Why doesn't Slim Devices create an audiophile version?

[mauidan]

And....???

And what?

PS- how does someone become a "senior member?"

[funkstar]

And what?

i guess radish is asking what your friends experience is with the cambridge, and why he didn't like the SB.

PS- how does someone become a "senior member?"

Post count. The more you have, the more you can do on the boards generally (i don't know the rules on here, but on others you need 500 for an avatar and various other things)

[CardinalFang]

Interesting. Spoke to a friend today who's a computer specialist, and he sent back the SB3 and ordered the cambridge.

There does seem to be duplication in the Cambridge product - it has only 160G, which for anyone with a decent library is too small for lossless. It does say that it can then stream off PCs, so why put the disk on the device? I suppose for those people who don't have that many CDs and want a single box solution, but why not make the disk an option?

The SB3 to me is closest thing right now to the audiophile dream, it does one job and does it well. I appreciate fully that it is built to be the best possible for a fixed budget and it does a cracking job of it, but being able to spend more to get more would be nice. I have a old Micromega CD player that had replaceable electronics, so that you could buy uprated circuitry to improve the sound. That would be great for the SB.

Better still, how about a SB3 transport, no DAC, but uprated PSU and internal wiring and components in a discrete metal case? Having a seperate DAC is common enough amongst audiophiles to make that desireable I would have thought. As to there not being enough potential customers to make it worthwhile, well how do high end valve amp companies survive with amps at $20K plus?

[ezkcdude]

how do high end valve amp companies survive with amps at $20K plus?

Is that a rhetorical question? Surely, SD aims higher than to be a niche audiophile manufacturer like Jolida or Audio Research. SD is part of, if not leading, nothing short of an audiophile revolution here. No more CD players. Transports are dead as we know them (unless you still listen to vinyl). I for one thank my luck stars I never plopped down several grand on any of the now-obsolete transports out there. For a few hundred dollars, the SB3 is better than any Class A Stereophile digital source component. I think it's only a matter of time, months, perhaps, before publications add recommendations for "Digital Media Servers (Gateways?)" like the SB3. SD should focus on the digital serving, not the processing. Let audio companies with decades of experience, like Meridian and Theta Digital, continue to improves DACs. I bet we will see those companies (and the likes of Benchmark, Bel Canto, etc) reduce the price of their DAC's as that particular component becomes more critical again. For the last decade or so there was a move back to integrated CD players, now with the advent of products like the SB3, there is a renewed interest in separate digital processors. That will drive the price of very good DACs down to a level that most of us who care about such things can afford. If Slim Devices tries to make the SqueezeBox all things to everyone, it will become bogged down and bloated with "features". I for one hope that doesn't happen.

[MarkZ]

Well, from my research on digital amplifiers, it seems like the future is something more like SB feeding a digital signal into a "pure digital amplifier." So this will complete the "all-digital" chain. The only analog stage will be at the final output stage feeding the speaker. Independent DACs will largely disappear from the picture.

Of course, someone might even invent a "digital speaker system". [half laugh -- I have ideas in this regard.]

[mauidan]

[QUOTE=ezkcdude] the SB3 is better than any Class A Stereophile digital source component. QUOTE]

What Class A Stereophile or any other hiend Digital Source have you compared the SB3 to in your system(please list)?

Sterophile's 2005 Digital Source and Product of the Year is the
Ayre C-5xe, it can play Redbook CDs, 24/192 & 24/96 DVD-As and
SACDs.

[MarkZ]

[QUOTE=mauidan]

the SB3 is better than any Class A Stereophile digital source component. QUOTE]

What Class A Stereophile or any other hi-end Digital Source have you compared the SB3 to in your system(please list)?

Sterophile's 2005 Digital Source and Product of the Year is the
Ayre C-5xe, it can play Redbook CDs, 24/192 & 24/96 DVD-As and
SACDs.

Well, I am late in the discussion, but comparing the SB3 with the Ayre is like comparing apples and oranges.

The SB3 takes audio files (which would be ripped from audio CD's, for example) and provides a convenient output in both analog and digital (S/PDIF output.) The power of the SB3, then, is that it is a convenient interface between one's computer and audio system.

Interestingly, at least with audio CD's, using applications such as Exact Audio Copy (EAC), one can get a *perfect* (or almost perfect) rip (unless the CD is in bad shape.) Thus the hardware issue of imperfect reading of the bits is solved. A cheap $200 Plextor drive on one's computer can get a perfect rip into a perfect wave file. Thus, when fed into the DAC using S/PDIF, what is input is *perfect*. Hopefully this makes sense as to why the SB3 is exciting technology, at least for audio CDs.

[Mike Anderson]

Interestingly, at least with audio CD's, using applications such as Exact Audio Copy (EAC), one can get a *perfect* (or almost perfect) rip (unless the CD is in bad shape.) Thus the hardware issue of imperfect reading of the bits is solved. A cheap $200 Plextor drive on one's computer can get a perfect rip into a perfect wave file. Thus, when fed into the DAC using S/PDIF, what is input is *perfect*. Hopefully this makes sense as to why the SB3 is exciting technology, at least for audio CDs.

I agree mostly - except that the Squeezebox is, from a purely technical standpoint, a non-negligible source of jitter. Whether your average Joe can tell the difference compared to a $100 CD-plyaer is another issue - but it is at least measureable.

In any case, it sounds damned well good enough for me, at the moment anyway!

[CardinalFang]

Is that a rhetorical question?

Not really, it's a common comment I have seen to the question of an audiophile SB - is there a market big enough for it?

There are and will be more players in this space (and some big ones coming - Apple), so, being selfish, I would like to see SD evolve to the high end as it suits its current dedicated audience more. Quite a few users are already migrating up to modded versions, including me, and to be honest I don't need the DAC part of the SB, just the decoder, interface and radio parts.

The underlying question is one of economics, is it worth SD's while to produce a transport with new power supply (go on, I know SD isn't convinced about this, but it does make a difference :-)) and no DAC/Analogue out, just digital?

Or how about a stripped down SB3, with no DAC, just digital out? How cheap would that be to do, is it a case of just not populating those parts of the board and not testing them either in the QA stage?

[CardinalFang]

Of course, someone might even invent a "digital speaker system". [half laugh -- I have ideas in this regard.]

I saw one some years ago in a magazine based on a massive array of electronically controlled pistons in concentric circles. By moving the pistons in an out under computer control you can create the required pressure waves - i.e the shape and size of the pressure wave is controlled by the requisite 1's and 0's. Way too complicated to be mass produced, but perhaps engineering has moved on and you could manufacture the arrays more cheaply and reliably. I suppose you could also use controlled valves and tuned pressure jets, but it all gets a bit too much to manufacture.

Of course you may have other ideas for doing this, but digital speakers have been tried.