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  1. #1
    Senior Member pablolie's Avatar
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    Our Music Listening... in 10 years.

    Got into a good discussion and fellow music lover over a bottle of Pinot Noir last night, and we talked about how our music listening experiences had changed... and what might happen down the road...

    Personally - the biggest change to my music listening *ever* was due to the SB product line a bit over 11 or 12 years ago. I went from CD jockey to exclusively listening to digitized music within the time it took me to rip my extensive CD library (it took 2 years, with some mistakes along the way due to wrong assumptions). Initially, I thought I'd use the SB for convenience, but that for my more in-depth listening CDs were irreplaceable because I imagined they'd "sound better"... don't ask me why, old habits are initially hard to break.

    Looking forward... I imagine a few things may change the way I listen to music...

    (1) Room correction. I have experimented with it. Not yet sold on existing solutions. Call me old fashioned. Maybe I lucked out with my current room. But I am sure it'll get there and make a huge difference.

    (2) Music library... main location on one's mobile device. It's kinda striking to see that storage capacity on mobile device has kinda plateau'd around the "magic" 32, 64 and 128 GB options for a few years... probably with the prevalence of 4k video the need for more will finally force mobile device designers to up the ante, and *that* is when people like some of us *could* possibly consider migrating our entire music collection (mine is around 480GB). I know, I know... "But Pablo, your entire collection will reside in the cloud! Companies are migrating to cloud strategies, so it should be good enough for you!". Well, companies have multi-layered storage strategies that make sure a cloud accident can't obliterate their data, and I haven't seen those make it to consumer level media storage yet. Is it a business niche someone should exploit? Probably a disappearing niche. Those of us with music libraries are probably a species in the process of extinction. 99.999% of people will never discover a music universe outside of Spotify.

    (3) Audio quality breakthrough with UltraHD, 16x times CD quality bla bla: In 10 years I'll still have 2 ears that will still have been shaped by a few million years of human evolution, and I doubt they'll get any better. Naw. But I betcha the usual suspects will try to sell us the stuff. :-D

    (4) Improvements in electronics and loudspeaker design: Marginal and diminishing returns, as it has been for many years. Same for more exotic material (Shazanium-coated ultra-audial tweeters etc).

    (5) A better UI for music apps. Please.
    ...pablo
    Server: Virtual Machine (on VMware Workstation 12) running Ubuntu 16.04 + LMS 7.9
    System: SB Touch -optical-> Benchmark DAC2HGC -AnalysisPlus Oval Copper XLR-> NAD M22 Power Amp -AnalysisPlus Black Mesh Oval-> Totem Element Fire
    Other Rooms: 2x SB Boom; 1x SB Radio; 1x SB Classic-> NAD D7050 -> Totem DreamCatcher + Velodyne Minivee Sub
    Computer audio: workstation -USB-> audioengine D1 -> Grado PS500e/Shure 1540

  2. #2
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    Interesting topic. Hard to see the future, but I don't see things changing much for me.

    1. I've tried digital room correction and it didn't really change things much or really seem worth the effort. Maybe I'm like you and am fairly lucky to already have decent acoustics.

    2. Music library -- I like streaming for background music, but for whatever reason, when I'm listening seriously, I use my own collection. I only listen seriously when I'm at home. I only ever listen casually when I'm in the car or out and about. I'm sure streaming to phones and car systems will continue to improve, but doubt that there is any revolution waiting for me in that. Plus, I have a basic distrust of streaming and leaving others responsible for my collection. As a long time Netflix user, I can't tell you how many movies and shows that I like have disappeared due to copyright and contract negotiation issues. They are simply unreliable in that regard and I don't see that ever really changing as long as royalties drive the commercial music world.

    3. I see no looming change in audio quality. The driving factor there has always been fad and fashion in the recording industry. That has always far outweighed the potential of the medium, IMO.

    4. I'm sure speakers will continue to improve, but the ones I have right now are great for my listening. And, if the currently available industry products are any indication, pomp and pretense will continue to be more important than actual sound quality.

    5. I'm pretty happy with my Squeezebox and tablet interface. I easily find the music I like when I want something. I can see interfaces getting prettier, and the background maintenance a bit more idiot-proof with time, but I'm pretty happy right now.

  3. #3
    Senior Member ralphpnj's Avatar
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    My two cents:

    Room correction and DSP along with "one box" powered speakers will slowly become the norm.

    Internet based music streaming will soon become the disaster that internet based video streaming has become. The simple reason for this is that all the big content providers HATE streaming and are actively doing their best to destroy streaming. See mlsstl's comments about Netflix below. Therefore I will continue to maintain my own personal music library. Thanks to apps like iPeng, along with remote streaming, I can stream my personal music collection without the restrictions and limitations imposed by paid music streaming services.

    Thanks to bluetooth, which is NOT high resolution but still sound great to the average listener, high resolution audio will die a swift and painful death. And it can't happen soon enough!

    As stated above, the use of powered "one box" speakers will continue to grow and along with improved DSP this will become the high end audio of the future.

    The integration of various kinds of information about a recording within a music app will continue to improve so that in the future when listening to a given piece of music one will , hopefully, be able to quickly access all of the this information and fully explore the related music. Think hyperlinks but in a musically relevant kind of way. For example when listening to a Miles Davis track, one will easily be able to explore music by any of the musicians playing on the track along with other music from the same time period, all via a few simple clicks.
    Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. & sub
    Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
    Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Energy sub
    Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
    Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
    Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
    Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
    Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
    Last.fm

  4. #4
    Senior Member wortgefecht's Avatar
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    My two cents: binaural recording or similar techniques for audio and video. Not room correction, but "bubbles of sound" or similar immersive systems.

    Gesendet von meinem Nexus 6 mit Tapatalk
    Current setup:
    • EEEBox, Xubuntu 14.04, LMS 7.9, FLAC
    • Duet > Pro-Ject DAC Box E > AKG Hearo 888 Titan (home office), Boom + Canton ASF 75 SC (master bedroom), Boom (master bathroom), 2 Radios (guest bathroom and garden deck), RPi3 + LibreELEC + XSqueeze > Samsung TV > NAD L53 > Mission 2.1 speakers (living room)
    • Transporter > vintage Wega Modul 42V amp (42E equalizer, 42T tape deck + Thorens TD 160 Mk II turntable) > Quadral Vulkan Mk II (music room)

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by ralphpnj View Post
    The integration of various kinds of information about a recording within a music app will continue to improve so that in the future when listening to a given piece of music one will , hopefully, be able to quickly access all of the this information and fully explore the related music. Think hyperlinks but in a musically relevant kind of way. For example when listening to a Miles Davis track, one will easily be able to explore music by any of the musicians playing on the track along with other music from the same time period, all via a few simple clicks.
    This is one of the nice things about Roon (that I've trialed). The UI on an album or song has a tremendous amount of info at your fingertips. I see the atist, composer, etc. It shows me other albums the artist or composer appears on, other artists that have done the same song, etc. Too much to list. And all accessible by clicks. I learn cool stuff. For example, I'm playing the first YES album from 1969, and then it is showing me that the track "I see You" was composed by Crosby and McGuinn and also appears in my library on the Byrds Box set from 1998 (and if I click on this, it takes me to play that track on the Byrds album). None of this is critical to my listening, but the showing of all the various connections in my library is kinda cool.
    Home: VortexBox 4TB (2.4) > LMS 7.9.1 > Transporter, Touch, Boom, Radio (all ethernet)
    Cottage: VBA 3TB (2.4) > LMS 7.9.1 > Touch > Benchmark DAC I, Boom, Radio w/Battery (all ethernet except Radio)
    Office: Win8(64) > LMS 7.9.1 > Squeezelite
    Spares: Transporter, Touch(3), Radio(3), Boom, SB3, CONTROLLER
    Controllers: iPhone6 & iPadAir2 (iPeng & Squeezepad), CONTROLLER, or SqueezePlay 7.8 on Win10(64) laptop
    Files: ripping: dbpoweramp > FLAC; post-rip: mp3tag, PerfectTunes; Streaming: Spotify

  6. #6
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    For example, if I click on the "Miles Ahead" album, it pulls up the basic info and tracks, etc. Then I click on credits and it gives me all sorts of info on who played, etc. My pics don't do a good job of capturing the actual interface, which is full screen, but you get the idea. And you can click on anything (the bass player for example) and it will take me to a list of tracks/albums that that person is also associated with. You can get lost for hours on this stuff!

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    Home: VortexBox 4TB (2.4) > LMS 7.9.1 > Transporter, Touch, Boom, Radio (all ethernet)
    Cottage: VBA 3TB (2.4) > LMS 7.9.1 > Touch > Benchmark DAC I, Boom, Radio w/Battery (all ethernet except Radio)
    Office: Win8(64) > LMS 7.9.1 > Squeezelite
    Spares: Transporter, Touch(3), Radio(3), Boom, SB3, CONTROLLER
    Controllers: iPhone6 & iPadAir2 (iPeng & Squeezepad), CONTROLLER, or SqueezePlay 7.8 on Win10(64) laptop
    Files: ripping: dbpoweramp > FLAC; post-rip: mp3tag, PerfectTunes; Streaming: Spotify

  7. #7
    Senior Member pablolie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garym View Post
    For example, if I click on the "Miles Ahead" album, it pulls up the basic info and tracks, etc. Then I click on credits and it gives me all sorts of info on who played, etc. My pics don't do a good job of capturing the actual interface, which is full screen, but you get the idea. And you can click on anything (the bass player for example) and it will take me to a list of tracks/albums that that person is also associated with. You can get lost for hours on this stuff!
    That is VERY cool. That is a major thing I miss with my library. I spent many hours scanning the album notes so I had as much info as possible, but of course picking the .PDFs is totally outside of LMS - it'd be awesome to be able to get the notes along the active playlist...
    ...pablo
    Server: Virtual Machine (on VMware Workstation 12) running Ubuntu 16.04 + LMS 7.9
    System: SB Touch -optical-> Benchmark DAC2HGC -AnalysisPlus Oval Copper XLR-> NAD M22 Power Amp -AnalysisPlus Black Mesh Oval-> Totem Element Fire
    Other Rooms: 2x SB Boom; 1x SB Radio; 1x SB Classic-> NAD D7050 -> Totem DreamCatcher + Velodyne Minivee Sub
    Computer audio: workstation -USB-> audioengine D1 -> Grado PS500e/Shure 1540

  8. #8
    Senior Member pablolie's Avatar
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    I knew there'd be great replies here.

    I can't agree more about keeping relying on Amazon, iTunes or Spotify as guardians of my music collection. I have bought video on Amazon outright, only to see it disappear when the studio and Amazon have a spat - often permanently. And did Amazon notify me or reimburse me? Of course not.

    Active speakers - indeed. Perfect matching is the key... That's one thing I like about Hypex modules - they provide tight control over a wide range of loudspeakers.
    ...pablo
    Server: Virtual Machine (on VMware Workstation 12) running Ubuntu 16.04 + LMS 7.9
    System: SB Touch -optical-> Benchmark DAC2HGC -AnalysisPlus Oval Copper XLR-> NAD M22 Power Amp -AnalysisPlus Black Mesh Oval-> Totem Element Fire
    Other Rooms: 2x SB Boom; 1x SB Radio; 1x SB Classic-> NAD D7050 -> Totem DreamCatcher + Velodyne Minivee Sub
    Computer audio: workstation -USB-> audioengine D1 -> Grado PS500e/Shure 1540

  9. #9
    Senior Member ralphpnj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garym View Post
    This is one of the nice things about Roon (that I've trialed). The UI on an album or song has a tremendous amount of info at your fingertips. I see the atist, composer, etc. It shows me other albums the artist or composer appears on, other artists that have done the same song, etc. Too much to list. And all accessible by clicks. I learn cool stuff. For example, I'm playing the first YES album from 1969, and then it is showing me that the track "I see You" was composed by Crosby and McGuinn and also appears in my library on the Byrds Box set from 1998 (and if I click on this, it takes me to play that track on the Byrds album). None of this is critical to my listening, but the showing of all the various connections in my library is kinda cool.
    Gary i have a few quick questions about Roon:

    1) How long does Roon take to scan one's music library as compared to LMS?

    2) How much larger is Roon's database as compared to LMS?

    and 3) How responsive is Roon as compared to LMS?
    Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. & sub
    Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
    Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Energy sub
    Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
    Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
    Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
    Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
    Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
    Last.fm

  10. #10
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    On the integration front I can see the benefit of Roon but I'd only ever want it via an iPad app - preferably built in to iPeng - I don't want to have to have a PC on to access the data.
    Pi3 with piCoreplayer music on QNAP TS419p via NFS iThingys/iPeng/Tablets/Jogglers
    Living Room - Joggler & SB3 -> Onkyo TS606 - > Celestion Ditton F20s
    Office - Pi -> Sony TA FE320 -> Celestion F10s / Pi & SB3 -> Onkyo CRN 755 -> Wharfedale Modus Cubes
    Dining Room -> SB Boom Kitchen -> UE Radio (upgraded to SB Radio)
    Bedroom (Bedside) - SB Touch -> Topping TP21 -> AKG Headphones

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