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Philip Meyer
2010-12-30, 09:15
As I recently backed up my music library, I thought I'd have a go at using genpuid to archive fingerprint/puid data.

I thought I'd run it on a single folder to start with as a test, using the following:

genpuid.exe 57aae6071e74345f69143baa210bda87 -m3lib="C:\Documents and Settings\Phil\Application Data\MusicIP\MusicIP Mixer\default.m3lib" -archive -r "M:\Music\Phil's Music\Ambient\Alio Die & Saffron Wood" -logex

This reported:
Songs to be scanned: 3

Unfortunately this seems to have kicked off the archiving process on ALL files (assume the m3lib param therefore overrides the folder I specified).

Anyway, it's been processing my files for some time, and I haven't noticed any issues so far.

I was worried in that I heard that genpuid could cause corruption of some mp3 files with large id3 tag blocks. Any ideas how I can confirm that nothing is corrupted? I can restore any corrupted files from a backup, but how would I know (unless I compare every tag before/after archive analysis, and play every song!)?

Also, what tags would this have written to the files? I notice several tags in mp3 files:

MUSICIP DATA
MUSICMAGIC DATA
MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT

For flac files I have:
ANALYSIS
FINGERPRINT
MUSICIP_DATA
MUSICIP_PUID

All values are different.

I had previous archived some analysis via the MusicIP GUI, perhaps Genpuid and MusicIP write different tags? Are some redundant?

Phil

audiomuze
2010-12-30, 10:47
The -r parameter tells it to recursively processes all subdirs.

audiomuze
2010-12-30, 10:54
I was worried in that I heard that genpuid could cause corruption of some mp3 files with large id3 tag blocks. Any ideas how I can confirm that nothing is corrupted? I can restore any corrupted files from a backup, but how would I know (unless I compare every tag before/after archive analysis, and play every song!)? From memory the problem was that it would truncate tags that had multiple values e.g. genre=Rock\\Acoustic Rock would be rewritten as genre=Rock. I believe this may have been an issue with genpuid < 1.3. I've run genpuid 1.4 (Linux) against mp3 files that include extensive tags and never experienced an issue.

No idea though how you'd check the metadata other than manually loading some files and checking the tags against the backups. If I were you I'd hit Ctrl-C to terminate the analysis and experiment on two or three mp3 albums copied somewhere for this purpose.

FWIW I've just tried genpuid 1.4 (Linux) on an mp3 album including multiple values for a tag. Analysis tags were written and existing tags weren't truncated.

audiomuze
2010-12-30, 11:23
Also, what tags would this have written to the files? I notice several tags in mp3 files:

MUSICIP DATA
MUSICMAGIC DATA
MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT

For flac files I have:
ANALYSIS
FINGERPRINT
MUSICIP_DATA
MUSICIP_PUID

All values are different.

I had previous archived some analysis via the MusicIP GUI, perhaps Genpuid and MusicIP write different tags? Are some redundant?No, different tags are used for mp3 vs FLAC files.

Philip Meyer
2010-12-30, 12:40
>From memory the problem was that it would truncate tags that had
>multiple values e.g. genre=Rock\\Acoustic Rock would be rewritten as
>genre=Rock.
>
That's what I experienced when I tried it in the past (several years back). But when I recently tried to archive analysis within the MusicIP GUI, I tried an mp3 file with multiple genres and artists and there wasn't a problem (maybe since I switched to id3v2.4?).

GenPuid stopped on its own with a message "Terminated" - it didn't give a reason/error mesage. Roughly half of the music library was processed.

I looked in the MusicIP GUI, and ordered by PUID. I see some duplicate PUID's for songs with the same title, but are actually different versions (eg. one version on a compilation and one of the original album, but with different lengths). PUIDs have always worried me, in that they may be used to re-associate stats (if file path changes), but if PUIDs are not unique, the stats will be applied to the wrong file.

I might remove the PUID tags.

So next question, how do I archive analysis without storing PUIDs in the future?

Philip Meyer
2010-12-30, 13:16
>> I had previous archived some analysis via the MusicIP GUI, perhaps
>> Genpuid and MusicIP write different tags? Are some redundant?
>No, different tags are used for mp3 vs FLAC files.

But mp3 files now have MUSICIP DATA and MUSICMAGIC DATA. They have different values. I guess one was stored with MusicIP GUI, and one was stored with Genpuid (not sure what tags each tool generated).

Not sure which one would be re-used if I had to re-import into MusicIP (probably depends on whether I were to use MusiciP headless webUI, MusicIP GUI, or Genpuid), or if there is a difference in the quality of the analysis between the two.

Similarly for FLAC, I have ANALYSIS, FINGERPRINT and MUSICIP_DATA, and MUSICIP_PUID.

audiomuze
2010-12-30, 13:21
PUIDs have always worried me, in that they may be used to re-associate stats (if file path changes), but if PUIDs are not unique, the stats will be applied to the wrong file.

I might remove the PUID tags.

So next question, how do I archive analysis without storing PUIDs in the future?don't think puid's are used as unique identifiers, there's a separate musicbrainz tag for that. From memory there's a parameter you can pass genpuid to inhibit writing of puid's. Can look in morning for you

Philip Meyer
2010-12-30, 15:53
>don't think puid's are used as unique identifiers, there's a separate
>musicbrainz tag for that. From memory there's a parameter you can pass
>genpuid to inhibit writing of puid's. Can look in morning for you
>
I thought PUID stood for Portable Unique IDentifier.

The TrackStat wiki page states: "If you have MusicBrainz tags in your music it will even survive a situation where you have moved or renamed your music files, without MusicBrainz tag only statistics for unmoved files with the same name as before will survive."

I don't know what actual tag this looks for - I think MusicBrainz uses PUIDs?

PUIDs are generated I think dependent on roughly the first 8 mins of music. Fingerprint analysis is from 2 mins of music. Neither seem to be guaranteed to be unique, although PUID's seem to suggest they are unique.

I seem to have ~5000 tracks that do not have unique PUIDs.

Phil

Philip Meyer
2010-12-30, 16:12
I've determined that Archive Analysis within MusicIP GUI stores MUSICMAGIC DATA and MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT within mp3 files. Not sure what the purpose/difference is between those two tags. Another problem seems to be where archive analysis has already occurred - I can't get PUIDs to be updated into the tags.

GenPuid therefore must instead be writing the MUSICIP DATA tag - it doesn't detect when MUSICMAGIC DATA or FINGERPRINT tags already exist, and adds other tags (different tag names containing different values).

Therefore I don't know what benefit there is using genpuid to create MUSICIP DATA or PUID tags (if MusicIP uses MUSICMAGIC DATA tag instead).

I'm confused!

Phil

erland
2010-12-30, 19:12
I thought PUID stood for Portable Unique IDentifier.

The TrackStat wiki page states: "If you have MusicBrainz tags in your music it will even survive a situation where you have moved or renamed your music files, without MusicBrainz tag only statistics for unmoved files with the same name as before will survive."

I don't know what actual tag this looks for - I think MusicBrainz uses PUIDs?

TrackStat uses Musicbrainz Id tags, not PUID's. PUID's are just a way for the Musicbrainz tagging software, for example picard, to find the appropriate Musicbrainz Id more automatically. You need the Musicbrainz tag to get the extra functionality in TrackStat and I think neither MusicIP nor genpuid will write any Musicbrainz tags. To get Musicbrainz id's you need to use puddletag, picard or some other tool that support retrieval of Musicbrainz tags.



PUIDs are generated I think dependent on roughly the first 8 mins of music. Fingerprint analysis is from 2 mins of music. Neither seem to be guaranteed to be unique, although PUID's seem to suggest they are unique.

I believe PUID's are almost but not completely unique. Musicbrainz switched from TRM to PUID in their picard tagger because PUID's were more unique.



I seem to have ~5000 tracks that do not have unique PUIDs.

Sounds like a lot, I've got a feeling something is wrong if this really is different songs.

Just out of interest, are they very similar or are we talking about completely different tracks with a lot of silence in the beginning or some other kind of similarity ?

Are we talking about cuesheets ?

erland
2010-12-30, 20:04
I've determined that Archive Analysis within MusicIP GUI stores MUSICMAGIC DATA and MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT within mp3 files. Not sure what the purpose/difference is between those two tags.

Based on the names, it sounds like MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT is the fingerprint data needed to get a PUID and MUSICMAGIC DATA is the analysis data which MusicIP needs to be able to support smart mixes. I know MusicIP differs between the data needed for PUID detection and the data needed for music analysis. I've got the impression that the music analysis (which is required for smart mixes) is only possible through MusicIP and not through genpuid.

How does the MUSICIP DATA tag contents look like in comparison to MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT AND MUSICMAGIC DATA ?



Another problem seems to be where archive analysis has already occurred - I can't get PUIDs to be updated into the tags.

You mean that you don't have PUID tags and want them to be written ? Why ?

If you already have PUID tags I assume they don't need to be updated because the PUID should be the same as last time.

As far as I've understood, there are only two reasons to have the PUID:
- As an intermediate step get a musicbrainz identifier more automatically using picard or similar tagging tool.
- To get MusicIP analysis from http://www.musicdns.org to speed up MusicIP analysis if you need to do it again and haven't archived analysis to the tags earlier and lost the MusicIP library file.

If you want a unique identity, you want to use Musicbrainz id, the PUID is just an intermediate step to get it automatically. Musicbrainz identiers can be retrieved without a PUID but the lookup will then be based on the album/track titles and you will have to do a manual selection.

As I've understood, MusicIP doesn't require a PUID to do analysis, the PUID is just needed to speed up the analysis by retrieving it from www.musicdns.org instead of analyze the file again.

So if you already have Musicbrainz id tags and archived MusicIP analysis tags, you don't need the PUID.


GenPuid therefore must instead be writing the MUSICIP DATA tag - it doesn't detect when MUSICMAGIC DATA or FINGERPRINT tags already exist, and adds other tags (different tag names containing different values).

Therefore I don't know what benefit there is using genpuid to create MUSICIP DATA or PUID tags (if MusicIP uses MUSICMAGIC DATA tag instead).

I'm confused!

Maybe we are talking about the name change. Maybe MusicIP still uses the old MUSICMAGIC name while genpuid has been updated to use the new name MUSICIP ?
Are you using the latest version of MusicIP ?

I wonder what the Musicbrainz picard tagger uses when it retrieves Musicbrainz identifier, maybe it uses both ?
It has to use the stuff generated by genpuid because that's the reason Musicbrainz provides the genpuid binaries now when AmpliFIND no long does.

The main issue with all this is that MusicIP and genpuid is really no longer supported, the source code is closed, their forum is gone and AmpliFIND don't answer questions from end users, so it's probably going to be hard to get any answers on some of these questions.

What we really need is something that can replace MusicIP/genpuid which is officially supported by someone. It doesn't have to be open source, it's enough if someone supports it. I did some investigation a year ago in the following thread but I haven't really looked at it further since then:
http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=73504

For the automatic retrieval of Musicbrainz identities I know of at least one open source project started earlier this year which looks very promising. I'm not involved in it personally and I don't want to post a link to it here because it's in an early stage and I'm not sure if the developer wants it to be public yet.

audiomuze
2010-12-30, 22:47
>don't think puid's are used as unique identifiers, there's a separate
>musicbrainz tag for that. From memory there's a parameter you can pass
>genpuid to inhibit writing of puid's. Can look in morning for you
>
I thought PUID stood for Portable Unique IDentifier.Ok, the parameter to stop PUID generation is "-nopuid ... bypass the PUID lookup. Useful for just analyzing files."

Correct re meaning of PUID, but it relates to "semantically identical" files - see http://musicbrainz.org/doc/HowPUIDsWork. So I'm guessing for every track you have that has the same PUID, it is in fact the same track, just a different version, length etc?


The TrackStat wiki page states: "If you have MusicBrainz tags in your music it will even survive a situation where you have moved or renamed your music files, without MusicBrainz tag only statistics for unmoved files with the same name as before will survive."

I don't know what actual tag this looks for - I think MusicBrainz uses PUIDs?No idea which tag TrackStat references for its purposes, but I'm guessing it is MusicBrainz Track Id (http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/MusicBrainz_Tag#MusicBrainz_Track_Identifier) as opposed to the MusicIP PUID Identifier (http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/MusicBrainz_Tag#MusicIP_PUID_Identifier).


PUIDs are generated I think dependent on roughly the first 8 mins of music. Fingerprint analysis is from 2 mins of music. Neither seem to be guaranteed to be unique, although PUID's seem to suggest they are unique.There's a clear explanation of the differences between analysis and fingerprinting here (http://musicbrainz.org/doc/HowPUIDsWork#Music_Analysis_vs_Fingerprinting).


I seem to have ~5000 tracks that do not have unique PUIDs.This means the MusicDNS server has not yet generated a PUID for the tracks in question. If you've run the full analysis via genpuid, the analysis result is sent to the server and utlimately a PUID is generated at the server side. Give it a few days, rerun genpuid against the tracks and you'll likely find that the PUID tag has been added. I've certainly seen this happen on my end.

audiomuze
2010-12-30, 23:22
I've got the impression that the music analysis (which is required for smart mixes) is only possible through MusicIP and not through genpuid.I don't think this is correct. I've analysed tens of thousands of files using genpuid only and they mix properly in headless server or MiP GUI.

For the sake of clarity I've taken a single FLAC track, removed all tag data, generated an mp3 version of said track, and analyzed both using genpuid. What follows is the resulting tags added by genpuid.

genpuid's XML file:

<genpuid songs="2" xmlns:mip="http://musicip.com/ns/mip-1.0#">
<track file="Dear Mr. President.mp3" puid="fa1fb49c-45c5-37bc-3be4-6c98b05798f4"></track>
<track file="Dear Mr. President.flac" puid="fa1fb49c-45c5-37bc-3be4-6c98b05798f4"></track>
</genpuid>As can be seen, the PUIDs are the same, i.e. semantically the files are identical, albeit the actual waveform differs.

FLAC file:

$ mutagen-inspect "10 - Dear Mr. President.flac"
-- 10 - Dear Mr. President.flac
- FLAC, 273.89 seconds, 44100 Hz (audio/x-flac)
musicip_data=TWlQAQACAAoAUAEBAQE+B4wNmZzsp4W7vX0vX sWNgpqNGfj7njg0lIol4xakk5SaELqpmI8Zt8+Z7IZsgAHe0LJ c6dC+54Jz0QMDpRlm0kTHAYACgAEABAAVAQAAAAAAAAAEasLZ/wAAAAA=
analysis=MusicMagic DataAQEBAT4HjA2ZnOynhbu9fS9exY2Cmo0Z+PueODSUiiXjFq STlJoQuqmYjxm3z5nshmyAAd7Qslzp0L7ngnPRAwOlGWbSRMcB gAKAAQ==
fingerprint=MusicMagic FingerprintAQXcJ1YoqECVLGol8yjUDRAOexfxEeITnw1bE7c KNwplA/8K6A/CB+0QoQ7GDK8JaweZB/gFagS2BY4FGwM7AoYCNAIMAWIBOgGRAYYBSwFZ/9QGl+qmYhXdzMD6+F//S/Hh9LzwmvGQ/B36Rv0a98n8ufraBnoDofyl/lL8n/vc/Xf8pv6W/h79+f6u/2L/nAARAMgAZABfAE8AXwCiACAApQpUBg7+6FWz1mziBgHRHg4nLu sA5DXpOgOF+ivysvqY9Tnt8fhV6uLuv+939rb6ivgc+l37kPqY +ab9KP3P/lz/T/9t/zb/B/7o/zr/Dv/CsK/F2wJNHNDt5hnqBd0MPhdbDH74oQyzGYEVOAihAlkFlyAnD3cUR A6TENIM5QZ7BpEGiQLRBOAGrwL8AQwAJwATACsAPABvALIAtQC jAY/dBt5gJx0QeUIME9z+V/wF8mgS3efA7lLf0+nBCZ0Asup3063v1OcW6CLwnPV+/Kj6Qfn1/Cv7JPpB/mj/5wBjAD8ArwCjADH/+QCBADP+XO9B+pEZ8QZZKa2aMPVb/+YAYQu+FsTrPQhuDuoBMwX0EmwRQw63ES0Nowc+9dTz2/f8AgUA4AAj/on+Gv6h/kv/ff8y/4j+3f9b/0X/bAsuN4ipyPqRErAIwv8K/UsFyPmM6/YxvCa4/s7+3PzDA6ENxAHL+Wvs4ffQAV74AvqW/k7+l/3J/iD9Lv5D/17+lv6H/p7+6/8P/uH/Ef78JyUYFg==
musicip_puid=fa1fb49c-45c5-37bc-3be4-6c98b05798f4

MP3 file:

$ mutagen-inspect "10 - Dear Mr. President.mp3"
-- 10 - Dear Mr. President.mp3
- MPEG 1 layer 3, 186696 bps, 44100 Hz, 273.89 seconds (audio/mp3)
TXXX=MusicIP Data=TWlQAQABAAoAUAEBAQE+B4wNmZzsp4W7vX0vXsWNgpqNG fj7njg0lIol4xakk5SaELqpmI8Zt8+Z7IZsgAHe0LJc6dC+54J z0QMDpRlm0kTHAYACgAE=
TXXX=MusicIP PUID=fa1fb49c-45c5-37bc-3be4-6c98b05798f4
TXXX=MusicMagic Data=AQEBAT4HjA2ZnOynhbu9fS9exY2Cmo0Z+PueODSUiiXjF qSTlJoQuqmYjxm3z5nshmyAAd7Qslzp0L7ngnPRAwOlGWbSRMc BgAKAAQ==
TLEN=274542
TXXX=MusicMagic Fingerprint=AQXgJ1IolECjLGQl+SjODRIOgRfxEecTow1QE6 wKQAplBAQK5A/CCAAQqQ7JDLoJageUB/oFcAS1BY8FGwM7AoQCMwIJAWEBNwGPAYUBSwFa/+sGbOpSYgXdOcFD+If/OfG19I3ws/Gz/GH6WP0597/8r/r0BtQD5vzZ/qH84vv2/Yn8uP62/h/+Ev67/2X/pwAUAMUAZQBdAE8AYQCeACEArgmOBTz/i1Xa1ZTivQH9HhMnM+rF5CrpsQPW+ljyq/p39TnubPhZ6v3uxe999s/6jPgZ+lL7iPqd+bL9OP3X/ln/S/9s/zr/Bf7s/zn/D/+5sCbGOAI3G8ru4Rl/BfcL9Rb7DOn4ugygGa0VlgjVAnIFxyArD90Uog76ESMM8gZqBo 4GpQLhBP0GygMKARAALgARADUAPABwALIAvACoAZHcvd50J5AQ oUJhEo7+RfwQ8icTC+f97ivf7OnVCYEAseq01AXv3udC6Cnwm/V4/Hn6LPnN/BT7Evo4/kX/2QBkADoAsQClADH/+wB0ADD+Ju+p/AwZdwYQKOuZpvVcABoA4gsPFx/q8QiEDx8AjgX7EpERPg63EUgNrwb19k70KPgfAfUA1QAR/pj+H/6K/j//df87/4X+1/9Y/zr/awtEN6ipBvpsErQJHf6i/RUFkPmw7PIw7yZv/wr/T/1BA7MNvwI9+fXtDvh8Adf3nPo1/k3+u/3H/hP9Kf4u/2j+pf6E/qT+9f8R/tv/Fv8BJyUYFg==

So, for FLAC the following tags are written: analysis, fingerprint, musicip_data, musicip_puid

for MP3 the following tags are written: audiolength, MusicIP Data, MusicIP PUID, MusicMagic Data, MusicMagic Fingerprint

erland
2010-12-30, 23:49
I don't think this is correct. I've analysed tens of thousands of files using genpuid only and they mix properly in headless server or MiP GUI.

You are correct, I think I was thinking of the libofa library and PUID retrieval which picard uses, as described in the link in your previous post this only works if someone has submitted the analysis using MusicIP or genpuid for the same track.



For the sake of clarity I've taken a single FLAC track, removed all tag data, generated an mp3 version of said track, and analyzed both using genpuid. What follows is the resulting tags added by genpuid.

...

So, for FLAC the following tags are written: analysis, fingerprint, musicip_data, musicip_puid

for MP3 the following tags are written: audiolength, MusicIP Data, MusicIP PUID, MusicMagic Data, MusicMagic Fingerprint

In my FLAC files, which have tags generated with MusicIP Archive Analysis, I only have ANALYSIS and FINGERPRINT. So this means that genpuid probably does the same thing as MusicIP archive analysis but on top of this it also writes the MusicIP Data and MusicIP PUID tags.

Do you know what libofa (picard) uses when it requests a PUID from musicdns.org ? Or maybe it always recalculates the fingerprint it uses when requesting a PUID ?

Philip Meyer
2010-12-31, 05:31
>TrackStat uses Musicbrainz Id tags, not PUID's. PUID's are just a way
>for the Musicbrainz tagging software, for example picard, to find the
>appropriate Musicbrainz Id more automatically. You need the Musicbrainz
>tag to get the extra functionality in TrackStat and I think neither
>MusicIP nor genpuid will write any Musicbrainz tags. To get Musicbrainz
>id's you need to use puddletag, picard or some other tool that support
>retrieval of Musicbrainz tags.
>
Thanks. That makes more sense now. Still seems a bit arbitrary to me, in that PUIDs cannot be unique ID's if they are created from n minutes of audio, and having processed my library, I have duplicate PUIDs. However, they are still useful - it has identified some actual duplicates that mean I can trim my music collection down a bit. As long as they will not be used for uniquely identifying content, I'm happy ;-)

>I believe PUID's are almost but not completely unique. Musicbrainz
>switched from TRM to PUID in their picard tagger because PUID's were
>more unique.
>

>> I seem to have ~5000 tracks that do not have unique PUIDs.
>>
>Sounds like a lot, I've got a feeling something is wrong if this really
>is different songs.
>
>Just out of interest, are they very similar or are we talking about
>completely different tracks with a lot of silence in the beginning or
>some other kind of similarity ?
>
That was about 2500 tracks that were duplicated to achieve ~5000 hits. Some of these really are duplicate music content, usually where I have ripped a CD single and also the album, and thus the title track is a duplicate, or where I have ripped compilation albums. This is useful for finding duplicate songs, but often the lengths are different - different mixes, maybe remastered versions, etc; eg. on some compilation albums, tracks are cross-faded into one another, so I can't eliminate the duplicates, and need to treat them as a different unique version of the song. I may even rate the song versions differently.

A lot of hits were very similar, except for a little extra silence padding on the end of tracks, etc.

>Are we talking about cuesheets ?
I don't use cuesheets very much, as songs defined by cuesheets are not mixable, and other software doesn't support cuesheets.

Phil

Philip Meyer
2010-12-31, 06:01
>There's a clear explanation of the differences between analysis and
>fingerprinting '*here*'
>(http://musicbrainz.org/doc/HowPUIDsWork#Music_Analysis_vs_Fingerprinting).
>
I found that last night and had a read. It's still not clear to me exactly what happens though.

i.e. I gather that Audio Fingerprinting is done on up to 2 mins of audio content, and from the fingerprint it can locate a PUID from the server. I see that PUIDs are created from performing Music Analysis on up to 10 mins of audio content, but this is apparently only done on the MusicDNS servers. The MusicDNS servers can't access the actual music data, so is that web page reporting incorrect facts?

>> I seem to have ~5000 tracks that do not have unique PUIDs.
>This means the MusicDNS server has not yet generated a PUID for the
>tracks in question.
>
In MusicIP GUI, I can see that the vast majority of songs in my music library have PUIDs. I have about 180 that don't have PUID's (30 unanalyzable, some analysed by name only, and the others analysed some time ago but still don't have a PUID).

Out of the ones that have got PUIDs, there were ~5000 that were listed via running the "List Duplicates" report (generates a playlist). i.e. different source files in the library that have the same PUID.

Phil

Philip Meyer
2010-12-31, 06:42
>Based on the names, it sounds like MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT is the
>fingerprint data needed to get a PUID and MUSICMAGIC DATA is the
>analysis data which MusicIP needs to be able to support smart mixes. I
>know MusicIP differs between the data needed for PUID detection and the
>data needed for music analysis. I've got the impression that the music
>analysis (which is required for smart mixes) is only possible through
>MusicIP and not through genpuid.
>
>How does the MUSICIP DATA tag contents look like in comparison to
>MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT AND MUSICMAGIC DATA ?
>
>From a song chosen at random from my library, I have id3 tags containing:

MUSICIP DATA = TWlQAQAGAAoAUAEBAGoGDp5swviNNoFauDIcjoABllCAAiIfmv szfoFJwBaAAYABBXWsM4wOxcCAAYLmgAG2OimdB929g4ABsigA egXjgAGqzoACgAEABAAVAQAAAAAAAAQAX0+1/wAAAAAAAgAhAQAAAAAAAAAAX2h2DQAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA ABwATAQADABIHEQATDgcARAWvAAYADwEAAgCqAOcArACHAAUAQ QEAAAAHAABzIwAAAH8AATSWAKMAAAABt3kA/wAAAATuEQB+AAAABd6SAFgAAAAGEAkA4gAAAAghAwC1AAA=

MUSICMAGIC DATA = AgEAagYOnmzC+I02gVq4MhyOgAGWUIACIh+a+zN+gUnAFoABgA EFdawzjA7FwIABguaAAbY6KZ0H3b2DgAGyKAB6BeOAAarOgAKA Aa8T1vKc2IF50iY6c739i5qAT/dmk3I6pIDzwBau0YIq1PSs7J2qu/SAZIQxgAGz3vAb6/a+8YABv+0BbOPbiyqjXIBmgAE=

i.e. one was created by MusicIP, and one created by genpuid. I assume that MusicIP will use only the one it generated, and won't use the one generated by genpuid.

MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT = AQKXHT5CISvTQU4iiiN9ELghVgK5A5kPrAUlCuoJeghLAYEPow FsBHILiAWMB00EXwGRALAAyQOwARADOQHqAXQAqgDaAFQBdQFf ASsBYABd/wjlw9jPydZcW+VR+q7oPB6P/8oA/wGuAOYD1AHi8x0ASg+uABT8Cv6oABT/jACX/9v/+f/6/2v/0/+W/0//7v/8//j/7f/aABb/ogAIAAEAsQx1BoIFpDJW9jkQgQMtk8D+r/6L8/z+ffnj+979V/8k3en/WgEu9zn8f/pK/E//7f/M/8MCdwA0AKoAkQD2AEwAfwAdAM4AtABhANEANP8p3uAdqy51FRT fDZz2C5r7cP9uAIMLG/dk9VoFgw7//78EFf+U/RMCaf/YAmv/ZP3i/2H/iPqY/c75p/nN/eb/Zf7u/1T9Wf66/Ij+0f+iATP7F6SqMkERsSpt/Y0zpv73AZYAQAcQ//8DhAhAE68AswDPAS4HSghjAc4GUAMDAFUAPgBVAMX/7gBT/0sAegA4AC//+QAJAIT/pABkACf/dAXPCqbZTQa1Zy3KNOhO8wH/2f8UACr9i/71/TTwL/+m+1P/evsg+Mr+SPvV/un+1v9t/7f+fv7K/I/8Zf9y/8v/5v+o/vv/2/3UACcAAADSHCLnBENfByX+LfwOsLUSqv8X/EfguP5X+hXzFdh+/oHwXP7S99bpb/v49Xf9Lv84/3n/bgCy/7z/7f/qAGgACQBG//sAWQAU/50ALQAYLCspHQ==


For a flac file:
ANALYSIS = MusicMagic DataAgEAAFhYtcWbic4+hkSh+Fx5gAGBdYpk62ChZkPTg9D6Yo ABgAH6RLWsjTOvFY0UgFSAAQEgjW8UgL9vh7CtRe159LXQZM5v gAKAAaKZno+sN4JI+bM+boUEg1KHWOy8n9RAZYvp9sSUdYp9+c i0LLDtzdmgPIOJiAHr4JglBHm6cYVKt/T0AepPr3TBwIDwgEY=

FINGERPRINT = MusicMagic FingerprintAQdaKMZBMD/nHyYU8xJHEBwSgheVE08TrAzmDr8L+wuaDMcL3AeqCNkQ4xR2E UgMew1BCOIGHATeBHoEIwP2A1ACqQJzAc8B0AHNAe8BQwFG/7zlR2CPuZESOAU095cAoQT86i/3egaJAJ7+AP11+qP5XALH/Un5JPsd+WH4av5c+wH8bP1B/n/+Iv5q/p7+rf8s/r//Kv9P/xf/Kf+N/44HJid51xuvXB5wCwUH1hLiD4USbhr/FQ4SWxDkEAcGiAsVB6wG3gtSFoUfWQ5hDEUHEwiNBRoEqANGA+ MEHwOuAqoCRQHNAYYBxwFcANsBGfNpmlX4awarAuICZgL++ZUE 6hHQBAQDTw7eDPgH2BDkD8sN8Qi6GNcWWRpvJEILYRdHDs0Elg K9AwYC3gMbAqUB8gEwAKAA6ACyAgkBEQDWAnUEW+4TCRsLzRRU CUT6JyEgoo/fIxCv/NAQIOuhEBAnfBgx/JnpKgAQB28J5gn4DTsDCQSDAPYCQQGCAUYBsACx/78AfQDPAH0AsQAkACz+UuFb5fUOKlAOJLUTzBFXFo0H+/5ZBtEHKAP9ARTnhdeEDsUA1vav8x3eBOMp9Cfs3fPy+X79NP1j/pD9fv5P/0j+8P9m/xj/D/7d/6n/qQDYCCH/zAOFQdzV0NMK2U4D+BLL72bJUAQKAxj6nQ4UKegFpf79+YD4sh WZ8S7z1/5I+n4DnP/c/lgAFwEUAjEAuAD8AHcAxwBpAS//7gAhNx8dGA==

MUSICIP_DATA = TWlQAQAGAAoAUAEBAABYWLXFm4nOPoZEofhceYABgXWKZOtgoW ZD04PQ+mKAAYAB+kS1rI0zrxWNFIBUgAEBII1vFIC/b4ewrUXtefS10GTOb4ACgAEABAAVAQAAAAAAAAACRenp/wAAAAAAAgAhAQAAAAAAAAAARWzt+QAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA ABwAbAQAFAAQa3AAHAjsADQCfABYFIwA5AvEABgAPAQACAKoAb QCsAHsABQTZAQAAAJoAAAANAAARAAAAACW/AAAAAAAALgAAAB8AAAA3oLUaAAAAAGkAAAAsAAAAewB+AAAAAA EjAAAAHwAAASwAfgAAAAABgwB+AAAAAAGIbwAAAAAAAaJBAAAA AAABsQAAABkAAAHMSQAAAAAAAexpAAAAAAACQgAAAEYAAAKQPw AAAAAAAu6BfgAAAAADDkcAAAAAAAMZALUAAAAAAz8AABEAAAAD UVIAAAAAAANUWwAjAAAAA1wAAABSAAADzl4AABkAAAPPAAARAA AABBZQAAAAAAAETbUAGgAAAARxAAAAZgAABHdpAAAAAAAEe2wA EQAAAATjAAAAGQAABTpKAAAAAAAFS08AAAAAAAWMAAAALAAABf 0AtQAAAAAF/1AAAB8AAAYd3gAaAAAABm/AtSMAAAAGqgAAEQAAAAbURQAAAAAABuAAAAAzAAAG4UIAAAAAA AdCAAARAAAAB2FTAAAmAAAH60EAAAAAAAgDAAAAGQAACG0AAAA ZAAAI1ZYAGiYAAAlxngAAAAAAClmkAAAAAAAKcQAAEQAAAApyQ gAAAAAACvpgAAAAAAALHwAAABkAAAsn+7U0MwAACzUAxv+SAAA LZQAAABkAAAuMrn4AOQAAC5xhAAAAAAALnkEAAAAAAAuqQQAAA AAAC8aHAAAAAAAMGv8AAIUAAAxkAAAALAAADQpSAAAAAAANWEo AAAAAAA2AQQAaAAAADZI
AAAAsAAAN2EEAAAAAAA6qdAAAAAAADs1uABEAAAAO0gAAACYAA A7XTQAAAAAADysAfgAAAAAPVKQAETMAAA+jAIoR/wAAD7VEAAAfAAAP00QAAAAAABBU+AAAZgAAEfhKAAAAAAAUHwA AGgAAABQgAAAjAAAAFHVNAAAAAAAVpAAAAPIAACdxAOIrAAAAK GMAAIMAAAAp9gAAEQAAAC02AAAAJgAALbgAngAAAAAwMQDGe5k AADItAH4AAAAAOScAngAAAAA74wAAAB8AAECtAH4AAAAAQSsAn u0AAABNTwDiAAAAAGLpAH4AAAAAZMYAfgAAAABohwAAADMAAHb 1AAAAJgAAiMMAxgAAAACOTwCeAAAAAJQXAJ4AAAAAnvAAngAAA ACyiwB+AAAAALYBAAAaAAAAv8EAigAAAADB2gCeAAAAAM56AH4 AAAAA2DoAngAAAADbrgAAgwAAARFAAAAAMwABGB4A4gAAAAFYz wCeAAAAAXjnAAAaAAABkNMAAAAzAAGTBQDiAAAAAavGAABXAAA BrHUAABEAAAG6eQDiAAAAAcT4AJ4AAAAB3m8AAEYAAAKGMgAAI wAAAv3tAAARAAADzawAngAAAAPkEQDGAAAABDggAOIAAAAEsuY AAAAmAATIRACeAAAABQRZAJ4AAAAFDfQAngAAAAUWtQAAEQAAB f8GAJ4AAAAGI3AAABEAAAZI4wAAADMACbAuAAAAmQAJxlIAABo AAAsisgAAVwAAC/GNAIoAAAAZmwAAngAAAFD5cwCeAAAAWErtAJ4AAABamIwAngAA AFyUJgAAAB8AXKfJAAAAMwBcrvcAigAAAFy6BAAAADMAXNOWAA AAJgBc5Z8AAAAfAGX8cAAAAB8AaeEOAAAAOQBr39UAAAAfAHdt 1QAAACYAeI/wAAAAMw==

MUSICIP_PUID = 0076d706-fac3-bd55-073d-b9153a1421eb


Observations from above:
1. MUSICMAGIC DATA tags appear to be much shorter that MUSICIP DATA tags.
2. Flac tag values include "MusicMagic Fingerprint" or "MusicMagic Data" at the start of the value.


I found two different source files sharing the same PUID, that were the same song but different versions. "Good Times Bad Times" by Led Zeppelin. One song was an mp3 rip from Mothership (for my iPod), and another rip was FLAC from "Box Set 2". They have the same length, but different mastering. eg. the Mothership version has a track gain of -10.04, whereas the Box Set 2 track gain is -5.69 (sounds better to me). The DATA tags content are the same in both files, and the FINGERPRINT tag value content is the same.

>You mean that you don't have PUID tags and want them to be written ?
>Why ?
>
I have PUIDs within my m3lib file (I have added the PUID column to the MusicIP GUI display) - most songs have a PUID (99% of my library). However, these PUIDs haven't always been written to the music source files (archive analysis done before PUIDs were discovered from MusicDNS servers, or PUIDs created by genpuid, but weren't written to source files). It now appears that I can't run archive analysis again to force the PUIDs to be stored in the files.

The purpose is that if I move files around, MusicIP has to reperform analysis to determine that it is the same song. If it has the PUID in the source file, it should be a lot quicker.

>As I've understood, MusicIP doesn't require a PUID to do analysis, the
>PUID is just needed to speed up the analysis by retrieving it from
>www.musicdns.org instead of analyze the file again.
>
Ah! FINGERPRINT -> PUID -> DATA. So because I have a MUSICMAGIC (or MUSICIP) DATA tag, it doesn't need the PUID. The PUID could be discovered again from the FINGERPRINT (provided musicdns.org servers remain running).

Or, if the fingerprint is used to get a PUID and stored in a tag, then the MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT tag is then redundant?

Also, maybe the PUID is actually also within the DATA content?

>Maybe we are talking about the name change. Maybe MusicIP still uses
>the old MUSICMAGIC name while genpuid has been updated to use the new
>name MUSICIP ?
>Are you using the latest version of MusicIP ?
>
Yes, 1.9 beta 6, unregistered. Would have registered, but the company disappeared just when I got interested in the product!

So I'm unsure where

Philip Meyer
2010-12-31, 06:54
>So, for FLAC the following tags are written: analysis, fingerprint,
>musicip_data, musicip_puid
>
>for MP3 the following tags are written: audiolength, MusicIP Data,
>MusicIP PUID, MusicMagic Data, MusicMagic Fingerprint

>From your example, it looks similar to mine, in that you have two different analysis tags in a single file (analysis and musicip_data), with different content.

It intruiges me why there are two data/analysis tags with different content in the same file. Perhaps genpuid calculates the fingerprint, it looks up the PUID, and stores these tags, and then when they are scanned into the m3lib file via the MusicIP headless server, it also adds the musicip_data tag?

Philip Meyer
2010-12-31, 07:07
>In my FLAC files, which have tags generated with MusicIP Archive
>Analysis, I only have ANALYSIS and FINGERPRINT.
Do you have PUIDs in the m3lib file (can be seen within the MusicIP GUI if you add the column)?

I guess these are not being stored when running Archvie Analysis. I still don't know what tags are actually required and if others are redundant, but currently I have inconsistencies in what tags have been stored.

Some of these tags contain quite a bit of data, so storing per-file could add a lot of extra storage requirement and fragment the HD.

audiomuze
2011-01-01, 10:30
I gather that Audio Fingerprinting is done on up to 2 mins of audio content, and from the fingerprint it can locate a PUID from the server. I see that PUIDs are created from performing Music Analysis on up to 10 mins of audio content, but this is apparently only done on the MusicDNS servers. The MusicDNS servers can't access the actual music data, so is that web page reporting incorrect facts?I think you've misunderstood. The analysis is done on the client (your) side and the PUID is generated on the server side. Analysis takes up to ten mins per track, not ten mins of audio content.



Out of the ones that have got PUIDs, there were ~5000 that were listed via running the "List Duplicates" report (generates a playlist). i.e. different source files in the library that have the same PUID.Are they different versions of the same track?

audiomuze
2011-01-01, 10:32
In MusicIP GUI, I can see that the vast majority of songs in my music library have PUIDs. I have about 180 that don't have PUID's (30 unanalyzable, some analysed by name only, and the others analysed some time ago but still don't have a PUID).Not sure MiP GUI ever goes back to get the PUID. If you want the PUID's use genpuid.

Philip Meyer
2011-01-01, 12:50
>Analysis takes up to ten mins per track, not ten mins of audio content.
>
That's not what the documentation says:

"Before a PUID is available for MusicBrainz or Picard to use, Music Analysis must have been performed on a track. MusicAnalysis uses up to 10 minutes of the track and examines all sorts of things."

So a closed-source app analyses:
1) the first 2 mins of a track, to generate a fingerprint.
2) the first 10 mins of a track, to generate analysis data.

Something is sent to the MusicDNS server to return a PUID (assume the anaysis data created from (2)). PUIDs are not generated locally, but are generated based on the analysis data?

>> Out of the ones that have got PUIDs, there were ~5000 that were listed
>> via running the "List Duplicates" report (generates a playlist). i.e.
>> different source files in the library that have the same PUID.Are they different versions of the same track?

Actually, I don't think the "List Duplicates" report is using PUIDs, as it seems to be suggesting duplicates on files that don't have PUIDs yet. Maybe it is based on the Analysis data created for each track (or the fingerprint?).

The Duplicates playlist only indicates what tracks it believes may be duplicated - it doesn't say what pair of items are considered duplicates. I was ordering by PUID, so I could see songs that shared the same PUID. These generally were the same song, but often slightly different versions, eg. one maybe from an album, and a repeat of the same song from a CD single. Sometimes these versions had different lengths, sometimes I know they are different edits of the same song (eg. remastered version, remixed, extended, etc).

i.e. a lot of the 2500 songs were legitimate dups, mainly from compilations and album+single rips, but some are not legitimate dups.

Phil

Philip Meyer
2011-01-01, 13:13
>Not sure MiP GUI ever goes back to get the PUID. If you want the PUID's
>use genpuid.
>
Still trying to understand what benefits there are from having/storing PUIDs. I thought they would be used to quickly re-analyse music, should I need to (eg. if m3lib get corrupted).

However, if I archive analysis, this stores Fingerprint and Analysis (mix data), and thus wouldn't need to re-analyse. And if "List Duplicates" doesn't require PUIDs, what other reasons are there for PUIDs.

As genpuid seems to store completely different fingerprint, analysis and PUID tags from MusicIP GUI, there doesn't seem to be much point to genpuid either.

I run MusicIP headless, with Web UI to add new music and analyse, but this doesn't archive analysis data. I thought I'd automate by using genpuid, but it seems that maybe it would still be better to open MusicIP UI to archive analysis from time to time, as genpuid seems to analyse every file referenced in m3lib every time it is run, if I want it to store tags in source files and also update the m3lib file. And it stores duplicate tags, so this is a bit wasteful.

Another curiosity I have is with the SBS Web UI Song > More Info > View Tags display:

MUSICMAGIC DATA: AgEAJ7QTjLKgldiKhEbYjk4UhKeCNoiWDwSnVBgMgAHp9IABlJ opD6tbgAHK9I75hLiAAcVQ8ZTBKoABgAHBaBnY2hamvqjTgAKA AZNEmba/NYMs67NDiJWJgwmDxeY2lwgzxY8q42+DDooP+satcZdjxvePro S9gAHGuLj05wusVICevl35reOapYKyyYFNgvY=

MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT: (756 Bytes)

The MUSICMAGIC DATA tag appears as a long text area box with a scrollbar (quite messy), whereas the MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT only reports the length of the data tag. Maybe there is something special in SBS to ignore reporting fingerprint data, but not the DATA tag?

Phil

erland
2011-01-01, 13:54
Still trying to understand what benefits there are from having/storing PUIDs. I thought they would be used to quickly re-analyse music, should I need to (eg. if m3lib get corrupted).

However, if I archive analysis, this stores Fingerprint and Analysis (mix data), and thus wouldn't need to re-analyse. And if "List Duplicates" doesn't require PUIDs, what other reasons are there for PUIDs.

Probably none.

This page contains some information about a wrapper of the libofa library which is used by third party applications that want to retrieve a PUID from musicdns.org:
http://search.cpan.org/~pepe/Audio-Ofa-Util-0.04/lib/Audio/Ofa/Util.pm

It seems to indicate that the fingerprint might change if you apply lossy compression on a file but you can be sure that the PUID you get from musicdns.org is the same as before.

I think the PUID is just the unique key into the musicdns.org service if you like to retrieve additional metadata later. The plan was probably to use musicdns.org for other things than just a PUID generator.

I'm pretty sure you don't need the PUID for MusicIP.
If you have used picard or similar tool to get Musicbrainz id tags into your files, you should need the PUID for this later on as you already have the musicbrainz id tags which is unique.



Another curiosity I have is with the SBS Web UI Song > More Info > View Tags display:

MUSICMAGIC DATA: AgEAJ7QTjLKgldiKhEbYjk4UhKeCNoiWDwSnVBgMgAHp9IABlJ opD6tbgAHK9I75hLiAAcVQ8ZTBKoABgAHBaBnY2hamvqjTgAKA AZNEmba/NYMs67NDiJWJgwmDxeY2lwgzxY8q42+DDooP+satcZdjxvePro S9gAHGuLj05wusVICevl35reOapYKyyYFNgvY=

MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT: (756 Bytes)

The MUSICMAGIC DATA tag appears as a long text area box with a scrollbar (quite messy), whereas the MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT only reports the length of the data tag. Maybe there is something special in SBS to ignore reporting fingerprint data, but not the DATA tag?

It only displays tags values in this window if they are shorter than 256 characters.

Philip Meyer
2011-01-02, 04:42
>Ok, the parameter to stop PUID generation is "*-nopuid* ... bypass the
>PUID lookup. Useful for just analyzing files."

Had another play test with genpuid today. I now understand that MUSICMAGIC DATA and MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT are generated and stored with the same tag names+values using either genpuid and MusicIP GUI. The difference is that genpuid also stores MUSICIP DATA and MUSICIP PUID tags. Not sure what MUSICIP DATA is - probably as Erland suggested it is something that they were planning to implement on the MusicDNS server, and not related to MusicIP mixer.

If I run genpuid with the -nopuid option, it still stores the MUSICIP PUID tag.
Similarly -noanalysis doesn't prevent the storage of any tags.

cpu
2011-05-23, 23:20
I found that when I use Jaikoz Audio Tagger to retrive AmpliFind ID's I only have MUSICIP PUID stored in tag of FLAC file - no other new tags written.

bookemdano
2011-11-05, 08:40
Hi all,

Sorry to bump a fairly old thread but I wanted to see if anyone else has been having problems with genpuid lately. I recently finished re-ripping my entire CD collection to FLAC, and of course I want to get all the MusicIP magic embedded in the tags so I can enjoy SugarCube. Last year I went through this process on my old mp3 library... as I recall it fingerprinted everything and then the (very) few tracks that didn't have corresponding PUIDs it analyzed at the end.

I ran it two nights ago on a 311 album and it finished very quickly. Looking through the tags I see a MUSICIP_PUID tag for every track, so it seemed to work then.

But so far all day yesterday and today when I run it on an album it fingerprints everything and then after it's done with the last fingerprint I see this entry in the log file:


Error communicating with server (2) : -1

And then it starts analysis. After the first track's analysis is done I see the same error message logged again:


Error communicating with server (2) : -1

and then it proceeds to analyze every single track. In the end no tracks contain the MUSICIP_PUID track but they all contain the ANALYSIS, FINGERPRINT, and MUSICIP_DATA tags.

So can any of you MusicIP gurus (hoping there are a few of you still around) tell me does that error message simply mean the MusicIP server is down? Or is it rejecting my DNS key? I've been using the same DNS key since last year and never had a problem with it but after doing some research I see that Gracenote recently bought out MusicIP/Amplifind/MusicDNS/whatever's assets and is shutting the service down. Does anyone know if that's already happened?

I think it's unlikely that it's totally shut down, because as I said I ran genpuid on a single album two nights ago and every track now has a MUSICIP_PUID tag. Which makes me wonder if they've just disabled my DNS key.

Anyone know the hostname or IP of the MusicIP server? Would anyone mind testing genpuid to see if you get the same "Error communicating with server (2): -1" message in the log?

For the record I am using genpuid 1.4 on windows. I tried using the linux and macos binaries first but in both cases genpuid would hang after a certain amount of time in the analyzing stage.

I know I can complete this process even if MusicIP's servers are down--I'm just wanting to see if people can confirm the service is actually down or if it's rejecting my DNS key.

Oh, and one last question, anyone know if there's any rhyme or reason to the order that genpuid processes tracks? In my log files it seems to pick files in the given folder in totally random order. For instance all my tracks start with a two digit track number, so if genpuid was going alphabetically they'd go in numeric order. Instead I am seeing 12, 10, 04, 03, 07, etc. in the logs.

Thanks for any replies.

Edit: OK this is weird... I just now ran genpuid on Aimee Mann's "Bachelor No. 2" album. After fingerprinting all the tracks it proceeded to analyze all but two of them. When I look at the tags, the two tracks it didn't analyze have a MUSICIP_PUID tag, and the rest don't. That is what I would expect (it only analyzes when it did not retrieve a PUID from the fingerprint), but this entire album should have had PUIDs--it's been out for years and while not wildly popular, it should have definitely had PUIDs for all tracks--if not from some other user then from me when I analyzed my mp3 copy of it from last year.

So to me this either means that the PUID database was lost/massively pruned recently, or they are having server/network issues resulting in most of the submitted fingerprints not making it through to the server. Is anyone else seeing similar behavior?

Nikhil
2011-11-06, 01:37
I can confirm that I too have been having all sorts of weird issues with MusicIP tagging over the past couple of weeks. I'm using the MusicIP GUI on MacOS (tested it on Windows too, and it had the same problems), it seems to have trouble connecting to the MusicIP (amplifind I guess) servers, and appears to hang indefinitely before proceeding for analysis. It seems to get done if I leave it the whole night. I've been hoping that this is not the end of the road for the service.

verypsb
2011-11-06, 02:42
I'm also having troubles with MusicIP. Analyzing takes forever :-(

cparker
2011-11-06, 06:57
I was asked about MIP on my website, I *dont* work for MIP ;) so have no insider information on what is going on, but found the following helped to at least fingerprint music, albeit slowly.

Time for someone to dust off libofa I reckon :)
http://code.google.com/p/musicip-libofa/

*Below is pasted from my forum

There definitely is a problem with the servers. If you run MusicIP its looking for 63.247.65.67 which is music.predixis.com (ports 80 and 10001)

If you put the ip address into a web browser you get like a fingerprint code back :s

What I've managed to do, is to untick the connect to a server settings within the GUI and then also I added a dns entry;

music.predixis.com 127.0.0.1

To drop it to the localhost.

This seems to have done the trick and it is analysing locally now, whereas before it seemed to be hanging all the time :(

Once analysed dont forget to archive analysis into the track!

Be interesting to see what happens, the servers have been down before and came back and its the weekend, so touchwood ;)

cparker
2011-11-06, 07:06
Few other things for info;

MusicIP writes a log file so you can see what is happening, on windows 7 this is here;
c:\users\<USERNAME>\appdata\roaming\musicip\musicip mixer\log.txt

Additionally be mindful of tags that have extraneous information in them, the classic one being; A WWW tag with http:// in it, MIP doesnt like tags with non-alphanumeric chars in it and can hang indefinitely.

Hope this helps give you a fighting chance of fingerprinting successfully.. :)

bookemdano
2011-11-08, 10:07
Thanks for the replies, and thanks especially to cparker for the helpful information. I redirected the MusicIP server to localhost using my hosts file and I noticed as soon as I did that, genpuid no longer worked, simply giving a "MusicDNS servers cannot be reached right now." message and quitting immediately. I am not sure if any of the switches (-nopuid for instance) makes any difference in that regard.

But this sure makes me want to get my library fully tagged before the server goes down for good... unless something can be figured out to make genpuid work even if the server is down.

I know I can use the full MusicIP Mixer to do the analysis (and it sounds like that works even if the server is down/redirected to localhost) but genpuid is just easier because you can just run it against any folder full of files rather than having to create a library first and maintain the cache file.

I didn't have any time the last couple of days to run genpuid but I've run it a few times this morning and I'm still seeing the exact same behavior as Friday and Saturday. I wonder if i't truly a problem on their end or perhaps they have invalidated most/all DNS keys.

If anyone has any further information, please post. In the meantime, I need to run some marathon analysis sessions. Maybe I will split my library up and dedicate several machines to the task!

prabbit
2011-11-08, 11:00
I was noticing that the MusicDNS servers were down about the same time that you posted your message, bookemdano. They appear to be back up now though.

I also added 127.0.0.1 to the proxy entry and things seem to working now. I'm not sure which one fixed the issue, but I was getting messages saying that MusicIP could not connect to the server.

I have my music separated into two directories \flac and \mp3. It was taking ages to fingerprint/analyze the files in \flac. Things are going much quicker in my \mp3 directory. It was so slow in fact (it took three days to analyze about 1000 flac files) that I stopped it. I'm hoping the mp3 directory goes much quicker with the 127.0.0.1 workaround. If it does I'll go back and restart the flac directory.

Can anyone comment on whether mp3s get fingerprinted and analyzed much faster than flacs? Or do the get fingerprinted and analyzed at roughly the same speed?

cparker
2011-11-08, 11:42
As I understand how the process works, it converts the flac or mp3 into a wav file and does the analysis from that. Hence how it can tell the file regardless of what format it is originally.

So I'm not sure if it would make much difference to be honest. From my experience it takes approx 10mins per track to analyse locally based on a standard intel 1.6ghz dual core processor (not the newer core2 duo) but the older type.

If someone had some C++ skills they could maybe look at the libofa thing and make it work with a nvidia gpu ;)

bookemdano
2011-11-08, 13:26
Interesting stuff...

prabbit are you using the MusicIP app/GUI or genpuid? If you could also report what version and platform you're on that would be helpful.

Can you also take a look at the log file cparker mentioned in his post above and look through to see if any of the mp3s (which you say are going quicker than the FLACs) are being analyzed or just fingerprinted? What usually makes this process very quick is that only the fingerprinting stage gets performed. So long as the fingerprint matches to an existing PUID on the MusicIP server then your client just downloads the analysis information rather than running an analysis locally (which is the stage that takes a very long time).

So in the log file you will see entries for a fingerprint being made for each track in the folder(s) you specified. After every track is fingerprinted you will then see an analysis entry for the tracks that did not have a matching fingerprint on the MusicIP server. Can you correlate the log file with your experience--i.e. since you were able to scan mp3s much quicker then your log file for that session should have very few to no "analyzing" entries. Whereas when you did the FLACs you said that it took a long time so the log file from that session should have a lot of analyzing entries.

Hope that makes sense. I am only doing FLAC files and 99% of them so far are being analyzed locally. What's odd is that every now and then one or two tracks (never seen more than that) from an entire album get a matching fingerprint and therefore don't need to be analyzed. But why so few tracks? I remember when I ran genpuid on my entire mp3 collection a little over a year ago hardly anything needed analysis. So either there's an issue with FLAC files or something going on with MusicIP's servers or genpuid is borked (I am using genpuid 1.4 on Windows by the way--the linux and macos binaries were hanging on me constantly).

cparker Perhaps I've misunderstood but I could have sworn I read over at MusicBrainz (wiki or forum--can't remember which) that libofa, while open source, doesn't contain any of the "magic" analysis abilities that MusicIP Mixer and genpuid do. All it's capable of doing is fingerprinting and looking up PUIDs based on those fingerprints. My understanding was it was created for MusicBrainz and similar ventures who were using the PUID database purely to identify music and not for any of the cool mixing abilities.

Like I said, I could be wrong. I'll try to find the link to where I read that.

Edit: Found it: http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/How_PUIDs_Work

audiomuze
2011-11-08, 21:50
Folks, whilst it's come through in this thread I'd just like to reiterate for clarity:

Whether or not musicdns servers remain available does not impact on your ability to perform analysis, it just means you don't benefit from someone else's prior analysis and thus have to actually do the analysis locally - which takes a lot longer than having a fingerprint match using musicdns and subsequently retrieving the analysis data from musicdns.

PUIDs are a thing of the past - you won't be able to get them anymnore unless they already exist on the musicbrainz servers. Regardless, they're meaningless in any context other than metadata retrieval from musicbrainz, and even in that context, they're being replaced by AcousticID whch will serve the same purpose.

The major impact for all of us wanting to continue to analyse new music is that you're no longer able to use genpuid, which is an inconvenience. If I had the know how I'd play around with returning values to genpuid to spoof the server and tell genpuid "the track(s) don't exist, you're going to have to analyse them". That'd be all that's required in order to make genpuid do the analysis locally. In the meantime you have no choice but to resort to localhosting music.predixis.com and having MusicIP Mixer do the analysis and then archiving the analysis results to file (i.e. committing the analysis to tag metadata).

Pain in the ass, but nevertheless, the musicip mixer functionality we all enjoy remains unaffected, albeit getting there is now a little less convenient.

Of course if someone had the nouse/ skills there'd be nothing stopping a community "musicdns" server being borne whereby fingerprints and acoustic analysis results are stored and provided where fingerprints match - again it would require having knowledge of musicdns' protocols and require remapping of music.predixis.com to the ip of the community "musicdns" server.

The part that kills me is that it's likely Gracenote's only motive for acquiring the IP was to kill it and thus prevent a viable competitor from gaining access to a competing technology. I guess that's no different to microsoft & apple's modus operandi.

bookemdano
2011-11-08, 22:56
Yep I understand all of that... I'm just trying to see if I can suss out what the hell is up with MusicIP's servers. They are NOT down (at least not yet). I've been running genpuid all night and genpuid didn't puke like it would do if the server was down (i.e. unreachable).

When I was running genpuid on one album at a time (FLACs) I was seeing quite a few PUIDs show up (matched fingerprints). Only once did all the tracks on an album match but in some other albums I saw 4, 5, and sometimes 6 tracks get PUID tags. So then I ran it on a folder with about 40 albums in it--a couple hours later I looked at the tags and didn't see a single PUID, so every single track got analyzed.

I'm resigned to doing local analysis, and am now just running huge batch jobs and waiting it out--thank goodness genpuid is multithreaded! But the curiosity in me is still wondering what the hell is going on in interaction with the musicip server to cause the odd behavior I've seen over the past few days.

Here's another one for ya. On the few tracks that actually downloaded analysis from the musicip server based on a matching fingerprint, I compared the resulting tags with my old mp3 copy of the same track (which I tagged with genpuid last year). NONE of the MIP tags match, not the fingerprint, analysis, not even the PUID. These are tracks sourced from the exact same CD--just one was ripped a few years ago and compressed to 192kbps mp3 and the other was ripped a month ago and compressed to FLAC. Surely they would both yield a waveform that was similar enough to get the same PUID, no?

It's just weird. That's what makes me think their fingerprint/analysis database got reset or something. Every time I think I understand what the deal is with their server it throws me another curve ball. Has anyone tried packet sniffing the genpuid process to see if anything can be gleaned from that? I wonder if the communications are encrypted or if everything's happening in plain text.

cparker
2011-11-09, 13:29
You could be right about the PUID thing, I didnt really read about libofa in any particular depth as I'll end up getting sidetracked from various other projects ;)
I just saw this and assumed it covered it all;

"Windows Build Instructions

To build LibOFA, you only need LibFFTW. If you want to build the complete example that actually generates a PUID from a .WAV file, you will need to install Expat and LibCURL as well."

Another thought I had was to write a product that would collate every bodies fingerprint tags from their music collections and just stuff these into a database, it would then query the community server like you mention and would update the tags or write a web source for mp3tag, like the Amazon lookup.

Might be worth looking into if MIP goes down permanently, as using Mp3tag or a similar lookup tool would mean the MusicIP GUI could be dropped completely. But then you would need to write a lightweight headless mode but on the plus side, could then engineer out the infamous default.m3lib file...

Or use AcousticIDs and do similar to the above and lookup and match tags from MIP to AcousticIDs...

However are there any smart playlist type products that use these AcousticIDs? I only ever seem to find products that will find duplicate tracks in a collection or music tracking but the missing thing for me is the "You are playing track X and recommend track Y."

http://groups.google.com/group/acoustid/browse_thread/thread/5072ddd6698a9bd3


Just some random thoughts :)

audiomuze
2011-11-09, 17:14
There'd definitely be merit in constructing a community database of analysis results along with a tool to submit to and poll the database - csv or XML would be good target formats for easy import & export. It'd probably only need to have two fields present - fingerprint and analysis. if you wanted to tie it back to musicbrainz then I'd add acousticid to the mix and store that also. If you pursue this I'd be happy to contribute to seeding the db.

audiomuze
2011-11-09, 17:24
The other thing worth checking is whether Wendell Hicken has any interest in participating in an open source MiP replacement development (assuming he's not currently under restraint of trade).

cparker
2011-11-11, 02:52
I couldnt sleep lastnight so spent an hour researching a bit.

Found this for interest; http://whicken.blogspot.com/ start sending Christmas cards ;)

You can download the musicbrainz database for free and it has PUIDs in it. These are just the unique IDs though and NOT the analysis.

I took La Femme d'argent by Air as a test example;

http://musicbrainz.org/recording/864c7424-c9ab-481e-a9c0-ad986e646c67

It has heaps of PUIDs for all the various cuts of it. So you wouldnt necessarily be able to use just a PUID as a match? I had a look inside my version and couldnt see any obvious link up to the PUIDs on the site to the tag in my file, I'm guessing its SHA encrypted? (Guess libofa would answer this?)

Maybe simpler to match up AcoustIDs or MusicBrainz ID (MBID) to try and find a unique match, and then use that to match up and drop the "MUSICMAGIC DATA" and "MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT" tag back to a requesting client?

I'll try Picard and see what IDs it puts for the track and can we compare and see if there is any match at all :)


La Femme d'argent by Air
========================
For this track my MUSICMAGIC DATA tag is;
AgEARzl3qPyvRbEGgVjkHQAwgAGMk4c4AJ6VKk94s9TMs8HVsg faM6xx9fuxYohai1SAAdecxj0qlsmqgGDgkvQsDDirNspUgAKA AZ44rsbBBIOr6M4v/ZjyiNOB0PPdlfpRk6aw1omqbog/7LCsS79GtyCSQ4NigAHeX9eIFxrk54Dy1OMBWfe8owDJTIF/gJ8=

MUSICMAGIC FINGERPRINT is bigger than the data though, I was expecting this to be the other way around, unless the fingerprint is actually the analysis and the data is the fingerprint!;
AQmjLVE3XUM9PIAfVhQCDecOjQy7BwgS+wbdDukJpwMrAqgHiQ JRBdIIrgOnBQsEmwK+Aa0A8AFHAQMA4QDcAM0AlACWAK0AjADL AJUAfABt+MPbt2jVx7j2Jf4uBLEB4glLDDECgAbyAnHs1wDI/xP+8P6nAIgCuwYoAgMAaP2N/dP/0v/wACwAeQB0/+UADQASABQAEQAGAA0AAQAFABAMGVOCG2MOYKnx6CwFTABr/E8BTf5d+h3/ZfO9AI//Bv/A/Aj/TABc+9L/JP4twLX/NwDc/9L/0fwO/9HwPAAR//0ADQAF/wP//f/4//T/wP866jX6iwQM2Kj93QMT+zMI2w1RBuZamwrfRZERHQVwA0wEyQ AwwMELwARzDhgIRQIRAUEAcgBlAG8AiwBJADgAJQA6AEAAIwBP ADUAJwAsBes0GwekgA0mZ/fCAjn5euRy1ory9gEGAZxD7AODAQQAK/T1wKD4VPcK/Pb8JP8SwNf+ZwAP/wD/F/7c/zz/Ov+B/2P/QP9y/zD/X/93/477Q9aZGjkshuYu9bT8hf+l99T3jgPStF4AA0PXFy4DVQAQ9uv/TP0Z+QMD8AFdAjj/z/9lACPwHv+zAGf/7P/8//3/4//f//MAAP/3/wD/5wVHFRXpzNc0wOAT0w91AI0p5VZWGMnYugY3GtAG1ANqA2UXCA NDDX4HSQXcB78FXAL1Ab4BBgFzAUEBKQD1ASYA0QDTAQ4AvwEV AMMArgCiJiQfGA==

audiomuze
2011-11-11, 17:58
As I understand it the PUID only had relevance to enable matching of a song to musicbrainz metadata. Where the finrgerprinting side of things is concerned we should be able to use libofa to generate the fingerprint - which I'm guessing will be the same as the fingerprint already embedded in my tracks.

One way to check would be to run a few tracks (that have previously had analysis archived to tag) through libofa and then to compare the resulting fingerprint. If they're the same we're in business and what we'd proposed about a open musicdns database would work. We'd have to have a toolset for:

- community db to store and host fingerprint and analysis data
- trawling an existing collection and picking up the fingerprint and analysis tags for submission to the community db
- calculating fingerprinting new tracks and checking against the community db - if there's a match, return the analysis tag and write it to the file or to a text file for the user to import via a tagger
- analysis (genpuid and/or musicip mixer) to be used in the event there's no match in the community db.

libofa seems to contain everything needed to do the fingerprint generation - see developer's guide (http://code.google.com/p/musicip-libofa/downloads/detail?name=DevelopersGuide-LibOFA.pdf).

B1tbull
2011-11-16, 11:38
Greetings,

First of all , many thanks to CParker for the wonderful Sugarcube plugin.

Two questions make me worry a bit for the future of MusicIP as a way of generating those mixes.

1. Is the PUID tag a requirement for generating music mixes ?

While most of my FLAC music files got this PUID from running the command line genpuid,
I noticed that recently genpuid was quite randomly missing the generation of PUID's.
Other "magic" numbers ( as described in the first post ) are still being generated.
I assume the PUID is only used to retrieve album/track info from music sources like MusicBrainz - is this correct ?

2. If the backend server(s) ever disappear, will genpuid still be able to generate those other "magic" numbers ?

Thanks in advance for shining some light on this.

audiomuze
2011-11-16, 12:12
Which part of he previous posts didn't answer your concerns?

bookemdano
2011-11-17, 15:46
Good stuff guys. I like the idea of leveraging the existing MusicIP "stuff" as much as possible, but at the same time any future plans should involve AcoustID (since it's open-source we won't ever have to go through this kind of situation again).

In the meantime I am still genpuid'ing away. I am running it in large batches, prior to writing the rest of my track tags, since I don't fully trust genpuid not to mangle existing tags (probably being too paranoid, but I remember reading something or other about some version of MusicIP doing that). What I have found is that if I run genpuid against a single album, it usually finds PUIDs for some number of tracks (oftentimes 1 or 2, but sometimes even more). Whereas if I run it with the -r option against a folder with lots of albums it ends up doing the full analysis on almost every track. Maybe 1 or 2 tracks out of the entire group of 40-100 albums will have a PUID tag.

Makes me wonder if their server is being DDOS'ed (or otherwise overloaded) and they just haven't noticed or don't care. Depending on how genpuid submits fingerprints for PUID-lookup (looks like it's in batches) it seems to get fouled up and just ends up performing local analysis.

Which is all fine and dandy since I have a fast quad-core processor and lots of time. Just interesting.

And if someone ever sets up a third party database I'd be happy to submit data for all my albums (over 700 at this point). I'll keep an eye on this thread. Thanks all.

audiomuze
2011-11-17, 21:27
Whether we like it or not, the musicdns servers should for all intents and purposes be treated as defunct, which means genpuid is also defunct unless we find a way to spoof the musicdns server by returning a value that genpuid interperets as "the track doesn't exist on musicdns, analyse it locally". PUIDs are completely irrelevant where fingerprinting, analysis and playlisting are concerned, there is no need to discuss them further in the context of the purpose of this thread.

bookemdano
2011-11-18, 10:08
Whether we like it or not, the musicdns servers should for all intents and purposes be treated as defunct, which means genpuid is also defunct unless we find a way to spoof the musicdns server by returning a value that genpuid interperets as "the track doesn't exist on musicdns, analyse it locally". PUIDs are completely irrelevant where fingerprinting, analysis and playlisting are concerned, there is no need to discuss them further in the context of the purpose of this thread.

Why do you say genpuid is defunct? It's performing analysis for me just fine. The only time it didn't was when I manually redirected its DNS name to localhost in my hosts file.

I say as long as their server is still in existence (which it most certainly is) there's no reason not to use genpuid. Doesn't mean that people shouldn't plan for the day when genpuid stops working, but as of this very minute genpuid works just fine (for local analysis). One huge benefit (for me anyway) is that genpuid is easily multi-threaded. I don't know if the same is possible with the MusicIP Mixer app.

And I agree that PUIDs are meaningless going forward, since their only benefit was to assist in getting previously run analysis blobs and for matching metadata via MusicBrainz. I only commented on it in the context of trying to figure out what's going on with the MusicIP server. Because for all intents and purposes if a track ends up with a PUID tag, its MusicDNS Fingerprint data was successfully matched on the MusicIP server and therefore its MusicDNS Analysis tag was downloaded and not locally generated. Genpuid is still fetching PUIDs for some tracks, just not very many. I'd be curious to know if people who are using MusicIP Mixer for analysis instead are seeing the same.

audiomuze
2011-11-18, 12:14
You are wrong re PUID's having anything to do with retrieving analysis metadata - this is done by fingerprinting a track and then seeking the fingerprint in the musicdns database - if a match is found the metadata is returned, if not genpuid does analysis locally.

I've tried on multiple occasions now to use genpuid on a directory tree of albums and it takes days only to achieve little to nothing. Whilst it would appear to be analyzing, it never ends and CPU usage shows it's doing little to no analysis.

bookemdano
2011-11-18, 12:21
You are wrong re PUID's having anything to do with retrieving analysis metadata - this is done by fingerprinting a track and then seeking the fingerprint in the musicdns database - if a match is found the metadata is returned, if not genpuid does analysis locally.
What I mean is that seeing a PUID tag added is evidence that genpuid successfully retrieved matched your locally generated fingerprint and retrieved (versus locally generated) the track's analysis tag. I know it's not used to do anything meaningful, but aside from picking through log files, looking to see if a PUID tag was added tells you that the track's analysis was downloaded. That's all.



I've tried on multiple occasions now to use genpuid on a directory tree of albums and it takes days only to achieve little to nothing. Whilst it would appear to be analyzing, it never ends and CPU usage shows it's doing little to no analysis.

That's because you are using the linux and/or MacOS binaries of genpuid. If you check my first post in this thread I reported the same issue. Genpuid on Windows works fine, however. May not be an option for you but it is for others who have a Windows machine at their disposal.

Multithreading is a huge time saver--I have a quad core Xeon chewing through 4 separate instances of genpuid simultaneously.

gbcox
2012-06-02, 11:59
What I mean is that seeing a PUID tag added is evidence that genpuid successfully retrieved matched your locally generated fingerprint and retrieved (versus locally generated) the track's analysis tag. I know it's not used to do anything meaningful, but aside from picking through log files, looking to see if a PUID tag was added tells you that the track's analysis was downloaded. That's all.



That's because you are using the linux and/or MacOS binaries of genpuid. If you check my first post in this thread I reported the same issue. Genpuid on Windows works fine, however. May not be an option for you but it is for others who have a Windows machine at their disposal.

Multithreading is a huge time saver--I have a quad core Xeon chewing through 4 separate instances of genpuid simultaneously.

I've just started with SugarCube and am going through the process to analyze my library. I've read through many threads and FAQs and I'm still confused about how all this works... ;-)

I'm on F17 and as far as I can tell genpuid, mmserver and mmmixer all work, but there seems to be some incompatibility between genpuid and mmserver/mmmixer. If I generate a cache file with mmserver/mmmixer it can be read by genpuid for the validation process. After genpuid does the validation the revised cache file is not recognized by mmserver/mmmixer. It gives me a message saying that the cache file was created by a newer release of musicip. From that I gather that mmserver/mmmixer (version 1.8) is somehow older than genpuid (version 1.4).

If I try to run genpuid without first creating the cache file from mmserver/mmmixer it does work, but if you have a really large library forget it. That is probably the behavior some of you have been reporting in this thread. I tested this theory out by running against just one album versus my entire collection. So, for what ever reason, it appears if you want to run genpuid against a large collection the best way to use genpuid is to first create the cache file (without doing the validation process) with mmserver/mmmixer. Keep in mind though that once the validation is done by genpuid it doesn't appear you can use that cache file with mmserver/mmmixer. The workaround I'm guessing is to use the -archive function to write the analysis/fingerprint to the music file tags. I did another small test and mmserver/mmmixer do recognize the tags which are created by genpuid. You can then just create a new cache file from the files processed by genpuid with mmserver/mmmixer.

What I found that seems to work the best for me is to run two instances of genpuid against subsets of my collection and store the tags to the files. For this initial run through, I'm not keeping a cache file. I'll generate that once everything is tagged. The command I'm using is: ./genpuid dns_key -r -logex -archive .

I then modified a short script I found in another FAQ by Izzy to deal with multiple genpuid processes:

#!/bin/bash
# Supervisor script for genpuid service (c) by Izzy
################################################## ############################

#================================================= ========[ Configuration ]===
INTERVAL=5 # How many seconds to sleep between checks
NICE=10 # Nice level - only positive values 0..20
SERVER="mipcore" # Name of the executable
LOGFILE="watch.log" # Where to log the progress
VERBOSE=1 # Generate visual output? 0|1

#================================================= =======[ Initialization ]===
# Make us nicer
renice $NICE $$ >/dev/null

# Initialize vars:
ANA1=0
FP1=0
MPID1=0

#================================================= ==[ Run the supervisor ]===
while [ 1 -eq 1 ]; do
ANAL=`cat log.txt |grep Analyzed|wc -l`
FP=`cat log.txt |grep Fingerprinted|wc -l`
if [ $FP1 -eq $FP -a $ANA1 -eq $ANAL ]; then
:
else
[ $VERBOSE -eq 1 ] && echo "`date +%F` `date +%X` Fingerprinted: ${FP} Analyzed: ${ANAL}"
echo "`date +%F` `date +%X` Fingerprinted: ${FP} Analyzed: ${ANAL}">>$LOGFILE
ANA1=$ANAL
FP1=$FP
fi
MPID=`pidof $SERVER`
for PID in $MPID
do
PIDOUT=`ps --noheader -l -p $PID`
set -- junk $PIDOUT
shift
NL=$8
if [ "$NL" != "$NICE" ]; then
renice $NICE $PID >/dev/null
else
:
fi
done
sleep $INTERVAL
done

Seems a bit convoluted, but so far it appears to be working - but I've yet to get to the stage where I can run all this with SugarCube. Very few files are being found (which I find hard to believe, but whatever.) so it's doing analysis locally, which takes about 3 minutes a track, so it is going to take a long time to finish this. My concern of course is that whatever is being generated by genpuid is actually correct. I've backed up my entire library so I can restore just in case this becomes a fiasco.

If anyone disagrees with what I have observed, please let me know.

Is there a way I can somehow check the tags that are being created to ensure they are correct? I see that they are being added to tracks, but have no idea if they are correct or not. That has probably already been discussed somewhere but I haven't been able to find it yet.

I did find a way to validate the PUID information in the tag file. I used the puddletag program to display the tag information, then used this URL to check if the PUID was known:

http://musicbrainz.org/ws/1/track/?type=xml&inc=release-rels&puid=

Just put the PUID after the =

So far, every PUID appears valid. I did find a new album which just came out didn't have a PUID tag - which I would expect.

Any other ideas on how to validate these files are being tagged correctly? Thanks!

sander
2012-07-29, 10:21
Hey just came across this thread, have you made any progress on this in the past month?

My set up:
I have had an old Squeeze 7.3.4 with MIP 1.8 headless running for a couple of years now, but unfortunately I have to wipe my Readynas where everything lives so I've been struggling for a couple months trying to come up with another MusicIP scenario which works as well.
I was going to run a Windows VM so I could use the 1.9 beta and use some of the recipe/moods stuff. I tried a Windows 7 VM, but for some reason the MIP GUI just goes away after a while and connecting to the mapped drive was flakey which caused the library to erase itself from time to time. Also I ran into the issue where headless and GUI have updating compatibilities.
I'm going to try a Windows XP vm (xp seems to hold drive letter mappings better and maybe there other compatibility issues with MusicIP given its age), but I'm open to other scenarios.
In the interim I've been trying an Ubuntu 10.04 server which was running fine for a while, but stopped scanning a while back with the following errors:
Sat Jul 28 11:58:34 2012
[0:00] Fingerprint failed (mis-execution): 01 - Emotions.mp3
Invalid registration key.
I'm trying the genpuid approach, but like you I can't get headless to read it.

General questions:
Has anyone gotten genpuid to interact with any of the Linux or Windows builds of the full server or is it only useful for archiving tags?

How absolute are MusicIP fingerprints? I have never archived my files because I have had different results with different MusicIP servers using the same settings. In my working config there are certain albums where the resulting mix is always other songs from the same album. However I cleaned up the tags on some of these files a while back then rescanned with another server using the same settings and I get normal mixes.

TIA

sander
2012-09-10, 20:34
Answering my own question after some deeper searching and experimentation:

Genpuid can write to the database without archiving if its the same version as the database. If you're running MusicIP 1.9b on Windows it's really the best way to go. Unfortunately the generally available Linux genpuid (1.4) is incompatible with the last version for Linux (1.8). I was able to find the 1.2 version of genpuid for Linux, but it is incompatible with the 1.4 anonymous keys so it won't scan.

Under windows I was able to run the following batch file which made short work of analyzing files without archiving tags and maintaining full compatibility with the GUI and headless web versions.

genpuid 57aae6071e74345f69143baa210bda87 -data -logex -print -r -threads=4 -m3lib="C:\Documents and Settings\xxx\Application Data\MusicIP\MusicIP Mixer\default.m3lib" "x:\Music"

This maybe redundant for many, but hopefully it will help someone. And if anyone knows how to get genpuid 1.2 to run under linux in the same way it would be much appreciated.