescan is the thing you have to do .

    It could also be bug that is fixed in the new version a likely explanation.
    I did a clear and rescan after each attempt at fixing something---probably ran it 6 or 7 times as I tried different things, so I don't think that was the issue. I almost never use "scan for new and changed"---I've not had good luck with that! My guess is that the initial data restore from the backup introduced a few errors in those tags/files and deleting and re-tagging eliminated those errors.
    Rg

    System information
    ------------------------
    Main: Vortexbox > Teddy Pardo PS >Touch (wired) > USB> MF VLink II >Toslink > Rega DAC > LFD LE IV Signature amp > VA Mozart Grands > REL Acoustics R305.

    Home Theatre: Touch (Wired) > Pioneer VSX 919 > Energy Take 5 Classic 5.1.

    LMS 7.8.0 - 1395395852 on a Vortexbox Appliance, V 2.3, Touches: FW 7.8.0-r16754.

  9. #9
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    My biggest source of problems with multiple artist tags has been the "artist sort" field. In some cases the automatic metadata entries have this field set and I don't necessarily notice. It's a field I'm not used to having and usually neglect, but it can cause problems.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Mnyb's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by emalvick View Post
    My biggest source of problems with multiple artist tags has been the "artist sort" field. In some cases the automatic metadata entries have this field set and I don't necessarily notice. It's a field I'm not used to having and usually neglect, but it can cause problems.
    +1

    Amen , one of those tags somewhere sorts all the albums with the artist not only the album that has the tag.

    bug or feature a philosophical question it depends on pow.

    A file should sort as it is tagged ok. (and should sort the same in all music software in the best of worlds)

    But a music database is (or should be sbs/lms can improve here ) more than the sum of it's tag's so an artist may have a user preferred sort order.

    But is it right to set that from another random file in the database ?

    Imo it should be so that we have to set the artist sort (if we want it ) in all files with that artist for minimum of confusion .

    (or second best in in sbs/lms )

    Further you have

    artistsort
    artist sort
    artistsortorder

    .
    .
    albumartist sort
    .
    .
    composer sort

    I think it is a bit messy to let these tags in one file influence the sorting of other files .
    In reality the tag anal user would edit all concerned files anyway if special sort order is desired and not just edit one file to set the sorting ?

    It would give you a more reasonable and simple failure mode.

    If all Miles Davis albums is sortet Davis Miles ? and you have 72 of them + compilatiosn where he apear and you have to find one offending tag somewhere .

    Versus the situation where you have 71 albums sorted under Miles Davis and one stray Davis Miles, then you know what's up

    But the current sorting feature is preferred by many forum members for reasons I do not really understand and logitech/slimdevices thinks that this is as it should be .

    it is probably a legacy feature from 10 year in the past.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------
    Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3 sub.
    Bedroom/Office: Boom
    Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
    Misc use: Radio (with battery)
    iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
    (in storage SB3, reciever ,controller )
    server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

    http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

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