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  1. #11
    Senior Member iPhone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Leigh View Post
    We've been over this so many times. The digital output is completely unaffected by the external power supply (asuming it is supplying the right voltage and current and not injecting a ton of noise). There is no demonstrable/repeatable/provable audible or measurable difference (if anyone has any FACTUAL evidence, I'm all ears). Probably not what you wanted to hear. Ho-hum.



    I'll leave it to others to comment on the analogue output.

    Just because audio folk-lore insists that "improving" the power supply is always a good thing doesn't make it into a fact. Likewise the same folk-lore that insists that "linear" is always better than "switched" - which simply is NOT the case. Both are capable of good or bad results.
    +1

    I think you have hit the nail on the head here. It is a well known fact that on moderate gear with an AC power cord that putting money into the power supply can usually improve the devices audio. This is mainly due to the fact that this equipment is built to a price and improving the PS can sometimes do wonders. Additional most of these devices are powered by an AC cord and have internal power supplies with room inside to make mods. This having been the case for decades with Audiophiles seeing, hearing, and measuring the improvements has caused some to just think that replacing the PS with a supposed better one is always the first step toward Audio Nirvana.

    The Touch has a decent Switching PS and great internal regulation. The Switcher is mainly just acting as the voltage supply as an AC cord would on ones pre-amp.
    iPhone
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  2. #12
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    Cool

    The switching power supply is creating HF noise.
    This noise has not only negative effect on the Touch, but on all other hifi components in the system.
    When for somebody switched ps is enough, than it is finally not my problem

  3. #13
    Bill Burns
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    Linear Power Supplies

    On 10/27/2010 4:30 PM, praganj wrote:
    > The switching power supply is creating HF noise.
    > This noise has not only negative effect on the Touch, but on all other
    > hifi components in the system.


    I'll be interested to see the spectrum analyzer results from your test
    of the power supply in a shielded room.

    --
    Bill

  4. #14

  5. #15
    Bill Burns
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    Linear Power Supplies

    On 10/27/2010 5:30 PM, praganj wrote:
    > No problem:
    >
    > http://pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showp...2&postcount=12
    >
    > The whole thread:
    >
    > http://pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=81910


    Thanks! Now how about the double-blind listening tests?

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    Bill

  6. #16
    Senior Member iPhone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by praganj View Post
    The switching power supply is creating HF noise.
    This noise has not only negative effect on the Touch, but on all other hifi components in the system.
    When for somebody switched ps is enough, than it is finally not my problem
    HELLO, the Touch has two switching power supplies INSIDE its case! What does one outside have anything to do with anything. More importantly just because the wall wart has HF noise doesn't mean its getting back into the Touch audio or other equipment. Anybody with any common sense has the wall wart plugged into the wall or a power strip away from the rest of their equipment and not into the back of an outlet on his/her A/V Receiver.

    This is a non-issue in most cases.
    iPhone
    Media Room:
    ModWright Platinum Signature Transporter, VTL TL-6.5 Signature Pre-Amp, Ayre MX-R Mono's, VeraStarr 6.4SE 6-channel Amp, Vandersteen Speakers: Quatro Wood Mains, VCC-5 Reference Center, four VSM-1 Signatures, Video: Runco RS 900 CineWide AutoScope 2.35:1, Vandersteen V2W Subwoofer

    Living Room:
    Transporter, ADCOM GTP-870HD, Cinepro 3K6SE III Gold, Vandersteen Model 3A Signature, Two 2Wq subs, VCC-2, Two VSM-1

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    Kitchen: Touch in-wall mount w/ Thiel Powerpoint 1.2s
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by iPhone View Post
    HELLO, the Touch has two switching power supplies INSIDE its case! What does one outside have anything to do with anything. More importantly just because the wall wart has HF noise doesn't mean its getting back into the Touch audio or other equipment. Anybody with any common sense has the wall wart plugged into the wall or a power strip away from the rest of their equipment and not into the back of an outlet on his/her A/V Receiver.

    This is a non-issue in most cases.
    This is all theory. The most important is the sound quality. I will not convince you that swiss "Lindt" chocolate taste better than some cheapy from Wallmart, even when the ingredients on the package are the same. You have to eat it, than you know the taste.

    I think everybody should do his own experience not depending on some opinions and theoretical discussions. Musical Fidelity VDac has also two switching ps inside, but a good extern linear ps improve the sound a lot. The same is for SB Classic - it has also (2?) switching chips inside and sounds MUCH better with linear PS.

    The main switching ps has to change 230V AC into 5V DC. It is much harder and different job, than switching inside the box from 5 V DC to +- 5V Volts (maybe it is +-12 V DC, i am not sure).

  8. #18
    Senior Member toby10's Avatar
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    Indeed, listen and compare for yourself.

    But also keep in mind your perceived benefit of improved audio quality using such a ps is every bit as much a theory as is the theory that there is no actual audio quality improvement.

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by toby10 View Post
    Indeed, listen and compare for yourself.

    But also keep in mind your perceived benefit of improved audio quality using such a ps is every bit as much a theory as is the theory that there is no actual audio quality improvement.
    Hate to be a nudge, but there is actually a person who has measured, and the results are here:

    http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpo...77&postcount=3

    Please keep this in mind when someone tells you, as has been repeatedly stated here, that because there are switching power supplies within the various Squeezeboxes, a linear supply _cannot_ make a difference in the measured results. It can. Whether that makes an audible diffence, of course, is a different question, and Pat does not venture an opinion.

    Also keep in mind that some of the folks that make statements of "scientific" certainty are in fact about as scientific as the early Popes, and are determined not to let a few facts get in the way of their opinions.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Phil Leigh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tubesguy View Post
    Hate to be a nudge, but there is actually a person who has measured, and the results are here:

    http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpo...77&postcount=3

    Please keep this in mind when someone tells you, as has been repeatedly stated here, that because there are switching power supplies within the various Squeezeboxes, a linear supply _cannot_ make a difference in the measured results. It can. Whether that makes an audible diffence, of course, is a different question, and Pat does not venture an opinion.

    Also keep in mind that some of the folks that make statements of "scientific" certainty are in fact about as scientific as the early Popes, and are determined not to let a few facts get in the way of their opinions.
    Pat was measuring the older (original - pretty bad) style switcher not the current one. Also, he was measuring the analogue output...
    You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto a CD/vinyl...it ain't what you'd call minimal...
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