Genpuid advice

[audiomuze]

In MusicIP GUI, I can see that the vast majority of songs in my music library have PUIDs. I have about 180 that don't have PUID's (30 unanalyzable, some analysed by name only, and the others analysed some time ago but still don't have a PUID).

Not sure MiP GUI ever goes back to get the PUID. If you want the PUID's use genpuid.

[Philip Meyer]

>Analysis takes up to ten mins per track, not ten mins of audio content.
>
That's not what the documentation says:

"Before a PUID is available for MusicBrainz or Picard to use, Music Analysis must have been performed on a track. MusicAnalysis uses up to 10 minutes of the track and examines all sorts of things."

So a closed-source app analyses:
1) the first 2 mins of a track, to generate a fingerprint.
2) the first 10 mins of a track, to generate analysis data.

Something is sent to the MusicDNS server to return a PUID (assume the anaysis data created from (2)). PUIDs are not generated locally, but are generated based on the analysis data?

>> Out of the ones that have got PUIDs, there were ~5000 that were listed
>> via running the "List Duplicates" report (generates a playlist). i.e.
>> different source files in the library that have the same PUID.Are they different versions of the same track?

Actually, I don't think the "List Duplicates" report is using PUIDs, as it seems to be suggesting duplicates on files that don't have PUIDs yet. Maybe it is based on the Analysis data created for each track (or the fingerprint?).

The Duplicates playlist only indicates what tracks it believes may be duplicated - it doesn't say what pair of items are considered duplicates. I was ordering by PUID, so I could see songs that shared the same PUID. These generally were the same song, but often slightly different versions, eg. one maybe from an album, and a repeat of the same song from a CD single. Sometimes these versions had different lengths, sometimes I know they are different edits of the same song (eg. remastered version, remixed, extended, etc).

i.e. a lot of the 2500 songs were legitimate dups, mainly from compilations and album+single rips, but some are not legitimate dups.

Phil

[Philip Meyer]

>Not sure MiP GUI ever goes back to get the PUID. If you want the PUID's
>use genpuid.
>
Still trying to understand what benefits there are from having/storing PUIDs. I thought they would be used to quickly re-analyse music, should I need to (eg. if m3lib get corrupted).

However, if I archive analysis, this stores Fingerprint and Analysis (mix data), and thus wouldn't need to re-analyse. And if "List Duplicates" doesn't require PUIDs, what other reasons are there for PUIDs.

As genpuid seems to store completely different fingerprint, analysis and PUID tags from MusicIP GUI, there doesn't seem to be much point to genpuid either.

I run MusicIP headless, with Web UI to add new music and analyse, but this doesn't archive analysis data. I thought I'd automate by using genpuid, but it seems that maybe it would still be better to open MusicIP UI to archive analysis from time to time, as genpuid seems to analyse every file referenced in m3lib every time it is run, if I want it to store tags in source files and also update the m3lib file. And it stores duplicate tags, so this is a bit wasteful.

Another curiosity I have is with the SBS Web UI Song > More Info > View Tags display:

MUSICMAGIC DATA: AgEAJ7QTjLKgldiKhEbYjk4UhKeCNoiWDwSnVBgMgAHp9IABlJ opD6tbgAHK9I75hLiAAcVQ8ZTBKoABgAHBaBnY2hamvqjTgAKA AZNEmba/NYMs67NDiJWJgwmDxeY2lwgzxY8q42+DDooP+satcZdjxvePro S9gAHGuLj05wusVICevl35reOapYKyyYFNgvY=

MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT: (756 Bytes)

The MUSICMAGIC DATA tag appears as a long text area box with a scrollbar (quite messy), whereas the MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT only reports the length of the data tag. Maybe there is something special in SBS to ignore reporting fingerprint data, but not the DATA tag?

Phil

[erland]

Still trying to understand what benefits there are from having/storing PUIDs. I thought they would be used to quickly re-analyse music, should I need to (eg. if m3lib get corrupted).

However, if I archive analysis, this stores Fingerprint and Analysis (mix data), and thus wouldn't need to re-analyse. And if "List Duplicates" doesn't require PUIDs, what other reasons are there for PUIDs.

Probably none.

This page contains some information about a wrapper of the libofa library which is used by third party applications that want to retrieve a PUID from musicdns.org:
http://search.cpan.org/~pepe/Audio-O...io/Ofa/Util.pm

It seems to indicate that the fingerprint might change if you apply lossy compression on a file but you can be sure that the PUID you get from musicdns.org is the same as before.

I think the PUID is just the unique key into the musicdns.org service if you like to retrieve additional metadata later. The plan was probably to use musicdns.org for other things than just a PUID generator.

I'm pretty sure you don't need the PUID for MusicIP.
If you have used picard or similar tool to get Musicbrainz id tags into your files, you should need the PUID for this later on as you already have the musicbrainz id tags which is unique.

Another curiosity I have is with the SBS Web UI Song > More Info > View Tags display:

MUSICMAGIC DATA: AgEAJ7QTjLKgldiKhEbYjk4UhKeCNoiWDwSnVBgMgAHp9IABlJ opD6tbgAHK9I75hLiAAcVQ8ZTBKoABgAHBaBnY2hamvqjTgAKA AZNEmba/NYMs67NDiJWJgwmDxeY2lwgzxY8q42+DDooP+satcZdjxvePro S9gAHGuLj05wusVICevl35reOapYKyyYFNgvY=

MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT: (756 Bytes)

The MUSICMAGIC DATA tag appears as a long text area box with a scrollbar (quite messy), whereas the MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT only reports the length of the data tag. Maybe there is something special in SBS to ignore reporting fingerprint data, but not the DATA tag?

It only displays tags values in this window if they are shorter than 256 characters.

[Philip Meyer]

>Ok, the parameter to stop PUID generation is "*-nopuid* ... bypass the
>PUID lookup. Useful for just analyzing files."

Had another play test with genpuid today. I now understand that MUSICMAGIC DATA and MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT are generated and stored with the same tag names+values using either genpuid and MusicIP GUI. The difference is that genpuid also stores MUSICIP DATA and MUSICIP PUID tags. Not sure what MUSICIP DATA is - probably as Erland suggested it is something that they were planning to implement on the MusicDNS server, and not related to MusicIP mixer.

If I run genpuid with the -nopuid option, it still stores the MUSICIP PUID tag.
Similarly -noanalysis doesn't prevent the storage of any tags.

[cpu]

I found that when I use Jaikoz Audio Tagger to retrive AmpliFind ID's I only have MUSICIP PUID stored in tag of FLAC file - no other new tags written.

[bookemdano]

Hi all,

Sorry to bump a fairly old thread but I wanted to see if anyone else has been having problems with genpuid lately. I recently finished re-ripping my entire CD collection to FLAC, and of course I want to get all the MusicIP magic embedded in the tags so I can enjoy SugarCube. Last year I went through this process on my old mp3 library... as I recall it fingerprinted everything and then the (very) few tracks that didn't have corresponding PUIDs it analyzed at the end.

I ran it two nights ago on a 311 album and it finished very quickly. Looking through the tags I see a MUSICIP_PUID tag for every track, so it seemed to work then.

But so far all day yesterday and today when I run it on an album it fingerprints everything and then after it's done with the last fingerprint I see this entry in the log file:

Error communicating with server (2) : -1

And then it starts analysis. After the first track's analysis is done I see the same error message logged again:

Error communicating with server (2) : -1

and then it proceeds to analyze every single track. In the end no tracks contain the MUSICIP_PUID track but they all contain the ANALYSIS, FINGERPRINT, and MUSICIP_DATA tags.

So can any of you MusicIP gurus (hoping there are a few of you still around) tell me does that error message simply mean the MusicIP server is down? Or is it rejecting my DNS key? I've been using the same DNS key since last year and never had a problem with it but after doing some research I see that Gracenote recently bought out MusicIP/Amplifind/MusicDNS/whatever's assets and is shutting the service down. Does anyone know if that's already happened?

I think it's unlikely that it's totally shut down, because as I said I ran genpuid on a single album two nights ago and every track now has a MUSICIP_PUID tag. Which makes me wonder if they've just disabled my DNS key.

Anyone know the hostname or IP of the MusicIP server? Would anyone mind testing genpuid to see if you get the same "Error communicating with server (2): -1" message in the log?

For the record I am using genpuid 1.4 on windows. I tried using the linux and macos binaries first but in both cases genpuid would hang after a certain amount of time in the analyzing stage.

I know I can complete this process even if MusicIP's servers are down--I'm just wanting to see if people can confirm the service is actually down or if it's rejecting my DNS key.

Oh, and one last question, anyone know if there's any rhyme or reason to the order that genpuid processes tracks? In my log files it seems to pick files in the given folder in totally random order. For instance all my tracks start with a two digit track number, so if genpuid was going alphabetically they'd go in numeric order. Instead I am seeing 12, 10, 04, 03, 07, etc. in the logs.

Thanks for any replies.

Edit: OK this is weird... I just now ran genpuid on Aimee Mann's "Bachelor No. 2" album. After fingerprinting all the tracks it proceeded to analyze all but two of them. When I look at the tags, the two tracks it didn't analyze have a MUSICIP_PUID tag, and the rest don't. That is what I would expect (it only analyzes when it did not retrieve a PUID from the fingerprint), but this entire album should have had PUIDs--it's been out for years and while not wildly popular, it should have definitely had PUIDs for all tracks--if not from some other user then from me when I analyzed my mp3 copy of it from last year.

So to me this either means that the PUID database was lost/massively pruned recently, or they are having server/network issues resulting in most of the submitted fingerprints not making it through to the server. Is anyone else seeing similar behavior?

[Nikhil]

I can confirm that I too have been having all sorts of weird issues with MusicIP tagging over the past couple of weeks. I'm using the MusicIP GUI on MacOS (tested it on Windows too, and it had the same problems), it seems to have trouble connecting to the MusicIP (amplifind I guess) servers, and appears to hang indefinitely before proceeding for analysis. It seems to get done if I leave it the whole night. I've been hoping that this is not the end of the road for the service.

[verypsb]

I'm also having troubles with MusicIP. Analyzing takes forever :-(

[cparker]

I was asked about MIP on my website, I *dont* work for MIP so have no insider information on what is going on, but found the following helped to at least fingerprint music, albeit slowly.

Time for someone to dust off libofa I reckon
http://code.google.com/p/musicip-libofa/

*Below is pasted from my forum

There definitely is a problem with the servers. If you run MusicIP its looking for 63.247.65.67 which is music.predixis.com (ports 80 and 10001)

If you put the ip address into a web browser you get like a fingerprint code back :s

What I've managed to do, is to untick the connect to a server settings within the GUI and then also I added a dns entry;

music.predixis.com 127.0.0.1

To drop it to the localhost.

This seems to have done the trick and it is analysing locally now, whereas before it seemed to be hanging all the time

Once analysed dont forget to archive analysis into the track!

Be interesting to see what happens, the servers have been down before and came back and its the weekend, so touchwood