Apple Lossless vs Flac - on a Mac

[creativepart]

I've done some searching of the forum and not found complete and recent answers to this question.

I'm planning my music library and I've purchased a Mac Mini, a big HD and SB3 which will all be delivered tomorrow. I'm in the planning stage to convert my 800 or so CDs to HD file versions. I don't think I want WAV files, so I had planned on using iTunes and Apple Lossless files. Easy, complete, high quality and the only downside is that it is iTunes specific.

Everyone on the PC side wants FLAC files which seem to be almost the same as ALAC only without the iTunes.

It seems that you can add the Lame encoder to iTunes and make FLAC files on iTunes but it looks like a hack job that may not hold up. I read that the new version of iTunes broke iTunes_Lame. Folks think it will be fixed pretty quickly.

I don't want to burn my CDs multiple times. So, what do you Mac guys think? Is being tied to iTunes on a Mac that bad a thing? Will I probably be able to move away from iTunes if I wish in the future by some new program to convert ALAC to FLAC?

Should I not worry about it and just start ripping CDs in my new Mac Mini? (reminds me of Dr Strangelove (or How I learned to stop worrying and love the iTunes))

Thanks for the help.
Paul Green
PS Making all this 10 times more difficult is that I'm a PC guy with 22 years of PC experience and this is my first MAC experience. Gulp!

[bobschneider]

I use Max to burn my CDs to FLAC on my Macbook. Works great, and it's freeware.

FLAC and Apple Lossless should sound the same, since they're both lossless formats. I've gone with FLAC for several reasons. The most immediate is that I store my FLAC files and run Slimserver on an NAS server, and the version of Slimserver that works on my NAS can handle FLAC but not Apple Lossless. (Slimserver can handle Apple Lossless if you run it on a Mac that has iTunes installed, so if you're going to run the server on a Mac Mini and never switch over to a free standing server that won't be an issue for you.) I'm also more comfortable keeping my music files (over 200GB and still growing - it's taken months to get these copied!) in an open source, non-DRM format. Finally, I have my iPod files in the Apple format (but compressed), and using FLAC for the Squeezebox makes it simple to keep the two libraries separate.

[creativepart]

Thanks Bob, that helps explain some.

I'm curious, does iTunes put DRM around ALAC files that were burned from my CDs? If it does, then will it be impossible to change ALAC files into something else in the future?

Also, does Max (which I just heard of early today) apply all the usual tags, album art, and info from a CD database?

What do you use to organize your music library on your Mac? Or does the NAS have something built into it for this?

Thanks
Paul Green

[bobschneider]

Thanks Bob, that helps explain some.

I'm curious, does iTunes put DRM around ALAC files that were burned from my CDs? If it does, then will it be impossible to change ALAC files into something else in the future?

Also, does Max (which I just heard of early today) apply all the usual tags, album art, and info from a CD database?

What do you use to organize your music library on your Mac? Or does the NAS have something built into it for this?

Thanks
Paul Green

I don't think iTunes adds DRM to CDs you burn yourself, but I don't know that for sure.

Max downloads album, artist and track info from a database. I've had to input Genre and composer (for classical) info manually. It'll download album art from Amazon, although you have to ask it to each time.

I access Slimserver on my NAS using the web browser front end - this works with Safari, Firefox, etc. That's how I control Slimserver - basically the same as you control it if it's running on your computer. The NAS shows up as another drive on my Mac, and I can organize the files on it the same as if it were a directory on my local drive. I usually just let Max organize the music folder for me - it sets up a directory for each artist, and subdirectories for each album, automatically. But it's easy to tweak if I need to fix something, like, say, combining "Bob Dylan" and "Dylan, Bob" into a single directory.

[Patrick Dixon]

It seems that you can add the Lame encoder to iTunes and make FLAC files on iTunes but it looks like a hack job that may not hold up. I read that the new version of iTunes broke iTunes_Lame. Folks think it will be fixed pretty quickly.

Lame is an MP3 codec, so if you use Lame you'll be getting lossy compression, which I don't think is what you want.

[Patrick Dixon]

I'm curious, does iTunes put DRM around ALAC files that were burned from my CDs? If it does, then will it be impossible to change ALAC files into something else in the future?

AFAIK, DRM is only on music that you purchase and download from the Apple store (and some other download retailers). You should be able to convert ALAC to WAV, and from there to FLAC or any other format you wish.

[creativepart]

Thanks for the info. This helps clear some things up. I've been reading up on this stuff for only a couple of weeks. So, it can get confusing.

I haven't even received the Mac Mini yet (everything is delivered tomorrow) but I want to soak in as much info as I can get before I get too deep in the process of ripping. I don't want to spend hours ripping my CDs into a deadend solution. If that can be avoided -- who knows maybe it cant. FLAK could be a deadend solution, for all I know.

I do know that in most things, you learn a great deal in the beginning of a new process and decisions that are made up front are often made in ignorance of the real world situation.

Of course, I've used iTunes on my PCs and ripped CDs to ALAC using iTunes, but that was all for use on my Ipod not to play music from my computer.

I know that I could use one of my old PCs or laptops and just hang an external drive off the thing and do the easy and comfortable method, but I really wanted to have some Mac experience. And, folks say that the Mac is ideally suited for this application. We'll see if that's just the usual Mac bravado or not.

I appreciate the answers and the help. I'm sure its not the last time I'll be asking.

Paul Green

[khedspeth]

Just more experiences...

I use iTunes and ALAC to organize my music library. My collection is made up of ripped CD while my kids buy alot of stuff from iTunes. They listen to their music on their ipods or using my newly acquire apple tv that runs into our home theater setup. I listen to mine using my two channel system and a SB3. I get what I need from a lossless experience and they get what they need from a lossy standpoint. I rip my CD's on a mac mini and haven't had any issues.

[Patrick Dixon]

I do know that in most things, you learn a great deal in the beginning of a new process and decisions that are made up front are often made in ignorance of the real world situation.

The most importance decision is to rip to a lossless format. Any lossless format can be converted to any other format (lossless or otherwise) at a later date.

IMO the other importance thing is to use a ripping program which will give you bit perfect copies, or let you know if not - and that's where I would have a doubt over iTunes.

The third important thing is to keep your files in separate directories for each disk or album, and organise them is a consistent way - /Artist/Album/Tracks is a common one. You should also ensure that each 'rip' is tagged with at least the Artist, Album and track numbers and names. It's relatively easy to add and edit tags at a later date, but the more you get right to start with the easier it is, and you need to make sure you know at least what everything is and what it goes with!

[creativepart]

The most importance decision is to rip to a lossless format. Any lossless format can be converted to any other format (lossless or otherwise) at a later date.

IMO the other importance thing is to use a ripping program which will give you bit perfect copies, or let you know if not - and that's where I would have a doubt over iTunes.

OK. I know that iTunes does a lossless rip and I know that it properly tags and organizes my albums, songs and library. Is it bit perfect? That's the question.

It's not EAC, I know that. But I've had some not so pleasant surprises from EAC due to it's complexity. It's easy to make a mistake.

I think the assumption with ALAC is that it is "bit perfect", is it not? What's the consensus on that?