Rip, Store and Serve - Part Two - The Ripping Chronicles

[Timbo]

Well folks I am not sure I even want to write this, because there is no answer and in the end we can’t make these software companies sort out their code can we…but this has so frustrated me over the last few days that I suppose I just want to get it off my chest :-)

In a previous post I intimated I was replacing both my desktop PC and getting a Tranquil Windows Home Server as well - for all my media files. On all the time, available for my SqueezeBox all the time, low power, quiet - has to be the way to go.

Well so far so good - Windows Home Server all up and running, SqueezeCenter installed, SqueezeBox happy and streaming away gloriously. Have to say SqueezeCenter web browser interface still far too slow, even on my new fast desktop - network is wired so perhaps that’s just browser technology?

Anyway, obviously on the new PC there is now a lack of my old ripping ensemble of EAC, iTunesEncode, iTunes et al, so it’s time to install all that lot - or - maybe I could find a simpler, more integrated and more automatic way to rip, tag and store my next lot of audio files.

Well the short answer is of course no - the long answer is…

…first of all in my other thread someone mentioned Ripstation Micro, and after downloading and playing with the DS (for the Linn DS) version I was much impressed. So I tried:

Ripstation Micro > FLAC > copy to Music folder on Windows Home Server

Wow! No twenty page set-up procedure, and the software specs say it knows what it is doing (and it should as it is the baby version of software RipFactory supply to commercial ripping industry). File formats supported? Well obviously nothing faintly Apple but MP3, WMA and FLAC are there. So I thought I would try this FLAC everyone here loves so much (we won’t mention the thread I posted saying I could hear the difference between FLAC and WAVE on my SqueezeBox because that is all sorted now and not anything to do with lovely FLAC itself :-) So I press the big red button on Ripstation Micro (yep that’s pretty much all you have to do) confirmed I wanted to start a new batch ripping to FLAC and off it went, fast, CD ejected and another asked for, again off it went - just tried 4 CD’s to see. Artwork found, tags inserted (enough tags for me anyway) and files made. Then you press another button and it copies entire batch to your music library (best not to rip straight to a network drive anyway - especially one with Windows Home Server - see corruption bug reports all over the net!). Went and fired up SqueezeCenter and pointed it to the new files in the folder, then checked and they were all present and correct in the database as well, artwork on display and tags in place. And just to confirm - FLAC sounds great (when streamed as WAV) so happy bunny here - until…

Now of course I would like to play the same library of music on new desktop PC - sorry, no go I am afraid - iTunes and FLAC, well, they really are not speaking and won’t anytime soon. There are patches, but tried ‘em, they don’t work or half work. I downloaded Foobar, DBPoweramp and one or two others that could play FLAC on my PC for me, then uninstalled them immediately (will say no more).

So I tried Vista Media Center next - OK no coverflow, but big wall of cover art and at least I can see the screen sat in bed operating from my wireless keyboard :-) sadly it too doesn’t like FLAC - but it can be told how nice FLAC is and will play it then. Great. Except only the first track of an album displays cover art - the rest just show that damn placeholder. Searching the forums this bug (nothing to do with FLAC, does it for all file types, and replaces your nice 500 x 500 folder art with crappy little 200 x 200 highly compressed jpegs when it does bother to display it!) has been listed more than a year - so MS are not about to tackle this anytime soon. So won’t be using Vista WMC then (apparently WMC 2005 is fine, uses the folder art!).

So I love Ripstation Micro, but no iTunes integration because iTunes is pissy about FLAC, no other player comes close, so no FLAC - no Ripstation Micro - next…


iTunes > Apple Lossless into iTunes music folder on Windows Home Server

Ripping Apple Lossless is what all my friends do - because of course mere mortals would never be bothered to go through what we go through to get our music on computer - and it sounds great, may not be secure rips but my albums are immaculate so lets see what happens. CD in drive, rip done in record time, added to iTunes library of course and artwork all in place - great. Plays great on PC, now to try SqueezeCenter and my SqueezeBox - seems it can see the file, play the file and it sounds great (streamed as WAV decoded with ALAC) - but - no cover art. After more forum searching it seems iTunes artwork storage is a law unto itself and SqueezeCenter can’t see it - of course, of bl@@dy course - what else would I expect!

Now before you say, have you tried the iTunes plug-in integration as that might sort out the cover art problem, I have and it doesn’t. So the reason I always had art with iTunes integration before, is because I always manually used AlbumArt Aggregator to get it and put it in the folder with the album.

So back to square one…if I am going to have to launch another app to grab album artwork, I might as well go back to using EAC to rip, iTunesEncode to send to iTunes and then AlbumArt Aggregator to tidy up.

This is not big, this is not clever, this is techno confusion - when will these people talk to one another? Apple, what are you thinking of, even record labels put out songs on FLAC! And why store your artwork in hundreds and hundreds of index files when one small jpeg in the album folder is far faster and more logical! Microsoft, how can you pretend to offer a media server, when it displays artwork at 200 x 200 on a plasma 50” screen…pathetic!

Do you just get the idea there are some powerful people behind this obfuscation - I mean maybe it was Sony and Warner who assassinated Kennedy - perhaps he wanted to tape an album or something….!!

Timbo.

[bigfool1956]

Try using dBpoweramp to rip direct to ALAC, and then import the album into iTunes. This is what I do, and you get all the cover art for each song imbedded.

[Dougal]

Mmm.. wasn't life simple when there was only mp3, the only plays for sure codec :-)
Doug.

[smc2911]

Can you live with two copies of your music library? I have everything ripped to FLAC for archive and Squeezebox use and a "mirror" copy (i.e. same directory structure) with mp3s that I use in iTunes/iPod. There are a number of ways to achieve this. Some people have their ripping configured to create both initially (e.g. using EAC/Mareo) and maybe the Ripstation can do this. Personally, I rip to FLAC and then use foobar2000 to do bulk conversions to mp3. You could, of course, choose a format other than mp3 for this approach, but it suits my needs.

[Timbo]

Try using dBpoweramp to rip direct to ALAC, and then import the album into iTunes. This is what I do, and you get all the cover art for each song imbedded.

Hi there - did think of dbpoweramp as player and didn't fancy the interface but didn't think of it for the ripping end of things, that sounds interesting - does SqueezeCenter see the album art embedded, sorry of course it will as it's dbpoweramp doing it rather than iTunes...right will play and report back :-)

If Ripstation Micro could encode ALAC and then register it with iTunes automatically (like iTunesEncode) that would be a one stop rip shop :-)

[Ripfactory]

Hi there - did think of dbpoweramp as player and didn't fancy the interface but didn't think of it for the ripping end of things, that sounds interesting - does SqueezeCenter see the album art embedded, sorry of course it will as it's dbpoweramp doing it rather than iTunes...right will play and report back :-)

If Ripstation Micro could encode ALAC and then register it with iTunes automatically (like iTunesEncode) that would be a one stop rip shop :-)

Timbo

Can't make all your wishes come true, but.....

as a commercial house, we cannot rip directly to ALAC for licensing reasons - we do not want to use the hacked codecs out there for those reasons. But, we can offer an approach:

Rip in Micro - this will create an interim wav file
Run our Iencode ( a few $$, but hey we have to make it somewhere) This runs via the itunes com.
Job done - Iencode ships with a small windows service that watches a folder and auto adds that live to itunes library.

You get Alac, cover art , metadata via GD3 added to itunes. one extra step and you'd be done.

We should also be pushing Mr Jobs to include flac support....

[Timbo]

Timbo

Can't make all your wishes come true, but.....

as a commercial house, we cannot rip directly to ALAC for licensing reasons - we do not want to use the hacked codecs out there for those reasons. But, we can offer an approach:

Rip in Micro - this will create an interim wav file
Run our Iencode ( a few $$, but hey we have to make it somewhere) This runs via the itunes com.
Job done - Iencode ships with a small windows service that watches a folder and auto adds that live to itunes library.

You get Alac, cover art , metadata via GD3 added to itunes. one extra step and you'd be done.

We should also be pushing Mr Jobs to include flac support....

Hi Patrick (hope it is Patrick) - I have emailed you separately from home email address re: Ripstation Micro and lots of ideas (although I have lost your reply which is a first and annoying - if you can find an email you sent to timiambeing then would appreciated it again - especially re ripping service ideas!) Anyway I am now happily using Ripstation Micro to rip into WMA lossless (to get the built-in tags iTunes can import - is that ok?) then when I have a reasonable batch I just ask iTunes to add the folder (it is set for apple lossless import) and Bob is your proverbial fathers brother :-)

I will now peruse your site once again for the iEncode bit...I can feel a one stop solution coming on - thanks :-)

Timbo.

[Louis_Kleiman]

I just got my Duet and was very pleased with the ease with which I have integrated my PC and Squeeze libraries. Here's what I did:

Windows 2003 Server always on and running SqueezeCenter 7
PC's running Vista and XP
(please pardon my I-have-given-in-to-the-dark-side setup)

I rip directly to a network drive using Windows Media Player in WMA lossless. I get album art, tags, et al. If I don't automatically get album art, I just find it on the web, save the image to a file, and drag the image file into the Windows Media Player place holder for that album.

I have pointed SqueezeCenter at the same folder I use for the PC player library in the prior step. So, I tell SqueezeCenter to rescan and 30 seconds later, all the new music I have ripped is available to my Duet. Album art and all.

I guess I just picked the right combination of tools, but this was very smooth for me.

[Kim.T]

Regards iTunes coverart.
iTunes stores the coverart in a seperat directory - not embeded in each file. SqueezeCenter can not read this directory.
You have to extract the coverart an save it as folder.jpg in each folder.
You can use the program iArt for this - but you have to run the program each time you add a new album to iTunes (or manuallly create the folder.jpg file)
I'm doing this because I don't want coverart embeded in each file.

[tedf]

Now of course I would like to play the same library of music on new desktop PC - sorry, no go I am afraid - iTunes and FLAC, well, they really are not speaking and won’t anytime soon. There are patches, but tried ‘em, they don’t work or half work. I downloaded Foobar, DBPoweramp and one or two others that could play FLAC on my PC for me, then uninstalled them immediately (will say no more).

I've been trying Winamp and liking it in virtually the same setting you were exploring. It plays well with FLAC. It's better than SqueezeCenter for exploring ShoutCAST is you are interested in finding good radio feeds for your Squeezebox/Duet: you can sort on feed quality and focus on channels that are 128kpbs, then set find them again on SqueezeCenter's inferior interface. I am not very familiar with iTunes so I may be blind as to why you found Foobar, DBPoweramp and one or two others deficient. I don't have an iPod or Mac computer so I am not predisposed to an iTunes solution. However, I will follow this and other threads for awhile longer before starting to rip hundreds of CDs. I'm still at the stage of wanting to find the best compromise for workflow before undertaking what I hope will be a one-time task. Ripstation Micro is twice as fast as EAC which I started with, and I am not aware of any deficiencies. (I think I don't care if album cover art is embedded as opposed to a folder.jpg in the album folder.) Although I am not impressed with the UI, MP3Tag seems to be an OK tool for cleaning up. Ripfactory's intense attention to the Squeeze forums is appreciated. I think it's chart comparing Ripstation Micro is misleading, however, in its characterization of EAC. I'd really like to see somebody who knows their FLAC from their flac jacket, compare the two programs. For sure, Ripstation Micro is way way faster and much more user friendly, big points in its favor ... but there is a drawback that I haven't seen (or heard!) yet.