smac770
2008-01-31, 08:49
So I was looking around on NewEgg for something and saw this VIA C7 barebone by MSI on it. Looked good, price was good, to the point that I didn't care that it would take years to recoup the cost from any power savings "ROI". I just wanted to try it out. If anything, it would be quieter than the screamer Kingwin Night Hawk USB enclosure. Just add memory stick and hard drive and go.
A point to keep in mind for my setup. My SB3 is set up to show me the time, weather, stocks, etc. I have it running 24x7, so my Slim server can not go into sleep or standby. It's always in S0 or running, though pretty much idle most of the time.
There are no doubt other solutions that might seem less hassle, particularly when used in a WOL setup. But that won't fly for me.
--------------------------------------------
The shopping
The AXIS 700 Lite, Corsair ValueSelect memory stick, and WD Caviar GP hard drive were $323 delivered from NewEgg.
I thought about just upgrading the internal hard drive in the laptop, but it uses ATA, and the only 2.5" ATA drive >200GB is the WD 250GB. For $140.
Then I thought about the VIA Artigo pico-ITX DIY kit, then I could get a 2.5" 320GB SATA drive. But that was $180, and the online info seemed to imply only an ATA drive can go into the internal 2.5" bay. It says "includes SATA ports which you can hook up an external drive", or to that point. Hmmm.
Then I saw "5400-7200 rpm 3.5", so figured I'd see what that was about. Apparently WD has some new rpm throttling drives. Starting at 500GB. For only $105. Now we're getting back to reasonable $/GB. The idle W was half that of my 400GB Samsung, but still more than the active W of a 2.5". Oh well.
Memory was easy. $13 for 512MB or $20 for 1GB. Ok, sure why not. My testing showed the extra 512MB is useless in a box devoted to serving audio. But it's $7. Big deal.
"$20 for a gig" Wow! Sure, it's DDR2-533 CL4, but I looked, and even 2x1GB DDR2-800 CL4, $34 after rebate! And that's not no name. Corsair TwinX. The same in DDR3-1066, almost $300. WTF!
I checked out www.logicsupply.com, which seems the best resource for US buying from the basic looking around that I did. That had some options, but the price on the AXIS 700, I could get the system and half a TB for the same price as just the Artigo kit.
--------------------------------------------
The setups
*** Compaq N610c laptop configuration:
> Processor - Pentium 4 Mobile, 1.8GHz, can speedstep down to 1.2GHz, Northwood B0 core, .13um, 100MHz QDR FSB, SSE & SSE2
> Chipset - Intel i845MP north and ICH3-M south
> Memory - two 256MB DDR-266 CL2.5
> Video - on-board ATI Mobility Radeon 7500 to built-in LCD screen
> Network - D-Link DWL-G650M wireless-G PC Card
> Internal Storage - Fujitsu MHT2040AT, 2.5", 4200rpm, ATA100, 40GB and some slim DVD/CD-RW combo drive (typical laptop unit)
> External Storage - Samsung SpinPoint T HD400LJ, 3.5", 7200rpm, SATA 3Gbps, 400GB, in Kingwin Night Hawk TL-35USBS enclosure connected by USB 2.0
> Power - 90W power brick for laptop docking station (laptop alone brick is 65W) & 35W power brick for USB enclosure
> Keyboard/Mouse - integrated
> Operating System - Windows XP SP2
*** MSI AXIS 700 Lite mini-ITX configuration:
> Processor - VIA C7, 1.0GHz fanless, Esther C5J core, 90nm, 100MHz QDR FSB, SSE & SSE2 & SSE3
> Chipset - VIA CN700 north and VT8237R+ south (MSI MS-7199 motherboard)
> Memory - one 1024MB DDR2-533 CL4
> Video - integrated S3 Unichrome Pro to VGA output
> Network - on-board VIA 10/100 Ethernet
> Internal Storage - Western Digital Caviar GP WD5000AACS, 3.5", 5400-7200rpm, SATA 3Gbps, 500GB
> Power - FSP200-50MB 200w power active PFC power supply
> Keyboard/mouse - PS/2 connected
> Operating system - Windows XP SP2
The building of the AXIS system was pretty good. The hardware is nice, I think the chassis is very solid. It's tight, but you don't really have much to do in there. The one negative was no way could I get the connectors on a SATA drive with that big plastic power cable holder where it was. Some side cutters and that was done with.
The driver CD for MSI was great. Very straight-forward, had all the latest driver versions on it. Between that and my MSI X1900XTX, I've come to really like the solidness of "what's in the box" from MSI.
The MSI-7199 has some nice monitoring capabilities. The CPU temp tends to be mid-upper 30's C, while the hard drive tends to be 32 C, maybe 33C during streaming.
There's even a three pin sysfan header for adding another fan and monitoring it. All in all, seems a very nice package.
Not really relevant here, but I found the VIA Vinyl Audio utility to be quite nice. The stereo in/stereo out/mic in can be configured as 2ch, 4ch, or 6ch output. With a fanned 1.8GHz or 2.0GHz and the built in hardware decoding of the newer VIA chipsets, could make a really nice HTPC or PVR too.
--------------------------------------------
The showdown
The power numbers (W - watts, VA - volt amps, PF - power factor) were read off my Kill-A-Watt meter (very cool toy). The CPU numbers were read from Task Manager. To keep the LCD backlight out of the picture, I used remote desktop to the laptop for those numbers. I just used a CRT monitor for the AXIS. The monitor was not plugged to the Kill-A-Watt. What would be the point. A monitor will not normally be there.
.82-.87 PF => "the power factor varied between .82 and .87"
Idling:
N610c & Kingwin - 1-4 %CPU, 29-31 W, 37 VA, .85-.87 PF
AXIS 700 Lite - 2-4 %CPU, 22-24 W, 26-30 VA, .82-.87 PF
Streaming audio to SB3 (source are WAV files):
N610c & Kingwin - 7-15 %CPU, 31-32 W, 37-39 VA, .83-.85 PF
AXIS 700 Lite - 8-18 %CPU, 25 W, 29 VA, .84 PF
Song change:
N610c & Kingwin - spikes to 40-50 %CPU & 40-50 W
AXIS 700 Lite - spikes to 100 %CPU & 29 W
What is with the massive CPU spike at the start of a new song? Once the compressed song is finished being sent to the SB3's buffers, the systems drop to idle numbers, and then a huge CPU spike as the next song starts.
The AXIS 700 Lite would just tap 100% (think of an Empire State Building looking spike, 5 seconds wide, with the tip at 100 % CPU) and I never noticed any delay in the song starting. If I was back at the remote, as soon as I hit play, song was going.
Library rescan:
I never bothered to really look at the performance numbers of the N610c. I would just say rescan if I had added new media and then left.
I was curious though how the AXIS would do though. It took about 5 minutes to scan my 2700 songs/files (~110GB). During that time, the CPU was pretty much 90-100% the whole time. The power numbers were 29 W, 33 VA, .87 PF.
The AXIS only has 100Mbps. Transferring that 110GB took about three hours. There are ITX boards with Gigabit, but I guess how often am I going to transfer 100GB?
The transfer did regularly show right around 10MB/s per DuMeter on the source box. CPU usage was 15-30%, and the wattage was the typical 29W.
With the above hardware config, the AXIS never goes above 29W. I had a HP 4x CD-RW to load XP with. Never above 29W. I replaced it with a Sony DVD drive at one point, and with that spinning, I was reading 41W. Wow!
I plan to just plug up a USB optical drive when necessary. The BIOS even points out USB optical as one of the boot source options.
--------------------------------------------
The bottom line
So I go and get breakfast, come back, start some music, figure, hey let's go see what the meter shows. Since I'm not logged in, the monitor is back in the bedroom, etc. Showing 21W when not playing and 23W playing. Only getting better.
I even did some web browsing and saved some screen caps to see if I got any audio drop outs. Nothing. All good.
So overall I'm extremely pleased with the quality of the products and happy that it turned out to be an improvement. Quite an improvement at that. A 25-30% drop in power usage. Not that it really means anything financially.
The real improvement is the noise. The Kingwin has a 40mm fan that was a screamer. The AXIS is far from silent (it's hard to tell with two other computers also running here in the room), but it's quiet enough that you won't here it from the couch even during quiet audio.
So I think I'll put it into the living room setup. Then I can use it as a remote access system to control my Meridian setup when I'm here in the office working (RDP to the AXIS, run the Meridian soft remote program, which talks RS-232 to the HT gear) and want to change the volume or the station.
A point to keep in mind for my setup. My SB3 is set up to show me the time, weather, stocks, etc. I have it running 24x7, so my Slim server can not go into sleep or standby. It's always in S0 or running, though pretty much idle most of the time.
There are no doubt other solutions that might seem less hassle, particularly when used in a WOL setup. But that won't fly for me.
--------------------------------------------
The shopping
The AXIS 700 Lite, Corsair ValueSelect memory stick, and WD Caviar GP hard drive were $323 delivered from NewEgg.
I thought about just upgrading the internal hard drive in the laptop, but it uses ATA, and the only 2.5" ATA drive >200GB is the WD 250GB. For $140.
Then I thought about the VIA Artigo pico-ITX DIY kit, then I could get a 2.5" 320GB SATA drive. But that was $180, and the online info seemed to imply only an ATA drive can go into the internal 2.5" bay. It says "includes SATA ports which you can hook up an external drive", or to that point. Hmmm.
Then I saw "5400-7200 rpm 3.5", so figured I'd see what that was about. Apparently WD has some new rpm throttling drives. Starting at 500GB. For only $105. Now we're getting back to reasonable $/GB. The idle W was half that of my 400GB Samsung, but still more than the active W of a 2.5". Oh well.
Memory was easy. $13 for 512MB or $20 for 1GB. Ok, sure why not. My testing showed the extra 512MB is useless in a box devoted to serving audio. But it's $7. Big deal.
"$20 for a gig" Wow! Sure, it's DDR2-533 CL4, but I looked, and even 2x1GB DDR2-800 CL4, $34 after rebate! And that's not no name. Corsair TwinX. The same in DDR3-1066, almost $300. WTF!
I checked out www.logicsupply.com, which seems the best resource for US buying from the basic looking around that I did. That had some options, but the price on the AXIS 700, I could get the system and half a TB for the same price as just the Artigo kit.
--------------------------------------------
The setups
*** Compaq N610c laptop configuration:
> Processor - Pentium 4 Mobile, 1.8GHz, can speedstep down to 1.2GHz, Northwood B0 core, .13um, 100MHz QDR FSB, SSE & SSE2
> Chipset - Intel i845MP north and ICH3-M south
> Memory - two 256MB DDR-266 CL2.5
> Video - on-board ATI Mobility Radeon 7500 to built-in LCD screen
> Network - D-Link DWL-G650M wireless-G PC Card
> Internal Storage - Fujitsu MHT2040AT, 2.5", 4200rpm, ATA100, 40GB and some slim DVD/CD-RW combo drive (typical laptop unit)
> External Storage - Samsung SpinPoint T HD400LJ, 3.5", 7200rpm, SATA 3Gbps, 400GB, in Kingwin Night Hawk TL-35USBS enclosure connected by USB 2.0
> Power - 90W power brick for laptop docking station (laptop alone brick is 65W) & 35W power brick for USB enclosure
> Keyboard/Mouse - integrated
> Operating System - Windows XP SP2
*** MSI AXIS 700 Lite mini-ITX configuration:
> Processor - VIA C7, 1.0GHz fanless, Esther C5J core, 90nm, 100MHz QDR FSB, SSE & SSE2 & SSE3
> Chipset - VIA CN700 north and VT8237R+ south (MSI MS-7199 motherboard)
> Memory - one 1024MB DDR2-533 CL4
> Video - integrated S3 Unichrome Pro to VGA output
> Network - on-board VIA 10/100 Ethernet
> Internal Storage - Western Digital Caviar GP WD5000AACS, 3.5", 5400-7200rpm, SATA 3Gbps, 500GB
> Power - FSP200-50MB 200w power active PFC power supply
> Keyboard/mouse - PS/2 connected
> Operating system - Windows XP SP2
The building of the AXIS system was pretty good. The hardware is nice, I think the chassis is very solid. It's tight, but you don't really have much to do in there. The one negative was no way could I get the connectors on a SATA drive with that big plastic power cable holder where it was. Some side cutters and that was done with.
The driver CD for MSI was great. Very straight-forward, had all the latest driver versions on it. Between that and my MSI X1900XTX, I've come to really like the solidness of "what's in the box" from MSI.
The MSI-7199 has some nice monitoring capabilities. The CPU temp tends to be mid-upper 30's C, while the hard drive tends to be 32 C, maybe 33C during streaming.
There's even a three pin sysfan header for adding another fan and monitoring it. All in all, seems a very nice package.
Not really relevant here, but I found the VIA Vinyl Audio utility to be quite nice. The stereo in/stereo out/mic in can be configured as 2ch, 4ch, or 6ch output. With a fanned 1.8GHz or 2.0GHz and the built in hardware decoding of the newer VIA chipsets, could make a really nice HTPC or PVR too.
--------------------------------------------
The showdown
The power numbers (W - watts, VA - volt amps, PF - power factor) were read off my Kill-A-Watt meter (very cool toy). The CPU numbers were read from Task Manager. To keep the LCD backlight out of the picture, I used remote desktop to the laptop for those numbers. I just used a CRT monitor for the AXIS. The monitor was not plugged to the Kill-A-Watt. What would be the point. A monitor will not normally be there.
.82-.87 PF => "the power factor varied between .82 and .87"
Idling:
N610c & Kingwin - 1-4 %CPU, 29-31 W, 37 VA, .85-.87 PF
AXIS 700 Lite - 2-4 %CPU, 22-24 W, 26-30 VA, .82-.87 PF
Streaming audio to SB3 (source are WAV files):
N610c & Kingwin - 7-15 %CPU, 31-32 W, 37-39 VA, .83-.85 PF
AXIS 700 Lite - 8-18 %CPU, 25 W, 29 VA, .84 PF
Song change:
N610c & Kingwin - spikes to 40-50 %CPU & 40-50 W
AXIS 700 Lite - spikes to 100 %CPU & 29 W
What is with the massive CPU spike at the start of a new song? Once the compressed song is finished being sent to the SB3's buffers, the systems drop to idle numbers, and then a huge CPU spike as the next song starts.
The AXIS 700 Lite would just tap 100% (think of an Empire State Building looking spike, 5 seconds wide, with the tip at 100 % CPU) and I never noticed any delay in the song starting. If I was back at the remote, as soon as I hit play, song was going.
Library rescan:
I never bothered to really look at the performance numbers of the N610c. I would just say rescan if I had added new media and then left.
I was curious though how the AXIS would do though. It took about 5 minutes to scan my 2700 songs/files (~110GB). During that time, the CPU was pretty much 90-100% the whole time. The power numbers were 29 W, 33 VA, .87 PF.
The AXIS only has 100Mbps. Transferring that 110GB took about three hours. There are ITX boards with Gigabit, but I guess how often am I going to transfer 100GB?
The transfer did regularly show right around 10MB/s per DuMeter on the source box. CPU usage was 15-30%, and the wattage was the typical 29W.
With the above hardware config, the AXIS never goes above 29W. I had a HP 4x CD-RW to load XP with. Never above 29W. I replaced it with a Sony DVD drive at one point, and with that spinning, I was reading 41W. Wow!
I plan to just plug up a USB optical drive when necessary. The BIOS even points out USB optical as one of the boot source options.
--------------------------------------------
The bottom line
So I go and get breakfast, come back, start some music, figure, hey let's go see what the meter shows. Since I'm not logged in, the monitor is back in the bedroom, etc. Showing 21W when not playing and 23W playing. Only getting better.
I even did some web browsing and saved some screen caps to see if I got any audio drop outs. Nothing. All good.
So overall I'm extremely pleased with the quality of the products and happy that it turned out to be an improvement. Quite an improvement at that. A 25-30% drop in power usage. Not that it really means anything financially.
The real improvement is the noise. The Kingwin has a 40mm fan that was a screamer. The AXIS is far from silent (it's hard to tell with two other computers also running here in the room), but it's quiet enough that you won't here it from the couch even during quiet audio.
So I think I'll put it into the living room setup. Then I can use it as a remote access system to control my Meridian setup when I'm here in the office working (RDP to the AXIS, run the Meridian soft remote program, which talks RS-232 to the HT gear) and want to change the volume or the station.