Transporter quality Stereo into a Home Theater Setup

[guptaas]

The dream would be a single server application streaming FLAC's, ripped DVD's and ripped Blu-Ray's to the network and our iPhones (music only). The hardware dream would be a single box which can play all that off network and do alternate duty between stereo and home-theater serving superb front speakers and movie-grade surround speakers.
The reality seems to be - an integrated home theater receiver fed by a duet and a networked Blu-Ray player. But before I do that I want to get an idea of what it would take to incorporate an almost-Transporter-level stereo quality into a home theater setup.
Many devices promise to play various media files but need a separate streaming application besides the two I already use - Squeezebox server and Simplify Music for streaming to our phones. The navigation is not at all elegant. A duet is far better.
If this takes me into separates, then I assume the DAC in a Transporter becomes redundant and I could just use a duet.
My PC sound setup (in signature) is extremely satisfying but the home theater location is more suited to listening with others. I suppose everyone here has addressed this issue in some way. Any pointers to simplify will be very helpful.

[Andy8421]

I had a similar need and reached a similar conclusion. Ended up with Krell showcase processor driving Krell showcase amps into Martin Logan ESLs. PS3 used as a bluray player. For critical / stereo listening, I drive the showcase processor from a transporter and use the front two MLs plus Revel sub. Bit of a waste to use the transporter as a digital source (I use the room correction capabilities of the Krell), but I wanted as clean and low jitter a source as I could get. I tried both a duet and SB3 in place of the transporter and managed to convince myself that the transporter was better, but if it was, it wasn't by much.

Krell don't make the showcase anymore, but sell a processor plus amp package with similar functionality (for more money). I chose the showcase on sound quality, balanced connections throughout (the amps are located remotely from the processor and I wanted this run to be balanced) and the ability to drive the Logans which have a reputation as a tricky load.

Thinking about using either an HTPC or a HDX1080 as a network video streamer. In principle this would make the PS3 and the transporter redundant. Not done anything yet about it.


Should have added that I am trying to get squeezemobile to work. Streams to an iPod / Phone directly from SC. At 2.99 on the app store it would be a steal if it worked. At least on the forum no one seems to have got it to work reliably. Might be best to wait until Pippin gets this functionality to work in iPeng.

techadvantagenow.com/v1/products/SqueezeMobile.aspx

Andy,

[guptaas]

Thanks for the response. Waiting for a few more to see what compromise most people make between clutter and quality in a living room which is used heavily for movie watching as well. An amp, DVR, Mini-ITX PC, a DVD player and a center speaker on top of my TV seem to be a lot. But maybe just one more box!

[agillis]

My recommendation would be a VortexBox appliance as a server and a low power PC running XBMC, connected to your TV, as a player. VortexBox supports Simplify Media out of the box so streaming to your iPods is no problem. XBMC plays ripped Blue ray movies very well and has a great user interface. It interfaces well with VortexBox for movie storage.

[guptaas]

An HTPC is the most flexible option of course and I'll probably try it anyway. It does bring us back to the music quality issue though. For films the S/PDIF or HDMI from the PC will be sufficient. That is not, however, ideal for stereo music. My basic question still is about combining music with movies. I wouldn't waste high end speakers and a Transporter on a setup where something else in the chain is a limitation.

[iPhone]

An HTPC is the most flexible option of course and I'll probably try it anyway. It does bring us back to the music quality issue though. For films the S/PDIF or HDMI from the PC will be sufficient. That is not, however, ideal for stereo music. My basic question still is about combining music with movies. I wouldn't waste high end speakers and a Transporter on a setup where something else in the chain is a limitation.

Why is S/PDIF not good for Stereo listening? If one has the proper DAC it can be perfect for listening to stereo.

I think I have a fairly good HT setup with an even better Stereo setup. Transporter and HT can live well together. Does you Pre-amp have HT passthrough?

To me the real key is making a decision. Does one want great stereo, or great HT, or both? It is fairly easy to have great stereo and fairly easy to have great HT, the problem seems to come into play in trying to do both with shared equipment in my opinion. So if its both, I feel one has to work harder and pick proper components. This is usually a little more expensive, the end results are much better in my opinion. By not making the decision to pay more for the components to have both be great, one ends up compromising one or the other and sometimes both.

Also the Vortexbox solution is a good solution to put both music and movies on a media server.

So yes, one might have to spend some money, but it is fairly easily accomplished. This is not for the person that believes HTIAB is media room Home Theater.

[guptaas]

I thought network streaming was the ideal way to stay jitter free. If S/PDIF out of a PC is good enough then what is the advantage of a Transporter over any other equivalent DAC?

[earwaxer]

My take on the difference between data over a network protocol vs. data streaming over USB or S/PDIF is that over a network the data is delivered in packets, with various transfer verification procedures for bit perfect transfer without being dependent on clock synch between the source and the receiver.

In S/PDIF and USB you are dependent on the clock synch between the source and the receiver (hence jitter errors), and bit perfect transfer is not insured (no handshaking).

I have not heard a good argument for why a streaming protocol is inherently higher fidelity than a network protocol. It is usually the opposite.

[iPhone]

I thought network streaming was the ideal way to stay jitter free. If S/PDIF out of a PC is good enough then what is the advantage of a Transporter over any other equivalent DAC?

Sorry I wasn't clear and also didn't follow what you meant when you were knocking S/PDIF.

To be clear, what is wrong with using the S/PDIF output on a Squeezebox for feeding a high quality DAC to produce great stereo listening inside of a HT system (assuming one has a decent room and decent main speakers). I personally am not a big fan of PC audio. I don't consider digital files stored on a drive and processed by a server to be feed to a NMP as PC audio because the analog or digital stage being used as the source is not in or part of the PC.

Also knowing your setup now or what your trying to achieve with what components would really help this discussion.

I use a Transporter for my main music listening. It is in the rack with the rest of my HT equipment. I use a pre-amp with HT pass-through so whether I listen to stereo or HT my main speakers are part of the system using the same amps without degrading the Stereo only listening capability of the semi-combined system.

So for me S/PDIF is "not good enough" out of a PC for me. The PC is just the server to handle the digital files stored on the PC that are to be sent to the Transporter. I like the TP DAC and use the Balanced XLR outs to my pre-amp. But the S/PDIF out of the TP or an SB3 into my Dodson DA-217 MK2-D Digital Processor sounds pretty awesome. So what I am saying is the TP has it all over S/PDIF from a PC card and Squeezebox S/PDIF feeding a good DAC is also better then PC card S/PDIF feeding the same DAC in my opinion. Again just my opinion, but if the PC S/PDIF is in a Windows machine that makes things worse. YMMV.

[guptaas]

If I understood everything correctly, I need the Transporter mainly for its DAC. If the processor has a quality DAC, I can go with a Squeezebox or another media-streamer which I need anyway for video off network. Thank you for pointing out Vortexbox 'Agillis'! And 'Earwaxer' I did mean that transferring a file over TCP/IP to a Squeezebox is likely superior to S/PDIF or even USB out of a PC.
Re setup: As part of a move to Blu-Ray, I have the opportunity to upgrade everything. Wanted to see what knowledgeable people had done to get decent stereo alongside multi-channel audio. Until now I kept music and movies apart so never faced the question. I'd likely go with another pair of Salk speakers - Veracity HT2-TL's or Song Towers(http://www.salksound.com) for the Main channels and they will build me a matching Center speaker. Jim Salk, the owner, suggested that I first try my existing on-wall Polk's for surround with that before ordering new surrounds. An amplifier delivering 200-250 watts into 4 Ohms will be fine for these speakers. Will keep my existing Polk PS-350 sub for movies but may look at a more "musical" sub later. The TL's go down to 32HZ and I haven't felt the need for a sub with them in my PC location. I'd like to be able to stack everything as compactly as possible so low heat is a desirable. A stereo example - http://www.psaudio.com/ps/products/d...ower-amplifier I can even place books on top of it!