Squeezebox Server --> Media Server but... what's really new?

[Gblenn]

Are you referring to the Squeezebox soft players (which don't use DLNA but use the Squeeze protocol) or have you got gapless playback working with a DLNA softplayer?

Regardless, unless the hardware boxes (thinking Linn, Musical Fidelity, et. al.) support it then it's still of no practical use as a high-end Squeezebox replacement.

Yes I am refering to soft players, and yes they use the Squeeze protocol. The idea was to have a proxy between SBS and the DLNA part (which could perhaps consist of a subset of a softplayer) to retain all the SBS functions save a few, whilst adding the capability to use DLNA devices. Not the same as LMS DLNA or Whitebear though!

Think of it as having the softplayer retransmitting the stream to your Linn, Music Fidelity device, but rewrapping it in DLNA protocol.

But please read back in the thread for more details, if you are interested.

[Gblenn]

In response to my suggestion:
"You might try IM'ing the author of the WhiteBear Server program which already operates as an intermediate between LMS and DLNA devices."

That's why I brought up what a VortexBox is and why it doesn't solve the problem.

So are you saying that you can use iPeng together with Whitebear towards a DLNA device?

[PasTim]

One reason for wanting DLNA is that different people in the same house do things differently.

I use the Touch a lot, and all my music listening is done through that. I have no interest in displaying pictures on it.

SWMBO on the other hand, watches videos on our PVR via tversity, and has been known to play music on it as well via Whitebear (which I have run for just that purpose when she wants me to). She doesn't want to learn to use the Touch, and who am I to argue?

[toby10]

....
You might try IM'ing the author of the WhiteBear Server program which already operates as an intermediate between LMS and DLNA devices.

......

I have been thinking about that actually, as well as the Vortexbox team...

So are you saying that you can use iPeng together with Whitebear towards a DLNA device?

No. The quoted suggestion and your response are complete, no iPeng was mentioned.
You keep saying you need an intermediate software application to accomplish what you want, I was just suggesting WhiteBear as another possible contact point who is already familiar with utilizing DLNA with LMS. I'd also suggest contacting the iPeng author as well.

[toby10]

.....
I think you are saying I am glossing over peoples reasons to buy the SB because I don't think people need the functions of SBS. But that is where you are in fact wrong, I do think WE do need and want most of those functions. And we are all different here in terms of which functions we use and how much. But I think I have an idea that will retain almost all of those functions, save a bare few.....

Well, no, I'm saying people buy SB products because they can't get the same level of features with a simplistic DLNA device. Just as you state above, we DO want those functions. And, IMO, lacking those features/functions greatly reduces the popularity of what you are proposing for SB users.

For you "bare few" refers to SB functions lost via DLNA, I see "bare few" SB functions remaining with DLNA. Therefore, very low interest level among SB users for music and services with DLNA devices.

[paulster]

Yes I am refering to soft players, and yes they use the Squeeze protocol. The idea was to have a proxy between SBS and the DLNA part (which could perhaps consist of a subset of a softplayer) to retain all the SBS functions save a few, whilst adding the capability to use DLNA devices. Not the same as LMS DLNA or Whitebear though!

Think of it as having the softplayer retransmitting the stream to your Linn, Music Fidelity device, but rewrapping it in DLNA protocol.

And if the softplayer has to talk DLNA to the end player and DLNA doesn't support gapless playback then how do you propose this will be any different from what we already have?

[garym]

And if the softplayer has to talk DLNA to the end player and DLNA doesn't support gapless playback then how do you propose this will be any different from what we already have?

well there are some brand specific software work-arounds that can allow gapless, etc. in very specific situations even with DLNA (Linn, for example). But there is no common standard. (I think even SONOS is using some sort of SONOS specific workaround to DLNA/UpNP, but I could be very wrong about this).

[Gblenn]

Well, no, I'm saying people buy SB products because they can't get the same level of features with a simplistic DLNA device. Just as you state above, we DO want those functions. And, IMO, lacking those features/functions greatly reduces the popularity of what you are proposing for SB users.

For you "bare few" refers to SB functions lost via DLNA, I see "bare few" SB functions remaining with DLNA. Therefore, very low interest level among SB users for music and services with DLNA devices.

The problem is that peoples view on which functions are important differ. And it may very well be so that a majority of users view Sync, Mysb.com or any of the other features to be so crucial that it therefore is of no interest. I can see that it is so for you at least.

But I don't see any problems in discussing features or functions, whichever they may be, that are only interesting to a minority of users. I have no idea how many SB's have been sold, or users are out there, but I am pretty sure that even a minority may mean thousands in some cases. But this is a totally pointless discussion to have since none of us can know for sure, and all it can be is an opinion.

I would rather try to figure out what is possible or not, than discuss popularity which is purely subjective anyway. The only items brought up so far (the list may grow or shrink) that would be lacking if my idea could be realized are:
1. Plugin solution - may not be allowed by Logitech, but could be overcome in a different way perhaps
2. Sync - would be difficult or impossible
3. Mysb.com - not impossible but could be blocked by Logitech
4. Paid media - not impossible but could be blocked for copyright reasons
5. Cross Fade - difficult or probably impossible since it is a HW feature, unless it's available in DLNA. Maby it could be achieved through digital mixing but the server must be able to acknowledge it then...

[Gblenn]

And if the softplayer has to talk DLNA to the end player and DLNA doesn't support gapless playback then how do you propose this will be any different from what we already have?

well there are some brand specific software work-arounds that can allow gapless, etc. in very specific situations even with DLNA (Linn, for example). But there is no common standard. (I think even SONOS is using some sort of SONOS specific workaround to DLNA/UpNP, but I could be very wrong about this).

Well I am not really thinking of it in that way.
If you view the DLNA device more like a networked DAC, then whatever the Softplayer can do, can also be done with the DLNA device. In addition you can control some of the basic functions of the DLNA device like Volume up/down, probably pause etc.

[AndrueC]

I can, of course, use Whitebear to do just that, and I spent quite a bit of time with the plugin developer who was very helpful in getting my particular DLNA device to work (it is a Humax PVR that behaves rather strangely). I just had this hope that I could get one bit of software to do what I currently use three for (i.e. LMS for SB Touch, Whitebear for music to PVR, and tversity for video) to do. No such luck.

Same situation I'm in. I'd like to be able to ditch TVersity and just use LMS for video. I haven't actually tried the release version but one of the late candidates got as far as listing the VOBs for my PS3 but the PS3 refused to play them. I might have time this weekend to do a test on my laptop but I wary of doing anything that might disrupt my working 7.5.4 install. Such is my (lack of) confidence in the software.

Oh and the reason I own an SB is because at the time (before the company was sold to Logitech) it was the only reliable music player I could find. I have no idea if that was because it didn't use DNLA but from what I remember the problem was that other units either crashed or randomly stopped playing. I don't want anything trick from my Touch. Just the ability to play music stored on my server for as long as I care to listen.