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  1. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulinPosset View Post
    On a service experience note, early days but the live DASH streams do seem very stable and start quickly and the On Demand streams also start quickly and play resumes quickly after a re-position. iplayer Extra also integrating without issues. All in all a very positive experience and looking good for the future!
    There is a feature of BBC DASH live streams I'm scared to consider because I think the UI implications are very involved and would affect all UIs - make it really hard to test.

    For live streams BBC support 2hrs playback - AFAICT playing any live stream can be told to start up to 2hrs earlier. Intended use is "live playback" to say go back 15 mins and listen to somehting again. This feature overlaps with "Listen Again" so I'm not sure whether the effort to implement it is worthwhile as not many people would use it.

    The UI issue is that on LMS the time is usually "live" with an elapsed clock on left or a duration bar where position is indicated. Live Playback would require somehting like a 2hr duration bar but marker always at RHS except when user pushed back.

  2. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpa View Post
    This conversation epitomises why I want to disconnect menu updates /variations from plugin updates. Plugin updates should be for bug fixing, feature enhancements and "protocol" changes. Making it easier to change menu layout/update URLs although it will still require an LMS restart due to caching could reduce postings. User could also create and share different layouts (e.g. UK only, National live and Listen again at top level)

    Re RadioVis icons - I don't pay attention to icons as I mainly play on SB3/Boom. Have the icons changed due to the menu.opml change or due the disabling of RadioVis code ?
    Agree with you entirely that menus/layout should be top level. The icons changed due to the disabling of the code rather than the menu change. It's no big deal and was more tongue in cheek as I happen to prefer those icons but radio is for listening after all!

  3. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpa View Post
    There is a feature of BBC DASH live streams I'm scared to consider because I think the UI implications are very involved and would affect all UIs - make it really hard to test.

    For live streams BBC support 2hrs playback - AFAICT playing any live stream can be told to start up to 2hrs earlier. Intended use is "live playback" to say go back 15 mins and listen to somehting again. This feature overlaps with "Listen Again" so I'm not sure whether the effort to implement it is worthwhile as not many people would use it.

    The UI issue is that on LMS the time is usually "live" with an elapsed clock on left or a duration bar where position is indicated. Live Playback would require somehting like a 2hr duration bar but marker always at RHS except when user pushed back.
    You've let the cat out of the bag now! That's not something I personally use as it doesn't fit my listening habits but have noticed the option on the BBC web iplayer as no doubt have others.

    If you wanted to pursue it I would suggest a 'proof of concept' first that's separate from the 2 current plug-ins? Just my two cents.

  4. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpa View Post

    For live streams BBC support 2hrs playback - AFAICT playing any live stream can be told to start up to 2hrs earlier. Intended use is "live playback" to say go back 15 mins and listen to somehting again.
    The layman that I am, thinks this is really intended as a "missed the start of this live program" feature which has been recently implemented on the web based iPlayers.

    On the freesat and freeview boxes this has always been present as a 2hr buffer.(I guess you already know that)

    Ronnie.

  5. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpa View Post
    There is a feature of BBC DASH live streams I'm scared to consider because I think the UI implications are very involved and would affect all UIs - make it really hard to test.

    For live streams BBC support 2hrs playback - AFAICT playing any live stream can be told to start up to 2hrs earlier. Intended use is "live playback" to say go back 15 mins and listen to somehting again. This feature overlaps with "Listen Again" so I'm not sure whether the effort to implement it is worthwhile as not many people would use it.

    The UI issue is that on LMS the time is usually "live" with an elapsed clock on left or a duration bar where position is indicated. Live Playback would require somehting like a 2hr duration bar but marker always at RHS except when user pushed back.
    Is one very useful use case of this is listen-again before the program has finished? A lot of shows (particularly radio 3 concerts) last a long time, so it is a nuisance if you missed the start and have to wait until it ends and shows up as a listen again url. Since the schedule is known, this could be implemented to look like normal listen again - just that a seek beyond the current time will fail.

  6. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by utgg View Post
    Is one very useful use case of this is listen-again before the program has finished? A lot of shows (particularly radio 3 concerts) last a long time, so it is a nuisance if you missed the start and have to wait until it ends and shows up as a listen again url. Since the schedule is known, this could be implemented to look like normal listen again - just that a seek beyond the current time will fail.
    Only Extra has the "Live" program schedule - so that could be done off the Extras plugin. The use case I considered was the user who just wants to back a few minutes - possibly to repeat a bit of dialogue in a play or book or an interview where the speaker was indistinct o rinterruption due to phone call.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulinPosset View Post
    You've let the cat out of the bag now! That's not something I personally use as it doesn't fit my listening habits but have noticed the option on the BBC web iplayer as no doubt have others.
    It's better to explore the issue now and understand what is involved and the drawback so that when the question is eventually asked there is a considered reponse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Man in a van View Post
    The layman that I am, thinks this is really intended as a "missed the start of this live program" feature which has been recently implemented on the web based iPlayers.

    On the freesat and freeview boxes this has always been present as a 2hr buffer.(I guess you already know that)
    Since I am outside the UK I can't install BBCiPlayer apps and iPlayer is not available on my smart TV or the freesat boxes offer the service as it requires UK IP address. It just looked possible from BBC tech info.

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpa View Post
    It's better to explore the issue now and understand what is involved and the drawback so that when the question is eventually asked there is a considered reponse.
    Apologies if I misunderstood but I thought you were canvassing opinions.

  9. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpa View Post
    Only Extra has the "Live" program schedule - so that could be done off the Extras plugin. The use case I considered was the user who just wants to back a few minutes - possibly to repeat a bit of dialogue in a play or book or an interview where the speaker was indistinct o rinterruption due to phone call.
    The xml feeds that are being used (e.g. http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/availability/radio3.xml) look like they've got schedule information going into the future. I though Triode's code just filtered out those that weren't in the past...

  10. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulinPosset View Post
    Apologies if I misunderstood but I thought you were canvassing opinions.
    I am looking for opinion on how it could be used, whether it really is useful and also whether useful functionality could be implemented within the constraints of the present UI. I only use live playback on TV to replay a few minutes so I'd like to be informed of the real "use cases" for Radio.

    Once the DASH version of the plugin is "released" then this question will appear and I'd like an answer ready roughly one of the following: Can't be done, Not worth doing, Something Soon, Yes but limited.

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